Cricket

[TheGayTent]

Oh look at you talking cricket finally....

I'm still waiting for you to start.

[Osama Jim Laden]

South Africa are strong for a start. It also suggests we might of struggled to be number 1 if others where stronger... Which of course is catch 22...

We where number 1 and we earned it. I don't think its fair to do that down in any way.

Yes we earned it, we beat everyone necessary to do so.. That I'm not disputing, however, an aging Indian side & a depleted Aussie side were our 'biggest' tests, the standard nowadays is nowhere near what it was in the 90's-mid/late 00's.. Only England, Australia & SA are interested in test cricket now, the money is in the shortened versions..

This is why we got to no.1, we earned it yes, did we need to really work that hard, no..

SA battered us, Aussies could do the same but I'm holding out saying so for now out of hope.. That and we do have some good cricketers..

Cooks tactics down under were amassing scoring runs cautiously as England could take 20wkts which Aussies couldn't (Perth aside).. That worked well..

Look at the results from this summer again and it'll become plain to see it wasn't a 3-0 series..

Cook doesn't have the tactics.. Why not bowl Root, Bell, Pieterson even Carberry if the others had no joy? Granted, not full time bowlers but maybe that's what it needed, maybe not but there were options and as for his field placings, far too defensive..

The series isn't over (as some morons are saying) but Flower & co have some work to do

[TheGayTent]

The series isn't over (as some morons are saying) but Flower & co have some work to do

True.

Though it as good as will be if England don't make 371 tomorrow.

[kaosmark2]

Cook doesn't have the tactics.. Why not bowl Root, Bell, Pieterson even Carberry if the others had no joy? Granted, not full time bowlers but maybe that's what it needed, maybe not but there were options and as for his field placings, far too defensive..

The series isn't over (as some morons are saying) but Flower & co have some work to do

Completely agree.

There were a couple of times where a ball went to where slips would have been. Including once for Harris. I can't understand not having a single slip in at any time when a tail-ender is batting, however big the lead is already. Wickets are the best way of stopping batsmen scoring.

[Osama Jim Laden]

Completely agree.

There were a couple of times where a ball went to where slips would have been. Including once for Harris. I can't understand not having a single slip in at any time when a tail-ender is batting, however big the lead is already. Wickets are the best way of stopping batsmen scoring.

Even the pressure of having a slip/2 slips in.. Get the batsmen thinking a bit, make sure he's got a niggle in his brain saying 'if I don't get this right, I'm out'.. Pressure adds pressure, it was too easy for Aus, that's down to three things, bad field settings, poor bowling and Clarke being a genius.. He ripped us to shreds in that opening session.. Beautiful to watch but depressing too..

[kaosmark2]

Even the pressure of having a slip/2 slips in.. Get the batsmen thinking a bit, make sure he's got a niggle in his brain saying 'if I don't get this right, I'm out'.. Pressure adds pressure, it was too easy for Aus, that's down to three things, bad field settings, poor bowling and Clarke being a genius.. He ripped us to shreds in that opening session.. Beautiful to watch but depressing too..

I can forgive Cook for the Clarke/Haddin stand. They're quality players, on a batting paradise, which is also the favourite ground for both of them. My real complaint is that we were still incredibly defensive after getting Clarke out, rather than targeting their tail and putting them under pressure with catchers.

Edited December 6, 2013 by kaosmark2

[Osama Jim Laden]

I can forgive Cook for the Clarke/Haddin stand. They're quality players, on a batting paradise, which is also the favourite ground for both of them. My real complaint is that we were still incredibly defensive after getting Clarke out, rather than targeting their tail and putting them under pressure with catchers.

It was so strange, we showed fear.. They lapped it up.. Yes, they batted superbly, and with luck but I don't get all this 'Aussies are lucky so-and-so's' nonsense, they deserved it.. We didn't..

When Clarke went, perfect opportunity to attack and when Johnson (what the chuff was he doing) went also, another perfect chance but wasn't taken..

I think AC might be tired, those field placings showed too much fear rather than intent..

Edited December 6, 2013 by Osama Jim Laden

[lharris92]

well that's a nice and lovely attacking field

[kaosmark2]

It's easy to be brave with the field when you've got 570 on the board. Cook and Strauss were at such times. The difficulty is that we haven't batted well enough to give that leeway, and Cook's too defensive a captain to make such placings without it.

[Osama Jim Laden]

We're gonna be left chasing 500+.. Johnson was phenomenal.. Need to bat minimum two days, sigh..

[Osama Jim Laden]

It's easy to be brave with the field when you've got 570 on the board. Cook and Strauss were at such times. The difficulty is that we haven't batted well enough to give that leeway, and Cook's too defensive a captain to make such placings without it.

You're right, we need some luck.. You can generate your own luck with good energy, positive field settings would help that..

The fielders out there will be looking to AC for inspiration & he's being very defensive, on a batting track..

It's showing them a lack of faith..

[kaosmark2]

I think the focus here solely on Cook is unfair. His field positioning at the start of the Aussies innings was fairly attacking and the ball went everywhere.

