The Dirty Independence Question

[russycarps]

My words?

Perhaps not yours, but defending a racist puts you on their level

[LJS]

Perhaps not yours, but defending a racist puts you on their level

I think you need to get some perspective, Russy.

[kaosmark2]

I think you need to get some perspective, Russy.

My comment was nothing in relation to SNP supporters and entirely in relation to viberunner and his posting habits here. You responded that we're getting a bit touchy, without actually having the perspective of what we were talking about.

[russycarps]

Viberunner is a funny one though. He is actually english himself. He hates what he is.

a very peculiar individual.

[kaosmark2]

Viberunner is a funny one though. He is actually english himself. He hates what he is.

a very peculiar individual.

I've yet to see him reference anything he actually likes.

[eFestivals]

I think you guy's are getting a bit touchy here.

I jokingly pointed out what he'd done.

It's you who've blown one.

[eFestivals]

I've yet to see him reference anything he actually likes.

I have.

Giving Murdoch money for yank TV programmes.

[LJS]

I jokingly pointed out what he'd done.

It's you who've blown one.

I only "blew one" when Russy accused me of racism. I reserve the right to take that accusation personally. As I suspect most decent folk would ...even you.

Had a think about land reform yet?

Edited May 16, 2015 by LJS

[LJS]

So, Murphy's gone.

Is this an opportunity for a rethink for Scottish Labour?

Edited May 16, 2015 by LJS

[viberunner]

And your mask has slipped, into the racist SNP that doesn't exist. Well I never.

It's not our fault if you're all knobbly-kneed chinless Pimms-botherers having cryw*nks over portraits of Arthur Scargill wearing a red beret.

I wouldn't suggest it's a "racially-destined" thing so much as just "part of your culture".

[LJS]

https://mancunianspring.wordpress.com/2015/05/13/the-best-election-result-that-a-free-north-could-wish-for/

[eFestivals]

Had a think about land reform yet?

I've been thinking about it for well over 30 years. What about you?

I've not had a chance to look at the SNP's plans yet but I presume it's not nationalising those 432 estates?

In which case it's naff all to shout about.

[eFestivals]

https://mancunianspring.wordpress.com/2015/05/13/the-best-election-result-that-a-free-north-could-wish-for/

yeah, let's celebrate divide and rule, cos that's going to make things so much easier for the people to stand up to the tories.

[viberunner]

In which case it's naff all to shout about.

It's not a Leninist/Marxist utopian piece of legislation, but I really enjoy the right to roam and wild-camp pretty much anywhere.

I might not own all of Scotland but it is a democratising feel to know I can visit pretty much any part of it and set a tent up.

(Sensible restrictions apply)

[eFestivals]

It's not a Leninist/Marxist utopian piece of legislation, but I really enjoy the right to roam and wild-camp pretty much anywhere.

I might not own all of Scotland but it is a democratising feel to know I can visit pretty much any part of it and set a tent up.

(Sensible restrictions apply)

so about 500 years behind England then, and still not as liberal.

[viberunner]

so about 500 years behind England then, and still not as liberal.

You don't appear to realise that in most cases, without special permission, it is not legal to wild camp (camp outside of campsites) in England.

[eFestivals]

You don't appear to realise that in most cases, without special permission, it is not legal to wild camp (camp outside of campsites) in England.

but we do have a right to roam.

Plus of course most land in England is productive, whilst it's vastly different in Scotland.

Are the SNP doing anything else to revoke feudalism in Scotland, or is the rest of it staying in place?

[LJS]

but we do have a right to roam.

Plus of course most land in England is productive, whilst it's vastly different in Scotland.

Are the SNP doing anything else to revoke feudalism in Scotland, or is the rest of it staying in place?

We already have more rights to access "our" land in Scotland than you do in England.

In Scotland the Land Reform (Scotland) Act 2003 comprehensively codified into Scots law the ancient tradition of the right to universal access to the land in Scotland. The act specifically establishes a right to be on land for recreational, educational and certain other purposes and a right to cross land. The rights exist only if they are exercised responsibly, as specified in theScottish Outdoor Access Code.

