Sunday Rant

[bennyhana22]

I know it's not 'designed' for me

I know I'm too old to be relevant

I know that it shouldn't annoy me

But it does

Just brought my daughter home from gymnastics, with the radio on on a Sunday evening as ALWAYS and...

...why is the music of the charts INVARIABLY UTTER UTTER UTTER SHITE!

Forgive me my ranting

Ben

[paulwa]

I have to agree with you, but then the singles charts have always been populated by bands that mainly appeal to 14 year olds, and parents have been cringing at them ever since the charts were invented. Did you see the documentary on BBC4 the other night, about Top of the Pops in 1976? The music was dire - joke tunes, family friendly ditties, etc. - punk just HAD TO HAPPEN! Maybe it's time for another musical revolution?

Edited April 10, 2011 by paulwa

[shoebox]

My kids, aged 3 and (nearly) 6 currently LOVE The Saturdays, Katy Perry, JLS, Alexander Burke and Girls Aloud. Now whilst I may not like any of these myself, I have to say, at least they are showing an interest in music. That they actually want to listen to something, and will, hopefully, move on something better when they start developing their own true taste. We all did. I know for one I was recording whatever catchy numbers were in the charts as a kid and I grew up in the age of SAW. Didn't do me any harm.

[perfectpassion]

Ben, ranting, grumpy, whatever next I endured Pink and Avril and suchlike, and now Fliss is into Joanna Newsome and Lykke Li (oh well) And if you are old Ben that means I'm ancient

[wackojackohighcliffe]

I hated that shit when I was 14. I will pretty much only listen to 6music if i want to hear some good bands now that radcliffe and maconie have left radio 2.

[paulwa]

Oh no! A well suppressed memory has just come into my head... I went to see The Bay City Rollers in the early 70's (aarrggghh!). But then I was about 5 years old and got in free because my Nan was manageress of the box office. Oh hell, they're all flooding out now... first single = "Long Haired Lover from Liverpool" by Little Jimmy Osmond (though I suspect that Nan had an influence there too). They usually say that you feel better for getting things off your chest - not this time!

[acstalker]

The first concert I ever went to was The Carpenters at the Glasgow Apollo in 1973 (I was 13). At the time it wasn't cool and within the year I'd moved on to seeing Quo and Sabbath at the same venue. Now, of course, it is quite cool to say I saw The Carpenters but not Quo or Sabbath.

[Hotcider]

I know it's not 'designed' for me

I know I'm too old to be relevant

I know that it shouldn't annoy me

But it does

Just brought my daughter home from gymnastics, with the radio on on a Sunday evening as ALWAYS and...

...why is the music of the charts INVARIABLY UTTER UTTER UTTER SHITE!

Forgive me my ranting

Ben

[/quote

Having read this and your numerous other rants about bands you don't like together with your reply to the guy asking for a cheap ticket, have you ever considered auditioning for the next series of Grumpy Old Men ??

[perfectpassion]

Morning Ben, and Hi to newbie Paula, sorry Paul(w)a...

I have no idea whats in the charts now so not quite sure what you are so upset by but there does seem to be an abundance of female vocalists. I felt similarly about the early 80s although now looking back there was some good music around that I missed. My answer whenin the car was to always play cds (the Now series I think) that way the girls got to listen to what they wanted but I could skip the tracks I hated).

ps...re the line up, have already said my piece and don't want to upset Shoebox again. BUT As Phil said, we owe EOTR a huge debt (hearts n kisses) and I still love the people and the festival x

[bennyhana22]

Hi Sue and we love you too and I'm really looking forward to another EoTR with you!

RE: the 'Charts':

the problem is that it's almost impossible to articulate stuff like this without becoming your parents and slipping inexorably into a 'It all sounds the bloody same! It wasn't like this when we were young' stereotypical cliche...

...except it WASN'T!!!

Even a few years ago, the charts were filled with songs, some good, some not so good, but NOT almost indistinguishable from each other. There was genre-variety, there was indie, hip-hop, R'n'B, pop, dance etc. A few years ago there was 'chart' music and there was 'clubbing' music with a fairly clear distinction between them. 'Proper' club music rarely bothered the charts. That's not what it was 'designed' for, nor how it was promoted. Today, the trend is for mass-produced, identikit dance-style stuff that used to be found only in clubs and on specialist radio shows (see Radio 1, Friday evening etc). Trouble is, whilst I love dance music and am a bit of a closet rave-monster, the sheer abundance of music in that particular genre has led to a plummeting of quality. It's now SOOO easy to put a track together, thus:

1. Artist - a not-especially well known female vocalist who can belt out a repetitive sing-along refrain, squeezed through Autotune.

