WWE

[jump]

Just skip Raw and just watch the Firefly Funhouse segments on YouTube. It's hard to believe things are getting so much worse when they are trying to fix things.

10 minutes ago, DareToDibble said:

Are they EVER going to stop calling Undertaker back? It gets worse each time.

Yeah, you can hide it to a degree but putting him out against other old timers like Goldberg or Trips just forces slow dull matches. If he was going with younger workhorse people who can carry the work for him (like CM Punk did) I can look forward to it more, of course the problem then is Undertaker would just be going over the roster as I can't see him being that keen on losing. I reckon AJ could get something decent out of him still. 

[pink_triangle]

1 hour ago, jump said:

Just skip Raw and just watch the Firefly Funhouse segments on YouTube. It's hard to believe things are getting so much worse when they are trying to fix things.

Yeah, you can hide it to a degree but putting him out against other old timers like Goldberg or Trips just forces slow dull matches. If he was going with younger workhorse people who can carry the work for him (like CM Punk did) I can look forward to it more, of course the problem then is Undertaker would just be going over the roster as I can't see him being that keen on losing. I reckon AJ could get something decent out of him still. 

Do you think people particularly want to see Undertaker have a good match? If I was a fan I would happy see entrance and 2 minute squash.  There are others on the card who can have good matches.

[jump]

26 minutes ago, pink_triangle said:

Do you think people particularly want to see Undertaker have a good match? If I was a fan I would happy see entrance and 2 minute squash.  There are others on the card who can have good matches.

As opposed to people wanting to see a bad match? I'd just rather see him retire than repeats of that Saudi match.

[pink_triangle]

4 hours ago, jump said:

As opposed to people wanting to see a bad match? I'd just rather see him retire than repeats of that Saudi match.

I think when it comes to someone like undertaker it's all about the entrance and the big moves. These are more over than the wrestling ability of many of the current talent.

If I went to a UK live event and Undertaker was on the card I would br happy. In the world of 3 hour raw and 4 hour plus ppvs there is plenty of time to go around.

[jump]

On ‎6‎/‎4‎/‎2019 at 6:01 PM, pink_triangle said:

I think when it comes to someone like undertaker it's all about the entrance and the big moves. These are more over than the wrestling ability of many of the current talent.

If I went to a UK live event and Undertaker was on the card I would br happy. In the world of 3 hour raw and 4 hour plus ppvs there is plenty of time to go around.

Tbh that's what meet and greets are for, all of the excitement for him goes when they have a holding lock for 10 mins because he's too winded.

 

Anyone hear the reason why NXT UK Takeover is being held the same day as All Out? It's not actually try to compete with AEW but New Japan instead. There's an UK New Japan show that day in London and WWE contacted a ticket seller to see how it was doing, they find out there's only 2k worth of tixs sold so they decide to set up a WWE show in Cardiff to show up New Japan. Only it's the same day as a Cardiff rugby match which is fucking up the local hotels prices and drawing people away from the wrestling. WWE has now found out the 2k was only from that one ticket seller and they sold another 5-7k worth of tixs with others sellers. They have been doing this type of thing in the US a lot where they will put on house shows near indy events to try and kill them off.

[pink_triangle]

8 hours ago, jump said:

Tbh that's what meet and greets are for, all of the excitement for him goes when they have a holding lock for 10 mins because he's too winded.

 

Then the answer is don't book him in a 10 minute match. I think if you polled WWE fans attending a live event if they wanted to see Undertaker or not then the majority would say yes. I don't want a meet and greet when I have to queue or pay silly money, ok maybe if he agreed to tombstone me I would agree to it!

[Andre91]

Undertaker vs. Goldberg, then. 

One of the worst matches I’ve ever seen. I knew it wasn’t going to be good at all but I didn’t expect that absolute shit show. It was horrible. Both of those guys have no business wrestling in 2019. They legitimately could have broken each other’s necks in the space of minutes. 

Seeing The Undertake like that yet again is just really, really sad. Just stop. 

[jump]

The only person who needs to retire more than Goldberg and 'taker is Vince. I reckon they will try Sting vs 'taker at the next Saudi show.

I thought it was gonna be another 50 man royal rumble rather than a 5o man battle royal, there's too many people in the ring at the same time to enjoy it.

[pink_triangle]

If the undertaker and Goldberg can get a Saudi prince to pay them a lot of money for a little work then that's great for them. I have heard a few people say they are tainting their legacy, but I think for both that is very much intact.

[jump]

24 minutes ago, pink_triangle said:

If the undertaker and Goldberg can get a Saudi prince to pay them a lot of money for a little work then that's great for them. I have heard a few people say they are tainting their legacy, but I think for both that is very much intact.

It's not a Saudi Prince paying them it's WWE but it's neither here nor there as that match point blank shouldn't have happened. There's multiple times from both men moves went wrong which could easily broken one of their necks. This isn't a surprise either, 'taker hasn't looked like he can go for a while now and Goldberg has never been that good, even in his peak his botches were ending careers.

