Bullying

[Yoghurt on a Stick]

Do you think there's more bullying nowadays, or is it just the reporting of bullying? I suppose with social media, youngsters can't even escape to their own bedrooms to get away from it.

[feral chile]

Do you think there's more bullying nowadays, or is it just the reporting of bullying? I suppose with social media, youngsters can't even escape to their own bedrooms to get away from it.

I think we're more aware of it because of the internet, and that's a mixed blessing, it makes it more difficult to escape it, but also easier for those on power to be brought to justice. Look at Operation Yewtree - it's good that victims feel safe to come forward now, but also it's easy to put an innocent name out there, too.

Edited February 3, 2015 by feral chile

[eFestivals]

I had to open a photobucket account to share my own photos, I don't think there's another way.

yeah there is, you can upload photos to this website by clicking on the 'gallery' tab at the top of the page.

[mrtourette]

It's not what you tell them, it's how you tell them.

You can tell someone they're wrong and therefore question and undermine them without bullying or harrassing, but how it's done often it crosses the line. Unfortunately the person often focuses on what they're saying and it not being unreasonable rather than how they're saying it, which is often the offensive aspect, and therefore doesn't (won't?) understand what they're actually doing. You can continually tell me I'm wrong and that isn't bullying or harrassment, there's nothing wrong with being challenged. However if you continually tell me I'm wrong while mocking, using offensive names/slurs and inventing things or creating false suggestions just to defame character, and that's something completely different.

The important thing to remember is that it isn't up to the person being accused to decide whether it's bullying or not. Too often the defense is "I'm not bullying, I'm just telling it like it is". Unfortunately it's up to the person on the receiving end to decide of it's bullying or harrassment. It's no different to the "I wasn't being homophobic, I used that term in a friendly way" or "I wasn't being racist, I'm old school, it was a common phrase in my day but it doesn't mean anything". It's up to the person who is the target of comments or actions to decide whether it's offensive or not, and that to be respected.

[feral chile]

yeah there is, you can upload photos to this website by clicking on the 'gallery' tab at the top of the page.

Ah thanks neil, I'll try that next time.

[Spindles]

When I was in middle school one of my classmates used to enjoy knocking me down and getting me in wrestling holds where I would panic and couldn't breathe, he loved to humiliate me and the worse I reacted the more he clearly enjoyed it. At the end of the 2nd year one lunchtime I was climbing over a wall to go to the shop and he shoved me off so I landed face first on the path on the other side. I saw red and pasted the living shit out of him. His mum phoned me the next day, when he hadn't come to school, to tell me that he wasn't coming back to the school because I was bullying him and wanted me to apologise, which I refused to do. He never did come back, going instead to a private school some miles away.

Sometimes I think about this. Somewhere there is someone who probably feels his childhood was wrecked by being bullied, simply because after 2 years I finally fought back. Am I bully? Was I wrong to have done this? It's the only time in my life I have ever hit anyone in anger.

[feral chile]

It's not what you tell them, it's how you tell them.

You can tell someone they're wrong and therefore question and undermine them without bullying or harrassing, but how it's done often it crosses the line. Unfortunately the person often focuses on what they're saying and it not being unreasonable rather than how they're saying it, which is often the offensive aspect, and therefore doesn't (won't?) understand what they're actually doing. You can continually tell me I'm wrong and that isn't bullying or harrassment, there's nothing wrong with being challenged. However if you continually tell me I'm wrong while mocking, using offensive names/slurs and inventing things or creating false suggestions just to defame character, and that's something completely different.

The important thing to remember is that it isn't up to the person being accused to decide whether it's bullying or not. Too often the defense is "I'm not bullying, I'm just telling it like it is". Unfortunately it's up to the person on the receiving end to decide of it's bullying or harrassment. It's no different to the "I wasn't being homophobic, I used that term in a friendly way" or "I wasn't being racist, I'm old school, it was a common phrase in my day but it doesn't mean anything". It's up to the person who is the target of comments or actions to decide whether it's offensive or not, and that to be respected.

That's how I feel about it. Nobody can know how their words or actions will affect someone, but if we gave honest feedback, but once we know, we should try to make amends.

It's difficult though, because none of us wants to think of ourselves as a bad person, so we tend t deny the other person's reaction as reasonable. And someone genuinely trying to undermine someone will do that anyway.

Humour is one that often gets overlooked. 'I was only joking' is the classic defence of the passive-aggressive.

[feral chile]

When I was in middle school one of my classmates used to enjoy knocking me down and getting me in wrestling holds where I would panic and couldn't breathe, he loved to humiliate me and the worse I reacted the more he clearly enjoyed it. At the end of the 2nd year one lunchtime I was climbing over a wall to go to the shop and he shoved me off so I landed face first on the path on the other side. I saw red and pasted the living shit out of him. His mum phoned me the next day, when he hadn't come to school, to tell me that he wasn't coming back to the school because I was bullying him and wanted me to apologise, which I refused to do. He never did come back, going instead to a private school some miles away.