2. Featuring - you've gotta have a 'featuring' these days - if you're 'lucky' it's, Tinie, Fiddy, Chris Brown etc. If you're not it's an unknown 'rapper' but it makes no difference, the kids lap this stuff up regardless.

3. Format - you may not stray from the formatting:

• Track starts

• Wash of cheezy House synths

• (optional female vocal refrain)

• 'Verse 1' - unintelligible 'rap' from 'featuring'. A lot of 'Yeah's and 'Come on's. no decent flow, No decent rhyme, rhythm. Just cobbled together crap

• Refrain 1 - female vocalist. Cue audience waving hand in air from side-to-side, with a bump beat at the end of each arc, massive sing-along by all

• 'Verse 2' - see Verse 1

• Refrain 2 - see Refrain 1

• Breakdown - beats faded out, atmospheric, smoky vocal about what he wants to do to you baby, ooooh, build up, beats back here we go, here we go, HERE WE GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

• Refrain 3 (double length) to fade

• Track ends - everyone SCREAMS. No clapping. No-one claps after a track anymore - see T4 on the Beach etc

So far, so shit. Multiply that by 9 and add one track by, say, Adele and you have the Top 10. EVERY WEEK.

Saddest thing? Even the 'decent', name, hip-hop artists of 10 years ago have now adopted the self-same format for their tracks - see Em, Kanye, Dre, Jay-Z etc (I know they're very mainstream now, but in their heyday they were pretty fabulous...)

So, am I just a grumpy old git, or am I correct in saying that:

1. it's NOT OK

2. It HASN'T always been like this for popular, chart music

3. we're all going to Hell in a handcart

Your answers are eagerly anticipated

Ben

xx

PS - forgive any minor grammatical/spelling anomalies - this one came out and I couldn't stop it!

Edited April 12, 2011 by bennyhana22

[perfectpassion]

I'm going to hell in a headscarf!

[riverlodge]

ben, if you could get over the grumpiness, sounds like you have the popular music business well sussed. if there was money in it you could be rich, as you have got the tat formula perfected.

however, if you can't subdue your musical ethics and become like simon cowell, sounds like you need DAB radio in your car tuned permanently to 6music.

[marooned]

Radio 2 this afternoon and that plonker Steve Wright faded out the rippin' guitar solo on Prince's Purple Rain because 'it gets rather loud here' - i.e. time for more of me and my posse talking utter drivel!!!!

[bennyhana22]

ben, if you could get over the grumpiness, sounds like you have the popular music business well sussed. if there was money in it you could be rich, as you have got the tat formula perfected.

however, if you can't subdue your musical ethics and become like simon cowell, sounds like you need DAB radio in your car tuned permanently to 6music.

[bennyhana22]

Radio 2 this afternoon and that plonker Steve Wright faded out the rippin' guitar solo on Prince's Purple Rain because 'it gets rather loud here' - i.e. time for more of me and my posse talking utter drivel!!!!

[shoebox]

I think I'm one of those people who just genuinely doesn't care. It's the same with the endless reality TV/public vote shows that clog up the visual airwaves. They just don't enter my radar.

Radio hasn't really featured in my life since the days of Lamacq and Wiley on the Evening Session. I've certainly never paid any attention to daytime radio. I always spent a fair chunk of my disposable income on music, and made my discoveries from the written word (i.e. NME, Melody Maker and Uncut before the internet made these surplus to requirements), so I've always had something alternative to listen to.

What the general public are subjected to is their own problem. Myself, and like-minded individuals have sought out what they want outside of the mainstream, and those who are disillusioned with it and care to do something about it, will do just that.

[RedRockRick]

I don't believe there's any need to spend more than about £1 on any album, and I've made many amazing musical discoveries this way. I'm astonished, for example, that no-one's suggested Ralf Schildkraut & The Bavarian Tango Orchestra for EOTR: perfect for a sunny Saturday afternoon, I'd say.

[paulwa]

Radio Paradise (from California) is a great internet radio station for a really varied mix of music, including folk, rock, Americana, alt.country, even the odd bit of British Indie (Blur, Roses, Smiths normally). I've discovered bands on here, who I've subsequently seen at EOTR. The sole DJ keeps his talking to an absolute minimum: www.radioparadise.com

[perfectpassion]

OK so where do you stand then Ben on Lykee Li being added to the EOTR line up? I mean much as i try not to dismiss artists on first or second listening she does seem to be heading mainstream littlegirliepop. Shes sold out everywhere and just been announced for Lattitude. I know Iggy did it, but I just find celebrity endorsements a bit "sticksfingersdownthroat" So "lifes too short for regrets and badly fitting jeans" (Levis) doesnt really inspire me to give her serious consideration. I would put her down as being tooooo big for EOTR by the time Sept comes round and pulling out possibly, any thoughts?