This isn't down to Cook really its down to the players. Our batting is simply fucking terrible and besides Broad so has our bowling. While I will rightly point out Cook went cheap and early when he needed to be leading, the like of Pietersen have failed miserably so far. I think Root is starting to lose his grip on his place as well, or at least he should be doing.

The decision to leave Bell exactly where he is has been proven right and happy to see Carberry is proving himself.

I wonder who we will play in the next test, Swann or Panesar ? We don't really need two spinners there.

I agree with most of this, as I said, there haven't been the runs on the board for Cook to set attacking fields.

Our bowling has mostly been poor (although I think you're harsh on Monty, he's done pretty well), but neither the pitch nor the Kookaburra are helping ours. I think Cook is rightly getting criticised for some of his field placings costing when the Aussies were in. I particularly emphasise how Harris didn't have a slip in fairly early in his innings (9?) and a ball carried to where 1st slip would have been and ran off for 4. Regardless of how good they are at batting, and how many runs are on the board, you need to have at least one slip to each tail-ender.

The biggest issue though, is our batting. It's been deteriorating since the last India home series and needs to be addressed. We have a lot of players out of form, but ultimately, the criticism surely has to go to Graham Gooch? No team ever has 7 batsmen in form simultaneously, but having 5 out of form at once - and in several cases truly horribly - is just ridiculous. It's a sign of a deeper problem. All the players who've been failing have to look at themselves, but the background staff have to take responsibility as well.

Cook was skittish when he came to the crease, he could have played that ball better, but at least he got out to a good ball, which is more than you can say for the rest of the top and middle order (except maybe Stokes). Root, KP and Carberry all threw their wicket away (although Carberry has done well enough overall to justify a lack of criticism). The tail were beaten by good balls but the top order has the responsibility to blunt the confidence of the opposition bowlers.

Panesar should play in the next test. Swann failed at the Gabba as well, while Monty's bowled fairly well. I think the question is what we do about our batsmen.

[Osama Jim Laden]

I think the focus here solely on Cook is unfair.

Not meaning to come across totally on Cook but as a whole, we look clueless.. Failing with the bat, failing with the ball, Flower, Gooch et al struggling to help it seems..

What on earth was AC doing there though? Jeez..

Can't see us lasting these two days, so out of sorts at the mo'..

Edited December 8, 2013 by Osama Jim Laden

[Osama Jim Laden]

We'll see.. Pietersen can bat, Bell can bat..

We're fucked

[lharris92]

so i saw this little fact:

Andrew Samson, BBC Test Match Special statistician

"This is England's first 100 partnership in six innings since the Durham Test match in the summer."

Root and Pietersen.

absolutely ridiculous to be honest.

[kaosmark2]

Well at least a few players are finding a bit of form. The problem is we need Cook to...

[Osama Jim Laden]

Yep, at least we had a go.. Can we last all day with these lot? It is a batting track.. I don't think so either..

Going to need the near impossible to happen at the WACA..

[kaosmark2]

The main hope for tonight is Prior to stay in and get a 50+. We might get saved by the rain but really unlikely IMO.

I also hope that whatever happens with the lower order doesn't affect their choice of spinner for Perth. We should play Monty rather than Swann both because of form, and hope that it gives Swann a kick to rediscover his form.

[lharris92]

but they'd never drop swann because of what he's done in previous.

another step in the right direction came last night too: we managed to bat for a full day! yes we gave a few stupid wickets away but there is improvement from some, now the top established names need to do the same as well.

sadly I think there is no chance we will salvage a draw from this game, even with the weather. all the bowlers will have been rested again, just depends how much of a battering they can take from Johnson before losing wickets.

[kaosmark2]

They should. Even if they decide to go for 4 seamers they can't play Swann IMO. No criticism of Jimmy's failure to take wickets, conditions don't suit his bowling at all and he wasn't particularly expensive, but Swann was really poor. Him and Cook are the ones that have no form.

Who do you play in the next test? I think you have to stick with Stokes now you've picked him, so whichever spinner you drop do you add a batsman or a bowler? Stick Ballance at 7, move Prior down, trust in Stokes as a 3rd seamer and shore up the batting? Finn as our paceyest bowler?

I imagine it'll end up as Bresnan, but I was pleasantly surprised with their choices on Wednesday...

[kaosmark2]

I think how well Monty has done is being really overstated... I would go with Swann...

Monty did the job asked of him, Swann was terrible.

[Osama Jim Laden]

Agree that Swann should probably lose his place but also agree he won't because of previous exploits..

Also think it's nailed on that Bresnan will be coming into the side, he's experienced and can change a game..

[kaosmark2]

Agree that Swann should probably lose his place but also agree he won't because of previous exploits..

Yep

Also think it's nailed on that Bresnan will be coming into the side, he's experienced

Yep

and can change a game..

Nah.

[lharris92]

small delay before the inevitable. if they hold out until around tea then it will be a good step before the next game

[Osama Jim Laden]

Nah.

I know exactly what you mean but as far as anyone else left to come in, he's the only one likely to make any difference.....

SHIT!!! Fucks sake Broady!!!!!!

(cont.) with bat & ball.. Maybe Rankin with more experience but not yet..