Don't vote Tory

[Rose-Colored Boy]

16 hours ago, timmy tugboat said:

Any pro hard Brexit left wing parties?

that wouldn't make any sense 

[Glastocat]

4 minutes ago, russycarps said:

your friends are thick c**ts.

 

Here's one of the all knowing people responsible for Brexit. Well done mate. Hope you and mister Cameron are happy.

 

[RichardWaller]

10 minutes ago, stuartbert two hats said:

Useful link:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/19_yf4RL133fBKscvSbID4eRKwztzY9KSI_2BMaI1bU8/htmlview?sle=true#

I hope we can keep the Tories out.. This is great, but weird at the same time. If people are going to be that tactical and vote for their second, third favourite or even the one they dislike second least, it's almost like No to AV never happened. 

[russycarps]

10 minutes ago, Glastocat said:

Here's one of the all knowing people responsible for Brexit. Well done mate. Hope you and mister Cameron are happy.

 

It's the thick c**ts like your friends who are responsible.

 

 

[RichardWaller]

19 minutes ago, russycarps said:

your friends are thick c**ts.

 

Haha, come on lad... Brexit and our relationship with the EU has never been simple and people had their reasons for voting either way. If you're gonna denounce a group of people who you've never met and don't know anything about, and have no idea why they voted the way they did as thick c*nts, how do you think that makes you look?

[phil the shrew]

Love the idea of debating politics and brexit in a meaningful, transparent and open way, but it's clear from last years referendum and subsequent events in government those days are gone. 

May's speech outside Downing Street is one of the scariest I've heard in 35 years following politics where anyone opposing her views is a traitor or trying to undermine her brilliant brexit plan (which no one has actually seen). 

Sadly for various reasons she'll win by a landslide and start the process of driving us off an economic cliff while the NHS and welfare state get hacked to pieces by her financial backers. All the while she will be looking for a minority or victim to blame when it all goes wrong

Thank goodness for a few days at Glastonbury after the election is all over. The next five years look bleak 

[Glastocat]

7 minutes ago, russycarps said:

It's the thick c**ts like your friends who are responsible.

 

 

No. At the end of the day there were always going to be people who held opposing views on how to take Britain forward. It was the people who were undecided who needed to be persuaded and guess what, it turns out calling anyone who doesn't agree totally with the remain voters thick c**ts isn't the best way to do it. Who'd of thought it.

@chatty 

[russycarps]

2 minutes ago, Glastocat said:

No. At the end of the day there were always going to be people who held opposing views on how to take Britain forward. It was the people who were undecided who needed to be persuaded and guess what, it turns out calling anyone who doesn't agree totally with the remain voters thick c**ts isn't the best way to do it. Who'd of thought it.

@chatty 

I'm calling them thick c**ts after the event.

The thick c**ts.

 

 

[Untz]

36 minutes ago, Zac Quinn said:

that wouldn't make any sense 

Why not? They would probably be away from the centre, but I don't see why they couldn't exist.

[Rose-Colored Boy]

12 minutes ago, Untz said:

Why not? They would probably be away from the centre, but I don't see why they couldn't exist.

The main things about a hard Brexit are curtailing immigration and pushing for nationalism regardless of the economic consequences, totally incompatiable with left wing ideology. Soft Brexit could in theory line up with left wing values - and as such that's what Labour are campaigning on - but given the Torys are in power and will be for the foreseeable future, supporting anything which will give them undiluted power to further wreck the country is pure madness from a leftie POV

Edited April 19, 2017 by Zac Quinn

[Untz]

3 minutes ago, Zac Quinn said:

The main things about a hard Brexit are curtailing immigration and pushing for nationalism regardless of the economic outcome, totally incompatiable with left wing ideology. Soft Brexit could in theory line up with left wing values - but given the Torys are in power and will be for the foreseeable future, supporting anything which will give them undiluted power to further wreck the country is pure madness from a leftie POV

Nationalism and limiting immigration aren't necessarily incompatible with left wing ideas though, just the modern very internationalist form of centre-left liberalism we have today. To give a very basic example, limiting immigration makes labour more scarce and so gives workers more negotiating power to improve their wages and working conditions.

I agree with your last point about giving the Tories more power. I feel that's a separate issue though.

[siblin]

 

17 hours ago, timmy tugboat said:

Any pro hard Brexit left wing parties?