Edited April 13, 2011 by perfectpassion

[RedRockRick]

OK so where do you stand then Ben on Lykee Li being added to the EOTR line up? I mean much as i try not to dismiss artists on first or second listening she does seem to be heading mainstream littlegirliepop. Shes sold out everywhere and just been announced for Lattitude. I know Iggy did it, but I just find celebrity endorsements a bit "sticksfingersdownthroat" So "lifes too short for regrets and badly fitting jeans" (Levis) doesnt really inspire me to give her serious consideration. I would put her down as being tooooo big for EOTR by the time Sept comes round and pulling out possibly, any thoughts?

[paulwa]

I guess the Lykke song "Youth Knows No Pain" neatly summarises this thread!

[Hotcider]

Ben

You ARE grumpy but since I agree with your summary of chart music I guess I must be too !

Tend to agree with Shoey though, who gives a sh*t really - just listen to your own stuff you like (oh and force feed it to your kids like I do)

[jol33n]

Interesting rant. I have often ranted too about the same thing and I'm not old (nor a man). I can't say I'm not guilty as when I was 14 and Britney Spears first came on the radio, I loved it. I come from a tiny place where you can't get access to music you like easily so it's mainly radio. I didn't have a choice but to like some of the stuff the radio played. Most of it tended to be "rock" (Blur, Oasis, even The Cranberries, not very cool but at least I had a tendency towards guitars).

I grew out of it thanks to internet.

Anyway, back on topic. I find it funny that when Scott Mills does his "10 minutes takeover" to hear Foo Fighters, Nirvana and often rock songs being requested. If so, why don't they play more rock on the radio? That is beyond me.

I also used to be grumpier than now, dissing the likes of Razorlights and others. While I still don't like their music, I appreciate the fact that at least they are making some sort of "rock" accessible to the masses. I was quite pleasantly surprised to hear recently Noah and the Whale, Foo Fighters (again), The Vaccines, Sleigh Bells, The Strokes on Radio 1. And while they are getting airtime, they're not really making it to the chart.

I think that one of the reasons is that the chart is a singles chart and they won't appear there. The albums are making it but not singles. I even wonder if some of them bother to release singles nowadays. But being bands that are more popular amongst music-likers, people buy their CDs. On the other hand, the masses who are brain washed to like the latest Wiz Kalifah will buy the latest Wiz Kalifah song, they won't bother listening to his album and his music. They just like what has been thrown at them. over and over and over.

So here we are. A long post to give no conclusion whatsoever...

[MattL80]

They just like what has been thrown at them. over and over and over.

[jol33n]

Oh, I missed the Lykke Li discussion!

But maybe I won't fit within the "musically cultured" population as my tastes are pretty wide, from Zappa to Royksopp, from Best Coast to Oceansize, from the Velvet Underground to Modest Mouse via The Horrors, Gwen Stefani, and the Busta Rhymes rap on the new Tiesto song. Huge range and when it comes to the admittedly "shit" stuff, I declare it a very guilty pleasure. But overall, I'm a alternative music lover and the EOTR line-up is the best so far this summer (on the same level as the PrimaveraSound). Lykke Li therefore could fall on the guilty pleasures list.

But she doesn't.

There is the surprise factor to some mainstream artists, where they shouldn't be but they are. So should we stop liking them because they make it big? Sounds inethical to me. I am a big lover of Scandinavian music. At the very top of the list, stands The Knife and Jenny Wilson. Jenny Wilson is an absolute jewel. I also love Dag för Dag and another band called Träd Gräs Och Stenar, the first being likened to Lonelady on Spotify and the other being a sort of psyche dreamy rock. Well, they haven't made it big past their country but damn they're good! Lykke Li's music is also good in her own style, but somehow, she's made it more than others. To me, Mogwai would be more questionable in terms of mainstream-ness and popularity; I'm pretty sure they play in bigger venues than Lykke Li. But how do we measure it?

As for me, I can't wait for Jenny Wilson to become stellar so she can make it to festivals near me

And for the curious minds, here are some links

Träg Gräs Och Stenar

Edited April 13, 2011 by jol33n