Sometimes I think about this. Somewhere there is someone who probably feels his childhood was wrecked by being bullied, simply because after 2 years I finally fought back. Am I bully? Was I wrong to have done this? It's the only time in my life I have ever hit anyone in anger.

I struggle with this. I have a pathological hatred of bullies, and have to try to control myself when speaking to them. I try to remember that a lot of them are the product of bullying themselves.

(I also did the same thing as you - but with boys).

Edited February 4, 2015 by feral chile

[eFestivals]

That's how I feel about it.

I wish that was also how you acted it.

[feral chile]

I wish that was also how you acted it.

You think not?

[eFestivals]

You think not?

you can read back on the 'general news' thread to find out.

Edited February 4, 2015 by eFestivals

[feral chile]

you can read back on the 'general news' thread to find out.

Would you like to expand?

[eFestivals]

Would you like to expand?

No.

But if you're going to rely on making up a false version of history to free yourself of your own errors, and won't read back to see what you actually did and why you created the spat that you did, I'm not going to give you a free pass on your reinvention of history.

So if you post more bullshit, you'll keep having me pointing that out.

[feral chile]

No.

But if you're going to rely on making up a false version of history to free yourself of your own errors, and won't read back to see what you actually did and why you created the spat that you did, I'm not going to give you a free pass on your reinvention of history.

So if you post more bullshit, you'll keep having me pointing that out.

Well I did post rather a lot in that thread, but can't remember making up history. Do yu mean history of society, or history of what was previously posted?

[kaosmark2]

When I was in middle school one of my classmates used to enjoy knocking me down and getting me in wrestling holds where I would panic and couldn't breathe, he loved to humiliate me and the worse I reacted the more he clearly enjoyed it. At the end of the 2nd year one lunchtime I was climbing over a wall to go to the shop and he shoved me off so I landed face first on the path on the other side. I saw red and pasted the living shit out of him. His mum phoned me the next day, when he hadn't come to school, to tell me that he wasn't coming back to the school because I was bullying him and wanted me to apologise, which I refused to do. He never did come back, going instead to a private school some miles away.

Sometimes I think about this. Somewhere there is someone who probably feels his childhood was wrecked by being bullied, simply because after 2 years I finally fought back. Am I bully? Was I wrong to have done this? It's the only time in my life I have ever hit anyone in anger.

I got bullied a lot. I fought back, and every single time I fought back, the gang of bullies reported me to the teachers for attacking them, and adjusted their stories in sync to ensure that I got in trouble. By accusing you of bullying, before you get your version in, deflects the initial perception of blame onto you, which will then be hard to shake, as everyone will go "well he's just lying to defend himself", whereas the actual case is that he did a pre-emptive lie.

Do NOT question your right to defend yourself, or feel guilty over it. I've spent years shaking the idea that every time I stand up for myself I've been in the wrong, and I hate the idea that anyone else would feel the slightest remorse about asserting their right to not be assaulted. It may not have been the best response - violence rarely (if ever) is - but you definitely needed to respond.

[eFestivals]

history of what was previously posted?

this ^^

You're still trying to rinse your wrong, and trying to use me as the fall guy for it.

You've managed to now spread it over several threads. Very well done.

You said something about "at least you didn't ban me". Perhaps consider why I should put up with what you're doing?

[feral chile]

I got bullied a lot. I fought back, and every single time I fought back, the gang of bullies reported me to the teachers for attacking them, and adjusted their stories in sync to ensure that I got in trouble. By accusing you of bullying, before you get your version in, deflects the initial perception of blame onto you, which will then be hard to shake, as everyone will go "well he's just lying to defend himself", whereas the actual case is that he did a pre-emptive lie.

Do NOT question your right to defend yourself, or feel guilty over it. I've spent years shaking the idea that every time I stand up for myself I've been in the wrong, and I hate the idea that anyone else would feel the slightest remorse about asserting their right to not be assaulted. It may not have been the best response - violence rarely (if ever) is - but you definitely needed to respond.

Yes, I know that defence, seen it in work situations. You just know they're waiting for you to retaliate, so they can bring in heavier authority to beat you with. They also use that tactic to stir up an angry mob.

These are people who are genuinely trying to undermine you, and I'm all for psychological resistance.

My daughter came home once, with a tale about one of the girls who everyone thought was aggressive. This was because, another girl kept making her the butt of her jokes, and when she reacted aggressively, their tormentor would use this to drag in everyone else for support (posse) 'can't take a joke' 'psycho' etc.

I pointed out to my daughter the tactics being used. it's a common strategy with serial bullies.

They needle and needle, then whichever way you react they claim victimhood - if you report them, they claim it's vexatious, if you're aggressive, they claim it's unprovoked.

Edited February 4, 2015 by feral chile

[feral chile]

this ^^

You're still trying to rinse your wrong, and trying to use me as the fall guy for it.

You've managed to now spread it over several threads. Very well done.

