Child Benefit cut

[Pogues Mcgogues]

Depends, if you want to live smack bang in the middle of London £40k wont get you far but if you live in the greater london area things get a lot cheaper.

[jump]

Yeah I know that. But you can live bang in the middle of Glasgow for rent at £250 or less a month if you flat share. I had a friend that lived in a worse flat in the centre of Edinburgh for nearly a £100 more, and my pal in the Glasgow flat had bigger rooms, nicer flat, and in a nicer area. I'd imagine in London that would be impossible for a city centre flat share?

[Pogues Mcgogues]

I know a girl who lives in Moorgate (Central London) and she pays £300 per month and shares her place with another girl. Unfortunatley will broke up before I got see how big the place was.

[eFestivals]

Factor in child care costs, mortgage payments and such like...

Its pretty obvious anyone with a family income of around £44,000 isn't "rich"...

They might have a better car, nicer house in a nicer area and such like, but they aren't "rich"...

It depends on the context used for defining rich.

By the simple fact that it's double the average wage makes someone on a wage like that definitely rich to the vast majority of people.

[Ed209]

I know a girl who lives in Moorgate (Central London) and she pays £300 per month and shares her place with another girl. Unfortunatley will broke up before I got see how big the place was.

[eFestivals]

I hate to keep sounding london centric but, this argument doesnt stand up - its like saying the average house price in the UK is 150k so therefore almost everyone should be able to afford to buy (i know its not 150k). It depends massively where in the UK you live as to how far 40k goes.

A family living in Halifax earning 40k will be pretty wealthy whereas a family living in Watford earning 40k could be finding it quite difficult. don't get me wrong 40k is not a small amount of money even in london but there is a quite wide gap between what its worth in some areas compared with others.

Yet it's the case that even within London and its surroundings more people earn under the average wage than earn above it.

So while things might be tough from one angle for higher earners who lose their child benefit, from the point of view of most people they're moaning about being hugely privileged.

But anyway, all of this is precisely what the tories want us to be thinking. This has been announced early cos the rest of the cuts are going to hit the really poor VERY hard - it's so the govt can point at this child benefit cut and say "look, the rich are suffering too", when the impact on them will be tiny in comparison.

[jump]

Thats a bit of a rarity though. I reckon on the whole, the cheapest room you can find in London with a half decent location is £100 a week, and you'd expect that to be a shithole.

[oafc0000]

It depends on the context used for defining rich.

By the simple fact that it's double the average wage makes someone on a wage like that definitely rich to the vast majority of people.

[eFestivals]

What does my head in though is when people complain London is so expensive becuase they insist on being in the middle when they can live in the greater London area at a much cheaper cost and still get the perks London offers.

that's a misplaced idea.

Yopu can live well outside of London - and save an awful lot on rent, etc - and access those things far easier than you can do from the likes of (say) Acton.

It's actually far quicker to get from 40 miles outside to the centre than it is from somewhere like Acton.

[eFestivals]

Of course, but I don't think it helps to be blinkered about this.. Specially from people like you who can usually think about more widely than that...

You know what I am saying is right...

Eh? You're a millions miles away.

If you think anyone earning average wage or less - which is the vast majority of the country - has any sympathy for the likes of you having to "suffer" a cut of £1k a year in benefits while you're still earning £20k+ more than them you're f**king mad.

The fact that someone even worse off thinks wrongly they are living a very comfortable life doesn't change the fact, that in reality, that "richer" family is still living hand to mouth to an extent once all the bills have been paid...

Hand to mouth? Do take your daft head from your arse. You clearly don't have a clue what hand to mouth really means.

Yes, it might be the case that all of your income disappears, but that's the result of your spending choices.

You know - in your case - choices such as flying off to South Africa to catch some of the world cup. That's really "hand to mouth", eh?

Most people can't even afford a 'normal' family holiday, and don't get close to considering such excesses as you clearly feel are standard for all.

When Cameron says we are all in this together... He is right... The lower and middle class are... but he is trying to create a war between the two.. When the problem is clearly up top...

Yep. But what you're not realising is that those on £44k+ are a part of that "up top".

It's less than 15% of working people who make a wage above £44k.

[oafc0000]

Can't be arsed... You have not got a clue to be frank Neil...

We used to talk about the top 1%... Now its the top 15% we talk about..