The legacy will mean shit if it ends up killing or paralysing someone in the ring.

 

[KVShinedown]

Watching Dominion made me wonder, is there any aspect of presentation that NJPW is not streets better than WWE at? Characters, stories, match quality, developing stars.. even without Omega its just a completely different league.

Although Ibushi is clearly determined to kill himself in the ring which isn't great..

Edited June 9, 2019 by KVShinedown

[pink_triangle]

1 hour ago, jump said:

It's not a Saudi Prince paying them it's WWE but it's neither here nor there as that match point blank shouldn't have happened. There's multiple times from both men moves went wrong which could easily broken one of their necks. This isn't a surprise either, 'taker hasn't looked like he can go for a while now and Goldberg has never been that good, even in his peak his botches were ending careers.

The legacy will mean shit if it ends up killing or paralysing someone in the ring.

 

Without the Saudi money they wouldn't be wrestling, so it's effectively Saudi paying them.

I haven't watched the match (due to not renewing network, but reading report it doesn't look the best way to book them. To me the best thing about a Taker v Goldberg match is the entrances and the star power. I would have had them trade a few punches, have a couple of smaller (more agile) midcarders come in for a double DQ and have Taker and Goldberg team up and destroy them.

[jump]

1 hour ago, pink_triangle said:

Without the Saudi money they wouldn't be wrestling, so it's effectively Saudi paying them.

I haven't watched the match (due to not renewing network, but reading report it doesn't look the best way to book them. To me the best thing about a Taker v Goldberg match is the entrances and the star power. I would have had them trade a few punches, have a couple of smaller (more agile) midcarders come in for a double DQ and have Taker and Goldberg team up and destroy them.

That's literally too much at this at point, Goldberg manage to cut his forehead banging his head against the door during his entrance.

That bait and switch kind of booking is one of the things that killed off WCW and just sounds shit. Putting over old wrestlers who can't even pull off their finishers against your current roster is waste, if they really want to be old skool then they should be putting someone over on the way out.

Let the attitude era die before someone dies in ring.

1 hour ago, KVShinedown said:

Watching Dominion made me wonder, is there any aspect of presentation that NJPW is not streets better than WWE at? Characters, stories, match quality, developing stars.. even without Omega its just a completely different league.

Although Ibushi is clearly determined to kill himself in the ring which isn't great..

I've only watched a few matches so far but yeah it's a good show.

I wouldn't say New Japan has a better presentation but it's the one I prefer. The hard hitting style and more realistic camera is what does it for me.

Edited June 9, 2019 by jump

[Andre91]

Goldberg had an excellent second run a couple of years ago. It was a perfect ending to his career. That’s now been ruined. 

The Undertaker is washed up to fuck and an absolute shell of who he once was. He is embarrassing himself with every comeback. His legacy is being ruined and there is no way anybody can argue that. 

Surely, surely he know he shouldn’t be wrestling still. The look on his face after that match said it all. Have some self-respect and actually retire for good. 

Edited June 9, 2019 by Andre91

[pink_triangle]

53 minutes ago, jump said:

 

I wouldn't say New Japan has a better presentation but it's the one I prefer. The hard hitting style and more realistic camera is what does it for me.

What are the Japanese crowds like in general. I find the WWE "this is awesome", "you deserved this crowd" play a big part in ruining the matches to me. Also do they do many kick outs of finishes? Again another thing that annoys me about modern WWE.

[pink_triangle]

1 hour ago, Andre91 said:

His legacy is being ruined and there is no way anybody can argue that. 

I will absolutely argue with that. In terms of boxing did Ali ruin his legacy losing 3 of his last 4 matches? He regularly wins greatest sportsman ever polls and it's hardly mentioned.

When Taker finally hangs up his boots the last few years will be completely glossed over.

[Andre91]

2 minutes ago, pink_triangle said:

I will absolutely argue with that. In terms of boxing did Ali ruin his legacy losing 3 of his last 4 matches? He regularly wins greatest sportsman ever polls and it's hardly mentioned.

When Taker finally hangs up his boots the last few years will be completely glossed over.

I have no idea about boxing as it’s not something I’ve ever been hugely interested in. 

The Undertaker is tarnishing his legacy. End. 

[pink_triangle]

26 minutes ago, Andre91 said:

I have no idea about boxing as it’s not something I’ve ever been hugely interested in. 

The Undertaker is tarnishing his legacy. End. 

I don't think you need to know anything about boxing to know that Ali has a huge legacy. When I tell you that he spent the end of his career losing and chasing the money this tells you everything about how sporting legacies are written.

Wrestling (and sport in general)  is full of people who have gone on too long, chasing that one last moment in the spotlight and one last pay cheque. People moan at the time, but have very short memories.

When Taker calls it a day he will still be called the greatest gimmick of all time, will still go in the WWE hall of fame, will still command huge fees and long queues for photos and autographs. History shows us people conveniently forget in these situations.

