Benj Posted July 14, 2014 Report Share Posted July 14, 2014 I'd say they are - for the mo, at least. However, they're also the only club who can realistically do much the same as Utd, because their profile outstrips their success. (If that wasn't the case with Utd, Chelsea and City would now be much the same, and not instead a long way short). Interestingly, LFC under Fenway's ownership seem to be more successful than Utd at penetrating the USA's population, so it could be quite interesting a few years on from here. In my experience of talking 'soccer' over there to folk who have little interest they've all heard of 'Manchester' whilst pretty much none have heard of Liverpool, which is only know for the Beatles Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonTom Posted July 14, 2014 Report Share Posted July 14, 2014 That's pointless for increasing competition, unless the 'surplus' to what gets spent on players gets taken from the club for the benefit of other teams. Could use the surplus to go back into a pot to bring down ticket prices for fans across the league! I think thats the rub for me (outside of smaller teams being able to compete), the amount fans have to pay yet even at a club like West Ham that actual gate income is dwarfed by TV and sponsorship deals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thetime Posted July 14, 2014 Report Share Posted July 14, 2014 Could use the surplus to go back into a pot to bring down ticket prices for fans across the league! . TV money keeps going up, do we see a reduction in ticket prices? I've just paid 30 quid for a united friendly, a friendly.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGayTent Posted July 14, 2014 Author Report Share Posted July 14, 2014 Paying TV subscriptions is a bigger issue... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thetime Posted July 14, 2014 Report Share Posted July 14, 2014 Well, while people keep paying it.... Oh yes !! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eFestivals Posted July 14, 2014 Report Share Posted July 14, 2014 In my experience of talking 'soccer' over there to folk who have little interest they've all heard of 'Manchester' whilst pretty much none have heard of Liverpool, which is only know for the Beatlesthere's been 20 years of sustained success (and yanks love a winner), coupled with being the first club in american ownership by a number of years. They've got a big head start.I wasn't saying that Liverpool had penetrated as far, I was saying they're better at penetrating. As they're starting from almost nothing they still have a long way to go.They get that better penetration because (this is one way of putting it) Henry is more of a media-whore than the Glazers are, and they get coverage on that basis.A few years from now that might make things interesting - but it'll also need Liverpool to win things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benj Posted July 14, 2014 Report Share Posted July 14, 2014 (edited) there's been 20 years of sustained success (and yanks love a winner), coupled with being the first club in american ownership by a number of years. They've got a big head start. I wasn't saying that Liverpool had penetrated as far, I was saying they're better at penetrating. As they're starting from almost nothing they still have a long way to go. They get that better penetration because (this is one way of putting it) Henry is more of a media-whore than the Glazers are, and they get coverage on that basis. A few years from now that might make things interesting - but it'll also need Liverpool to win things. Most of my time in the US is spent in Boston (my wife is from there, so I'm there 2-3 times a year), you'd have thought it would be there if anywhere they would have been slightly known through their ownership but no one on a casual basis is slightly interested. So from my experience, outside of niche soccer circles at least, there has been pretty much zero penetration for LFC through their American Ownership. Its Manchester and Beckham and pretty much nothing whatsoever else. As you say if they win everything for a decade or they have a load of US players play for them maybe they'll become known. They don't bother with their own teams when they're not winning over there so some soccer team from the UK, full of Johnny Foreigner has no chance unless its winning regularly, whoever owns it Within the soccer supporting/ intereseted niche I reckon the likes of Everton and Fulham aren't far behind over there in regards to recognition and fans simply because a number of US players have played for them over the years. Having Tim Howard in the side will garner far more publicity than the fact that you're owned by a US corporation Edited July 14, 2014 by Benj Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eFestivals Posted July 14, 2014 Report Share Posted July 14, 2014 Most of my time in the US is spent in Boston (my wife is from there, so I'm there 2-3 times a year), you'd have thought it would be there if anywhere they would have been slightly known through their ownership but no one on a casual basis is slightly interested. So from my experience, outside of niche soccer circles at least, there has been pretty much zero penetration for LFC through their American Ownership.I guess it depends what you're viewing from which to form an opinion. I've got the impression I have from media mentions that come past my eyes, which I never saw for Liverpool prior to Fenway (except perhaps at the very worst moment of the H&G meltdown).Spent a