Stop Tory Cuts

[Pogues Mcgogues]

Right To Work are organising a protest at the Tory conference, the conference where the worst cuts that will scar

the country and have dire effects on jobs and employment levels will get voted on by delegations.

Sunday 3rd October @ Birmingham City Centre.

Some people backing this cause is Tony Benn (Lab), Dianne Abbott MP(Lab), Caroline Lucas MP(Green), Katy Clark MP(Lab), Sandra White MSP (SNP), Pete Murray (NUJ), Jeremy Corbyn (Lab)

There's a bus from Glasgow leaving George Square at 6:30am and only £10 unwaged. There's buses from all around the place going. See the website for more info.

Info here - www.righttowork.org.uk

[Alcatraz]

I'll be at uni by then (in Birmingham). Glasto tickets on sale in the morning. Oh and its my birthday. May stop by for even more fun

[llcoolphil]

Which tory cuts would you like to stop and which would you like to keep?

[Pogues Mcgogues]

Which tory cuts would you like to stop and which would you like to keep?

[llcoolphil]

Is it possible to list them? God. Take today's news, the butchering Royal Mail for a start.

Edited September 22, 2010 by llcoolphil

[Alcatraz]

Well, thats one way of keeping the lefties out of Glasto - keep em occupied on T day!

[Pogues Mcgogues]

I'll be at uni by then (in Birmingham). Glasto tickets on sale in the morning. Oh and its my birthday. May stop by for even more fun

[dakyras]

Anything Diane Abbott is backing is a cause worth opposing. Terrible human being.

[bunique]

The spending review isn't published til 20 October so I doubt there'll be much in the way of cuts announced at conference.

[eFestivals]

Did you protest at Labour events up until May, about the £23Bn of cuts that Labour imposed?

Those Labour cuts are causing loads of public sector jobs to be lost already., as well as a big reduction in services.

[Snufflebutt]

Every single government in the western world is proposing cuts. In the same way that everyone lauds Brown for his role in saving the world from depression they would be laughing at the government if they didnt make cuts.

You might have a point if you could actually give examples of cuts that shouldnt be made. But you seem to be quite coy, as if u are scared to mention a cut that Labour would have made....

[Pogues Mcgogues]

Every single government in the western world is proposing cuts. In the same way that everyone lauds Brown for his role in saving the world from depression they would be laughing at the government if they didnt make cuts.

You might have a point if you could actually give examples of cuts that shouldnt be made. But you seem to be quite coy, as if u are scared to mention a cut that Labour would have made....

[llcoolphil]

No, the one that the party and the people didn't allow him. One man's ambitions were crushed by the power of the people. We look at the records. Labour looked at it and dismissed it.

[eFestivals]

And if you read Neil's comments in the TUC thread, he agree's with me with Labour over Tory Lib. He's just looking for an argument.

I agree that cuts at a lower level would be better thasn cuts on an idealogical basis (which is what we're going to get).

But that still doesn't alter the fact that Labour made £23Bn worth of cuts - which are being implemented right now - and which are causing a massive loss of jobs all by themselves, before we get to anything that the ConDems might do.

So why is it that tory cuts are wrong only on the basis that they're being made by the tories, while huge Labour cuts that also cause job losses are OK?

[saratink]

So why is it that tory cuts are wrong only on the basis that they're being made by the tories, while huge Labour cuts that also cause job losses are OK?

[Snufflebutt]

So why is it that tory cuts are wrong only on the basis that they're being made by the tories, while huge Labour cuts that also cause job losses are OK?

[jump]

I think you answered this question yourself by mentioning ideology in relation to why cuts are going to be so deep. Its against what Pogo believes in. Quite frankly ideology is a dead concept anyway in modern politics IMO, so couldnt give a crap about whether the cuts conform with deep rooted party beliefs.

Modern politicians are ideology whores, they'll put forward any line that will help them get elected. Some would say this is a good thing.

[oafc0000]

I think you answered this question yourself by mentioning ideology in relation to why cuts are going to be so deep.

[eFestivals]

I think you answered this question yourself by mentioning ideology in relation to why cuts are going to be so deep. Its against what Pogo believes in.

Nope. Pogo is approaching this from the idea that any cuts are bad. He didn't have the same view when it was Labour doing the cutting.

Quite frankly ideology is a dead concept anyway in modern politics IMO, so couldnt give a crap about whether the cuts conform with deep rooted party beliefs.

except of course the tories making ideological cuts gets to show that as utterly wrong.

[llcoolphil]

except of course the tories making ideological cuts gets to show that as utterly wrong.

[Snufflebutt]

except of course the tories making ideological cuts gets to show that as utterly wrong.

[eFestivals]

What is this ideology?

That the state should be small, so that c**ts can be exploitative c**ts without any restraint.

FFS.

[llcoolphil]

That the state should be small, so that c**ts can be exploitative c**ts without any restraint.

FFS.

[eFestivals]

Nope. Two scenarios - 1) Labour are elected 2) Tories are elected. Both scenarios would have definitely resulted in large scale public service cuts that were only hinted at in their manifestos. Not sure ideology comes into it. Maybe their ideology means that Osbourne and Cameron enjoy the cutting, but it hasnt made them any more likely to do it.

Yep, both would make cuts.

Cuts at a certain level are necessary. Cuts at a deeper level are not.

The tories plan cuts at the deepest possible level, for the specific purpose of "making govt smaller". It's what they believe in.

[eFestivals]

So we are at the stage now that if the tories cut x it is ideological, whereas if labour cut x it is economic. Which means either they have the same ideology or neither are making cuts for ideological reasons.

Yes, I'm sure there's plenty of instances where cuts would be identical from both, but there will also be plenty of instances were they wouldn't be.

For example, the abolition of the Audit Commission - a "cut" that's not even being done on the basis of the savings it'll make. It's a "cut" that will cause an INCREASE in spending by the state, because the auditing will still need to be done, but will now be done by private companies on a for-profit basis rather than the audit commission for cost.

FFS Phil, you're being a moron about these things.