Access rights apply to any non-motorised activities, including walking, cycling, horse-riding and wild camping. They also allow access on inland water for canoeing, rowing, sailing and swimming. The rights confirmed in the Scottish legislation are greater than the limited rights of access created in England and Wales by the Countryside and Rights of Way Act 2000(CRoW).^[13]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_to_roam

We also have the Scottish Land Fund which supports community buyouts of land - small but definitely worthwhile

http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2012/jun/29/scotland-resurrects-boost-community-ownership

Now the Scottish Government has signalled it intends to press ahead with further land reforms.

A RADICAL shake-up of Scotland’s land ownership laws has been attacked as “state control through the back door” by the Conservatives, who claimed it could prevent people passing their homes to the family member of their choice.

The SNP government proposes that the Land Reform Bill should include the creation of a Scottish Land Reform Commission, the ability to take action against landowners who pose a “barrier” to development, and measures to make information on who owns land and its value more readily available

http://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/top-stories/conservatives-attack-snp-proposals-for-land-reform-1-3713502

These are not Mugabe style land seizures but they are a further step in the right direction & the fact that they are universally opposed by Tories & landowners would suggest they are a good thing.

My favourite quote on the subject comes from David Johnstone, the chairman of Scottish Land & Estates who said “Everybody holds up Scotland as being staggeringly beautiful and it is staggeringly beautiful. We can’t be doing too bad a job.”

So, the absentee Lairds & assorted toffs who own most of Scotland are personally responsible for the grandeur & majestic beauty of Ben Nevis, Glencoe, The Cuillins, The Ardnamurchan peninsula etc. etc. etc.

Aye right!

[eFestivals]

These are not Mugabe style land seizures but they are a further step in the right direction & the fact that they are universally opposed by Tories & landowners would suggest they are a good thing.

Hmmmm .... leaving the feudal landlords as feudal landlords isn't land reform, it's a worthless sop.

I'm not pretending that Engtland isn't similarly still feudal, tho the real world impact is far less as land ownership is more widely distributed (tho perhaps only because the land-grabs happened earlier here).

[LJS]

is Scotland moving to the left?

https://yougov.co.uk/news/2015/03/22/scotland-are-left-rest-uk-almost-every-issue/

[viberunner]

is Scotland moving to the left?

https://yougov.co.uk/news/2015/03/22/scotland-are-left-rest-uk-almost-every-issue/

A bit, but it's just because the way this sporran bounces.

[eFestivals]

is Scotland moving to the left?

https://yougov.co.uk/news/2015/03/22/scotland-are-left-rest-uk-almost-every-issue/

it's one thing wanting lots of 'left' things, but it means nothing at all without someone to pay for them.

What that poll also needed to make any sense was a "I want to pay more tax" question. Without that, it's merely a wish-list of wonderful things, which just about anyone could support.

Given that the indyref promised wonderful things but not any way to pay for them - and the indyref was lost - I'd say that poll ends up meaning very little when the real world (taxes) gets factored back in.

[viberunner]

it's one thing wanting lots of 'left' things, but it means nothing at all without someone to pay for them.

You know when you said you were a Marxist?

You were either lying to us, lying to yourself, or combination of the two.

You're party of the English 55% and you don't even know it.

[LJS]

You know when you said you were a Marxist?

You were either lying to us, lying to yourself, or combination of the two.

You're party of the English 55% and you don't even know it.

He's just sore because he's always said us Scots are just as right wing as the English which was a bit true. It now looks as though that might just be changing, so as he always does, he starts banging on about money.

He'll probably manage to squeeze Eck & Rupert in shortly.

Edited May 25, 2015 by LJS

[viberunner]

I know, but I mean just how close is this:

It's one thing wanting lots of 'left' things, but it means nothing at all without someone to pay for them.

To this

The trouble with Socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money.

Heheh.