couple of weeks in Boston (working there, staying in Andover) about 15 years back. Still haven't quite worked out if I liked it or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benj Posted July 14, 2014 Report Share Posted July 14, 2014 I guess it depends what you're viewing from which to form an opinion. I've got the impression I have from media mentions that come past my eyes, which I never saw for Liverpool prior to Fenway (except perhaps at the very worst moment of the H&G meltdown). Spent a couple of weeks in Boston (working there, staying in Andover) about 15 years back. Still haven't quite worked out if I liked it or not. Its a nice enough City, essentially its pretty dull though, would certainly recommend many others in the US to visit beforehand myself. Hopefully its a nice place to live/ work though, as I suspect I'll end up there at some point or other if my missus has her way. I don't personally think that 'Soccer', and the premier league in general will ever be a huge market worth chasing in the US, even for the super clubs. There's just too much competition from established sports there, it would be like expecting NFL to become huge here, it will always be a minority sport even if they did set up a franchise in London. They should stick to promoting themselves in the Asian markets, where there is very little competition and they lap up products from abroad, unlike the US which in the main are a hugely insular bunch on that front. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eFestivals Posted July 14, 2014 Report Share Posted July 14, 2014 Its a nice enough City, essentially its pretty dull thoughdull is a word I'd use, yup. Still, I wasn't there thru choice. I don't personally think that 'Soccer', and the premier league in general will ever be a huge market worth chasing in the US, even for the super clubs. There's just too much competition from established sports there, it would be like expecting NFL to become huge here, it will always be a minority sport even if they did set up a franchise in London.Hmmm, not sure about that. Interest is growing in footie in general. One of the USA WC matches broke the TV viewing audience record for (I think it was) baseball.English teams might never get the mass appeal in the USA they might get in Asia, tho I suspect they might end up quite even in the profits stakes due to charging premium prices in the states.They should stick to promoting themselves in the Asian markets, where there is very little competition and they lap up products from abroad, unlike the US which in the main are a hugely insular bunch on that front.my own impression is that they're quite over-awed by the athleticism of footie, because their own sports are slow &/or stop-start, and that's why it's slowly penetrating, along with it being a major sport for little kids over there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wooderson Posted July 14, 2014 Report Share Posted July 14, 2014 Rumours of Vidal to Utd gaining traction? He'd be a fun addition to the league nae doubts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eFestivals Posted July 14, 2014 Report Share Posted July 14, 2014 Rumours of Vidal to Utd gaining traction?it was in the same Guardian gossip page as Rues, this morning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thetime Posted July 14, 2014 Report Share Posted July 14, 2014 Rumours of Vidal to Utd gaining traction? He'd be a fun addition to the league nae doubts. It's been a rumour for a while, still can't see it though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gucci Piggy Posted July 14, 2014 Report Share Posted July 14, 2014 There's a BT Sport match about the Chelsea vs. Arsenal match now :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benj Posted July 14, 2014 Report Share Posted July 14, 2014 dull is a word I'd use, yup. Still, I wasn't there thru choice. Hmmm, not sure about that. Interest is growing in footie in general. One of the USA WC matches broke the TV viewing audience record for (I think it was) baseball. English teams might never get the mass appeal in the USA they might get in Asia, tho I suspect they might end up quite even in the profits stakes due to charging premium prices in the states. my own impression is that they're quite over-awed by the athleticism of footie, because their own sports are slow &/or stop-start, and that's why it's slowly penetrating, along with it being a major sport for little kids over there. There's no doubt it will grow, its hard to fathom it getting anywhere near NFL for regular viewing numbers or overall baseball numbers (each game has a low audience as there's so many, add them up though and its huge). The Superbowl got 5x as many viewers as the record world cup fixture which shows how far behind they are, I know its not quite the same but if you compare the FA Cup final viewing numbers to an England fixture here it would give it some context. The average premier league audience over there is less than a 40th of those who bothered to watch that USA match. Still decent numbers and interestingly significantly more than the MLS, which is what I think may well hold it back Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thetime Posted July 14, 2014 Report Share Posted July 14, 2014 There's no doubt it will grow, its hard to fathom it getting anywhere near NFL for regular viewing numbers or overall baseball numbers (each game has a low audience as there's so many, add them up though and its huge). The Superbowl got 5x as many viewers as the record world