It is the top 1% who have the money and the rest of us just get by in reality...

Edited October 5, 2010 by oafc0000

[jump]

that's a misplaced idea.

Yopu can live well outside of London - and save an awful lot on rent, etc - and access those things far easier than you can do from the likes of (say) Acton.

It's actually far quicker to get from 40 miles outside to the centre than it is from somewhere like Acton.

Edited October 5, 2010 by jump

[dakyras]

£44,881 puts you in the top 10%. You don't deserve child benefit if you earn that much.

Edited October 5, 2010 by dakyras

[oafc0000]

£44,881 puts you in the top 10%. You don't deserve child benefit if you earn that much.

[dakyras]

Its hard to take you seriously because you always come out with these one liners with no substance...

[Ed209]

£44,881 puts you in the top 10%. You don't deserve child benefit if you earn that much.

[eFestivals]

Can't be arsed... You have not got a clue to be frank Neil...

We used to talk about the top 1%... Now its the top 15% we talk about..

It is the top 1% who have the money and the rest of us just get by in reality...

I've got a clue that you haven't - what it's like to live on minimum wage or less.

Yes, the top 1% are an issue. But this is a tory govt remember. They ain't turkeys that will vote for xmas. They're well aware of that, and that the likes of you won't get sympathy from the average person who is HUGELY worse off than you.

But your "getting by" is ridiculous. I've not had a holiday for over 12 years - because I simply cannot afford it - while you swan off to South Africa, go on cruises, start savings accounts for your kid, pay huge amounts into pensions, and take advantage of the tax regime so that you pay a lower percentage of your income in tax (despite being in the 40% bracket) than someone earning £12k a year.

Really, take your head out of your arse. The likes of you are sooooo very far from being the average person that you will not get sympathy for your "suffering".

[eFestivals]

True but that's more usefull for people who wants to just work in London and enjoy the extra wedge. Say if you want to go to enjoy the nightlife too and go to a club like Fabric the last trains goes at between 11.30-1ish so you'll be buggered getting home unlike the greater area.

you've not heard of milk trains have you?

[Ed209]

But your "getting by" is ridiculous. I've not had a holiday for over 12 years - because I simply cannot afford it - while you swan off to South Africa, go on cruises, start savings accounts for your kid, pay huge amounts into pensions, and take advantage of the tax regime so that you pay a lower percentage of your income in tax (despite being in the 40% bracket) than someone earning £12k a year.

[oafc0000]

But your "getting by" is ridiculous. I've not had a holiday for over 12 years - because I simply cannot afford it

[oafc0000]

Precisely my point, but made with a bit more venom . If Oafc is happy with the quality of life he is providing his child with, then the child benefit is just providing him luxuries like expensive trips to the world cup ...

Edited October 5, 2010 by oafc0000

[Ed209]

I am the sort of person who shouldn't really be getting it...

Mine and my wifes income equal a huge income...

I was talking about a £44k salary family... We are about twice the size of that...

[oafc0000]

If you don't think you should get it then why do you take it? Even if you don't trust the way the government will spend it then donate it to the NSPCC ...

[eFestivals]

Precisely my point, but made with a bit more venom . If Oafc is happy with the quality of life he is providing his child with, then the child benefit is just providing him luxuries like expensive trips to the world cup ...

yep - a trip that will have cost him far more than a year's child benefit. Which gets to prove he can take the loss of that child benefit without blinking.

Yet he thinks he's suffering.

And no doubt he'll be all for the cuts in pensions and wages for public servants that will no doubt be announced, because "all public servants are lazy and useless" (); no doubt he'll be in favour of cuts in benefits that will be made without consideration of the impact on people far more deserving of benefits than himself; no doubt he'll be happy to see libraries and other essential public services disappear from the UK, because they're not essential to him because (relatively) he's swimming in cash and so those services aren't essential to him. Etc, etc, etc.

As I've already said, this child benefit announcement is the cover so that the rich like him can convince themselves they're "suffering" from the cuts too, and he can believe that Dave Moron is a bastion of truth when he says "we're all in this together" while making minor cuts to oaf's life and huge cuts to the lives of people who really are in desperate straits already.

I know the likes of oaf isn't hugely rich, but he's still very much in a privileged position. He needs to take his head from his arse and realise that truth.

[jump]

you've not heard of milk trains have you?