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Football 2012-2013

Guest kaosmark2

By Guest kaosmark2
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TheGayTent Enthusiast

TheGayTent

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Yes pt I'm not deriding Martinez, far from it - just pointing out why he's being (rightly IMO) questioned by some Evertonians. That's not to say the answer to those questions is that he's not good enough - it's just fair to ask them.

Klopp was at Mainz 20 years as both a player and a manager. He got them promoted to the top flight for the first time ever, though they were relegated a few seasons later. He did though stay on in the 2nd division until Dortmund came a knocking.

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mrtourette Newbie

mrtourette

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I think overall El habsi was a good signing, went off this season but previously played a key role in keeping them up.

I have heard several people querying why Martinez would get the job over someone like Perriera. I do wonder if people are get taken in by a fancy name from europe in a very weak league. Its quite possible that Martinez could have won the league with porto (most have Perrieras predecessors have managed it after all) while Perriera could have struggled at Wigan having to cope with one of the lowest wage budgets in the league and not the highest.

To offer a bit of perspective about the Portugese league, wrexham are averaging 3500 in the 5th tier of the english pyramid. This would be somewhere in the middle of the portugese premier league. His record in Portugal is certainly impressive but apart from a few games a season there is no excuse for it to be anything but. I would judge more on what he has done in europe (a more level playing field) and he is yet to stand out at that level.

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pink_triangle Veteran

pink_triangle

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Yeah the troubles assessing Pereira are obvious, his only success is in a weak league (although going unbeaten all season exceeded previous successes) and Porto did nothing in Europe under his watch, and it's hard to compare two managers when they haven't been in any similar sitautions to compare. Rather than people being taken in by a fancy name from Europe (which is of course a danger) I'm more concerned that people are being taken in by the good press that Martinez always gets, which doesn't really seem to be based on any significant substance managing a football team but is mainly because he's such a decent chap and tries jolly hard to play football in a nice way.

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lost Veteran

lost

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The biggest issue will be does Martinez stick with the current system or move to the one he implemented at Swansea and Wigan. Moyes has always bought players to fit his system and for 11 years from the youth upwards its always been the same, an interchangeable spine, he had Cahill and then Fellaini who could step up if the forward tracked back and then at the other end a defensive midfielder who could drop back with wingers and wing backs who again could overlap and inter-change. Martinez plays a back 3 with tiki-taka style.. Can't see Anichebe getting too many games, maybe even Fellaini too might be not his type of player?? Jelavic looked shocking towards the end of the season and Distin will be 36 so he's got enough problems replacing them on a limited budget, He can't do a Rodgers and alienate 4 or 5 players the minute he gets in.

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mrtourette Newbie

mrtourette

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I think the idea that Martinez is just rated as a nice guy is lazy analysis. For a manager outside the big teams to win the FA cup is a great achievement and one wigan fans will remember far more than scraping survivial. The only other manager from outside the big teams I can remember is arry but theres a big difference between playing Cardiff and the premiership champions.

People can look at relegation as a failiure but for a side like wigan I see it as inevitable. 8 years in the league is a huge success and far more than most expected. I think the only sides who have managed 10 consecutive years is man u, man c, Liverpool, arsenal, villa, spurs, everton , fulham and Chelsea, It would be unfair to expect wigan to do the same. Im not sure whether Martinez will succeed or fail but if they wanted to employ from Britain he is as qualified as anyone else.

As for Portos record it cant automatically be assumed its because of them doing better, it could be that the opposition has got worse.

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pink_triangle Veteran

pink_triangle

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It is a great achievement, but it wasn't exactly a tough road to the final (Bournemouth, Macclesfield, Huddersfield, Millwall and a dreadful Everton). I don't want to detract from it but as I said above does that make him a great manager? Yes Wigan should have been relegated so the fact they were isn't necessarily a failure, I was more concerned about the way he manages rather than the end result. Whether they were relegated or not the same issues would be there - he can't organise a defence, his teams are very streaky and inconsistent and his record purchasing defensive players is poor. The fact they won the FA Cup doesn't make him a great manager and the fact they were relegated doesn't make him a bad one so you look at what he actually does, and it's not all that great.