[jump]

48 minutes ago, pink_triangle said:

What are the Japanese crowds like in general. I find the WWE "this is awesome", "you deserved this crowd" play a big part in ruining the matches to me. Also do they do many kick outs of finishes? Again another thing that annoys me about modern WWE.

In Japan it's considered disrespectful to chant but there's big "ooh", "ahh" etc reactions from the crowd. I personally like the rowdiness of western audiences myself, when there's something to actually be excited about it can lead to some magic moments.

Yeah, finishers are more protected but there are still kick outs, in New Japan at least as there's multiple Japanese promotions.

On the topic of New Japan I'm happy they haven't just dumped Jon Moxley straight into the Bullet Club because he's gaijin. Touches like him helping his opponent to that back after wrestling like heel wouldn't feel the same if he was apart of the Club.

 

1 minute ago, pink_triangle said:

I don't think you need to know anything about boxing to know that Ali has a huge legacy. When I tell you that he spent the end of his career losing and chasing the money this tells you everything about how sporting legacies are written.

Wrestling (and sport in general)  is full of people who have gone on too long, chasing that one last moment in the spotlight and one last pay cheque. People moan at the time, but have very short memories.

When Taker calls it a day he will still be called the greatest gimmick of all time, will still go in the WWE hall of fame, will still command huge fees and long queues for photos and autographs. History shows us people conveniently forget in these situations.

'taker needs to get to that point first and if he carries on there's a real possibility he will die in the ring.

[When Jokers Attack]

1 hour ago, pink_triangle said:

What are the Japanese crowds like in general. I find the WWE "this is awesome", "you deserved this crowd" play a big part in ruining the matches to me. Also do they do many kick outs of finishes? Again another thing that annoys me about modern WWE.

On one of the tours last month there was a couple of american fans chanting at everything to the point it was ruining the show. they tried it again the next night and think they got a talking to as they eventually stopped. There are chants in japan, mainly for the wrestlers name, and reactions to the moves, not to try get themselves  over like in the west. Japanese crowds are actually loud as fuck, check out any All Japan 90's big match involving Misawa, Kobashi, Kawada etc, some of the loudest ever. Great example here...

New Japan crowd are usually hot too but it depends on the venue, they were very good at the show today as was a major show.

Dominon was a very good show today. Jericho/Okada was very good overall but nothing special considering it was an Okada title match. Naito/Ibushi need to tone it down, Ibushi could have ended up in a wheelchair. Ospreay stole the show again, his match on wednesday with Shingo is probably in my top 5 of all time. If anyone hasn't seen it go out of your way to watch it, Also it had a hot hot crowd.

 

Kenta (Hideo Itami) debuted today and announced he will be in the G1 Climax. Moxley has been great so far.

Finishers are rarely kicked out of, Kenny Omega's One Winged Angel, AJ Styles clash were never kicked out of once in their Japan run. Okada's Rainmaker has only been kicked out of a few times.

[pink_triangle]

1 hour ago, jump said:

In Japan it's considered disrespectful to chant but there's big "ooh", "ahh" etc reactions from the crowd. I personally like the rowdiness of western audiences myself, when there's something to actually be excited about it can lead to some magic moments.

I have no problem with crowds being loud when it's an organic thing, a hot crowd can really make a match. When they shout "this is awesome" every other spot or CM Punk for no reason it's just the crowd trying to get itself over.

[jump]

I've just finished reading AJ Lee's autobiography, she worked fucking hard to get into WWE. She talks about having to stab crackheads from breaking into her house on Xmas, starving herself to afford the WWE try out fee, how she was diagnosed as depressed but was actually bipolar so the meds fucked her up.

There's also an interesting tidbit about how CM Punk (before they each other) was watching a women's match at a house show, called it shit and said to get some women who can actually wrestle so the road agent Fit Finlay put AJ in last minute which was well received. She contributes it as saving her from being cut from the development system.

It was a very enjoyable read as she lets her personality shine when she (rather than a ghost writer) wrote it but decided to stay classy and positive by not naming names (like not naming the talent relations guy who told her she was unfuckable therefore not suited to WWE) and dishing dirt (I wanted to know about the heat with the Bellas) whilst good for her it's abit disappointing.  

Also WWE is still shit.

[WS_Jack_III]

Been out of the loop a while now but just caught up on the Firefly funhouse stuff. Absolutely brilliant! Do the muscle man dance!

[Andre91]

LOL.

Product is in the toilet so let’s rely on the decrepit old corpse who almost killed his opponent the other week  

[pink_triangle]

On 6/20/2019 at 3:44 PM, WS_Jack_III said:

Been out of the loop a while now but just caught up on the Firefly funhouse stuff. Absolutely brilliant! Do the muscle man dance!

I'm currently on a WWE break , will probably renew my network before SummerSlam. The Firefly funhouse stuff is good, but not sure how it will translate into feuds/matches. WWE have never known how to book Bray.