cup fixture which shows how far behind they are, I know its not quite the same but if you compare the FA Cup final viewing numbers to an England fixture here it would give it some context. The average premier league audience over there is less than a 40th of those who bothered to watch that USA match. Still decent numbers and interestingly significantly more than the MLS, which is what I think may well hold it back Doesn't help football over there when they suddenly start franchises(Becks New venture) or move teams hundreds of miles away. The distance between teams can't help either for fans getting to away games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eFestivals Posted July 14, 2014 Report Share Posted July 14, 2014 The average premier league audience over there is less than a 40th of those who bothered to watch that USA match.I wouldn't think it's much different in the UK, is it? I'd actually think it would be a smaller proportion than that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomThomDrum Posted July 14, 2014 Report Share Posted July 14, 2014 Doesn't help football over there when they suddenly start franchises(Becks New venture) or move teams hundreds of miles away. The distance between teams can't help either for fans getting to away games. That's the American way. That won't affect football over there at all They do that for all their sports. Fans have teams and tonnes are not from were these teams play. For instance, the Green Bay Packers will garuntee a sell out for any away game across the US because they have a massive fan base across the US and not just from Wisconsin. I work with a guy now and then who lives in LA who has a season ticket for the Dallas Cowboys. What happens in the England/Europe with football fans will not translate in the US. They simply consume their sport differently and it's football in the US that has to adapt to that to make it successful over there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrtourette Posted July 15, 2014 Report Share Posted July 15, 2014 (edited) While that's absolutely true of American sports (some also have a bizarre tendency to follow players from their college teams and follow whichever pro team their favourite player is playing for, thus switching teams if that player moves, or to have more than one favourite team) US football fans have tried to instil a different attitude ever since the MLS was created and while support is smaller it generally tends to be more fervent and (what we would see as) loyal in order to follow the model of the rest of the world and to give the game more credibility. You're right that franchises will still be moved and created and they will always use the draft system but due to that relatively poor popularity of the MLS compared to the NFL or NBA it's unlikely that moving an MLS franchise will be as seamless as in those other sports as there isn't an obvious market desperate for a MLS team ready to fill a stadium should a team be moved into town, and support is far more localised than Green Bay, Pittsburgh or Dallas fans being spread around the country. Edited July 15, 2014 by mrtourette Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strummer77 Posted July 15, 2014 Report Share Posted July 15, 2014 (edited) Most of my time in the US is spent in Boston (my wife is from there, so I'm there 2-3 times a year), you'd have thought it would be there if anywhere they would have been slightly known through their ownership but no one on a casual basis is slightly interested. So from my experience, outside of niche soccer circles at least, there has been pretty much zero penetration for LFC through their American Ownership. Within the soccer supporting/ intereseted niche I reckon the likes of Everton and Fulham aren't far behind over there in regards to recognition and fans simply because a number of US players have played for them over the years. Having Tim Howard in the side will garner far more publicity than the fact that you're owned by a US corporation Liverpool are the second most watched British team on average in the US - so not sure this is quite true. United > Liverpool = Chelsea > everybody else it seems. http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/soccer/2014/05/15/manchester-united-most-watched-epl-team-on-us-tv/9122461/ Edited July 15, 2014 by strummer77 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wooderson Posted July 15, 2014 Report Share Posted July 15, 2014 £57 odd mill spent by LFC already. Louvren and Bony seem like the next two on the list. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomThomDrum Posted July 15, 2014 Report Share Posted July 15, 2014 £57 odd mill spent by LFC already. Louvren and Bony seem like the next two on the list. I bloody well hope Rodgers can manage this and they don't do a friggin Spurs! Legitimate fear.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wooderson Posted July 15, 2014 Report Share Posted July 15, 2014 Apart from Lallana none of these players make first 11. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thetime Posted July 15, 2014 Report Share Posted July 15, 2014 Apart from Lallana none of these players make first 11. 80-90m on squad players seems a lot of money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gucci Piggy Posted July 15, 2014 Report Share Posted July 15, 2014 80-90m on squad players seems a lot of money. Better than the Carroll/Downing phase to be fair Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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