And you're right that it's easy to offer a counter-argument to Pereira's/Porto's success, but it's just as easy to do the same with Martinez. However you are right that if they wanted to employ from Britain he's as good a choice as any, despite my reservations he has of course demonstrated good points and he's certainly a better choice than Mark Hughes!

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RobertProsineckisLighter Contributor

RobertProsineckisLighter

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You can only play whats put in front of you in the cup. When we won it in 2008 people said we had an easy route to the cup. Which to some extent we did, but we only conceeded 1 goal, and had to go away to Man Utd and win in the quarters.

Wigans acheivment was greater than our winning of the cup. Given the players they have at their disposal and the werent a top ten premiership side.

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daniel.k Newbie

daniel.k

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Edinson Cavani will be a chelsea player by the end of the week. My mum is on honeymoon in Seronto near Naples with my stepdad and the talk of the street is a deal has been agreed. He couldnt be clear on the price but he says Cavani is going to Chelsea very soon, just a medical to do

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pink_triangle Veteran

pink_triangle

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There's a huge expectancy on him in Denmark to become a megastar, Laursen [villa LEGEND!] said he believes he has the talent and rates him highly. So we shall see.

Im very excited with our youth policy, we seem to be picking up these talented youngsters from the UK and Europe and they're working so far mostly, Lowton, Westwood, Sylla, Benteke were all FANASTIC buys last year, Bennett sadly hasn't been as great, he's decent going forward but struggles at defending and our left side was attacked a lot last year.

I totally trust Lambert though, think after Helenius deal is done early next week we will slow down and aim to get rid of the MASSIVE list of players on their way out of Villa before we buy again, Bent, Bannan, Ireland, Given, Hutton, Delfouneso, Holman and possibly N'Zogbia will all be on there way out on top of Dawkins, Dunne, Marshall, Lichaj and Petrov already all out of contract and Makoun already sold.

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RobertProsineckisLighter Contributor

RobertProsineckisLighter

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Since our relegation from the Premiership in 2010 we have used 95 players in all league and cup competitions!

Aaron Mokoena,

Abdul Razak

Adam Reed

Adam Webster

Akos Buzsaky

Alex Cisak

Alex Grant

Andy Higgins

Ashley Harris

Ashley Westwood

Benjani Mwaruwari

Bjorn Helge Riise

Bradley Tarduck

Brian Howard

Carl Dickinson

Chris Maguire

Christian Dailly

Conor Clifford

Dan Butler

Dan Thompson

Danny Webber

Darel Russell

Dave Kitson

David Connolly

David Cotterill

David Norris

David Nugent

Erik Huseklepp

Frankie Sutherland

Gabor Gyepes

George Colson

George Thorne

Greg Halford

Hayden Mullins

Hermann Hreidarsson

Ibrahima Sonko

Izale McLeod

Jack Compton

Jack Maloney

Jake Jervis

James Keene

Jamie Ashdown

Jason Pearce

Jed Wallace

Joe Mattock

Joel Ward

Johannes Ertl

John Akinde

John Utaka

Jon Harley

Jonathan Hogg

Jordan Obita

Josh Thompson

Karim Rekik

Kelvin Etuhu

Kevin Long

Kieran Djilali

Lee Williamson

Liam Lawrence

Liam Walker

Lubomir Michalik

Luca Scapuzzi

Luke Rodgers

Luke Varney

Marc Wilson

Marko Futacs

Marlon Pack

Matt Ritchie

Michael Brown

Mikkel Andersen

Mustapha Dumbuya

Nadir Ciftci

Nathaniel Mendez-Laing

Nick Awford

Nw*nkwo Kanu

Patrick Agyemang

Paul Benson

Paul Connolly

Peter Gregory

Ricardo Rocha

Richard Hughes

Ritchie De Laet

Ryan Williams

Sam Magri

Sam Sodje

Scott Allan

Shaun Cooper

Simon Eastwood

Stephen Henderson

Tal Ben Haim

Therry Racon

Tom Kilbey

Tommy Smith

Wes Thomas

Yassin Moutaouakil

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