You said something about "at least you didn't ban me". Perhaps consider why I should put up with what you're doing?

?

I think you might be misjudging me, but if you'd like to be more specific, I'll certainly reassess what I'm posting.

Can I ask you a direct question. Are you saying that you feel bullied/personally attacked by me, since my apology?

I feel I've been trying not to escalate things ever since, but I would like to know if you feel I'm being unfair.

Edited February 4, 2015 by feral chile

[kaosmark2]

Yes, I know that defence, seen it in work situations. You just know they're waiting for you to retaliate, so they can bring in heavier authority to beat you with. They also use that tactic to stir up an angry mob.

These are people who are genuinely trying to undermine you, and I'm all for psychological resistance.

My daughter came home once, with a tale about one of the girls who everyone thought was aggressive. This was because, another girl kept making her the butt of her jokes, and when she reacted aggressively, their tormentor would use this to drag in everyone else for support (posse) 'can't take a joke' 'psycho' etc.

I pointed out to my daughter the tactics being used. it's a common strategy with serial bullies.

They needle and needle, then whichever way you react they claim victimhood - if you report them, they claim it's vexatious, if you're aggressive, they claim it's unprovoked.

Fucking shitbags.

[feral chile]

Fucking shitbags.

There are some effective ways to deal with them - I've found the most satisfying, but difficult, is to not let them get into your head, grin when they try to needle you, think to yourself they're tossers, and try not to let them infect you with their venom.

In a work situation, keep a diary of every time it's happened. Then approach the union, if you have one, or mediation, or counselling services, whatever support is available.

This one is more risky, because it can backfire. often, when you speak to others, you find out you're not the only one. And that can give emotional strength, and support for your case.

But it's risky, because once you bring it up with others, the bully can use it against you, and make it look like you're the one trying to stir things up for them, or paranoid etc.

Most people will back off if you politely let them know you're upset by something. It's only the genuinely vindictive people who need anything other than feedback of how their behaviour is affecting you.

Edited February 4, 2015 by feral chile

[eFestivals]

Are you saying that you feel bullied/personally attacked by me, since my apology?

Bullied no. I'm not cowering in the corner for anybody, which is why I'll always come back against the bullshit you're posting in try7ing to rinse your own past and use me as the fall guy for it.

Perhaps something to think over?

[feral chile]

Bullied no. I'm not cowering in the corner for anybody, which is why I'll always come back against the bullshit you're posting in try7ing to rinse your own past and use me as the fall guy for it.

Perhaps something to think over?

well I would if I understood what you're getting at.

What are you the fall guy for?

I accept your rejection of the bullying term as implying victimhood, but you do seem to be implying that I'm at least accusing you/attacking you/trying to victimise you.

What is it that you feel you're asserting yourself against?

[Yoghurt on a Stick]

When I was in middle school one of my classmates used to enjoy knocking me down and getting me in wrestling holds where I would panic and couldn't breathe, he loved to humiliate me and the worse I reacted the more he clearly enjoyed it. At the end of the 2nd year one lunchtime I was climbing over a wall to go to the shop and he shoved me off so I landed face first on the path on the other side. I saw red and pasted the living shit out of him. His mum phoned me the next day, when he hadn't come to school, to tell me that he wasn't coming back to the school because I was bullying him and wanted me to apologise, which I refused to do. He never did come back, going instead to a private school some miles away.

Sometimes I think about this. Somewhere there is someone who probably feels his childhood was wrecked by being bullied, simply because after 2 years I finally fought back. Am I bully? Was I wrong to have done this? It's the only time in my life I have ever hit anyone in anger.

Have you thought that you may just have provided that other lad with a great education than the one he was receiving academically at school? He may have stopped bullying once he knew that it could go wrong. Just a thought. In any case nobody could blame you for your actions.

I was never bullied at school really. There was one bloke who used to call me a thick Irish paddy because of my parents nationality, and because he happened to be right at the time as to my intelligence. The thing is it never actually bothered me - I simply didn't give a fuck what he came out with. Strange really because I bumped in to him a few times after we had left school and he was always pleasant to me. He's dead now of a heroin overdose. I only really think fondly of him.

Edited February 4, 2015 by Yoghurt on a Stick

[feral chile]

Have you thought that you may just have provided that other lad with a great education than the one he was receiving academically at school? He may have stopped bullying once he knew that it could go wrong. Just a thought. In any case nobody could blame you for your actions.

I was never bullied at school really. There was one bloke who used to call me a thick Irish paddy because of my parents nationality, and because he happened to be right at the time as to my intelligence. The thing is it never actually bothered me - I simply didn't give a fuck what he came out with. Strange really because I bumped in to him a few times after we had left school and he was always pleasant to me. He's dead now of a heroin overdose. I only really think fondly of him.

This^^^^ is the best defence. It's easier said than done though.

[eFestivals]

What is it that you feel you're asserting yourself against?

the bullshit that you're laying against me, still.