 

1 hour ago, Zac Quinn said:

that wouldn't make any sense 

Unfortunately thats not true.  The Left-of-left wing of the Labour party (The branch John McDonnel and Mr Corbyn are part of) have traditionally always been euroskeptic and anti free-trade.  They see free movement and free trade as neo-liberal instruments which benefit multinationals more than individuals.  This is why Corbyn was reluctant and often absent during the referendum campaign, and even described himself as reluctant.  I consider myself a leftie but accept the requirements of a globalised world, and enjoy personal liberty given to me as a European citizen, which is why i'm not particularly happy with the labour party currently.   Don't worry though, won't be voting Tory!

[ivan]

21 hours ago, russycarps said:

Signed. Anyone voting tory is a massive, massive c**t. Anyone here considering doing this dastardly deed, know that's what you are.

Let us pray that harridan May has misjudged the countries mood and gets a bloody nose. 

There is still a tiny glimmer of hope. A grand coalition could bring those c**ts down.

 

 

Its nice to know that we live in a country where russycarps can post that sort of thing without fear of reprisals to him or his family.

Sorry if I don't offer to move to Syria , China or Russia to test that theory out !

[Mardy]

The thing is with all this 'lets not call brexiters/tories c**ts, lets instead try to understand them' is that these people have made my life substantially worse, they've done genuine harm to me and my family.

And i'm pretty sure if someone comes to you and gives you a big old punch in the cobblers you're not going to be 'well, i'm sure they had their reasons, and we shouldn't just condemn them but instead try to see their point of view'

[chatty]

2 hours ago, Glastocat said:

No. At the end of the day there were always going to be people who held opposing views on how to take Britain forward. It was the people who were undecided who needed to be persuaded and guess what, it turns out calling anyone who doesn't agree totally with the remain voters thick c**ts isn't the best way to do it. Who'd of thought it.

@chatty 

Ah the good old, dont agree with me and ill call you a bunch of names argument that has proven to be so brilliant. 

Honestly, I think the left probably pushed Brexit into happening with those tactics. It clearly had a lot of undecided voters but instead of inviting them into civil debate and showing them why they should vote against a large portion just abused them till they got their backs up and voted for leaving. 

Its the worst method of debate out there because for one you dont nake any points to change their mind and secondly by abusing people you just make them feel more rightful in their choice and stick to their guns. 

Worst thing in recent elections is that people cant dind any middle ground. Its either everyone falls on one side or the other without giving anything at all to the other side. Politics cant work like that, it needs converstauon, real debate and willingness to compromise to find neutral ground on many points of both sides of the argument. 

Its obviously not all people on the left and obviously the right do it as well but calling people racists, thicketc because you dont agree is thwarting your own argument and makes you look a little pathetic at the same time. 

Funny thing is both sides of the spectrum whinge at the other side for doing it whilst continuing to do it themselves. Its bizarre and why the country is in political ruin. 

Its also easy to exploit which has been proven time and again over many decades. 

[chatty]

38 minutes ago, Mardy said:

The thing is with all this 'lets not call brexiters/tories c**ts, lets instead try to understand them' is that these people have made my life substantially worse, they've done genuine harm to me and my family.

And i'm pretty sure if someone comes to you and gives you a big old punch in the cobblers you're not going to be 'well, i'm sure they had their reasons, and we shouldn't just condemn them but instead try to see their point of view'

Its not so much the hard right you should be trying to convince though but the centre. The undecided usually have a big sway so anyone remotely right who could be converted more left or central would be a huge gain in restoring a better political climate. 

Plus many tory voters and most likely the majority dont wish ill on the other side or cause harm, they just vote what they think is in their best interest or what they think will make the country better. 

They may well be wrong on many topics but calling them c**ts isnt gonna show them the error of theor ways. 

This has been a main gripe of mine in politics for a while and has proven to be the decisive factor in gaining power to the Tories/Brexit/UKIP etc for the last fifteen years. 

It needa to change otherwise the gap will continue to largen. 

[Jamie D]

31 minutes ago, Mardy said:

The thing is with all this 'lets not call brexiters/tories c**ts, lets instead try to understand them' is that these people have made my life substantially worse, they've done genuine harm to me and my family.

And i'm pretty sure if someone comes to you and gives you a big old punch in the cobblers you're not going to be 'well, i'm sure they had their reasons, and we shouldn't just condemn them but instead try to see their point of view'

True. But...

My big issue with politics at the moment is the way it's dividing people. People aren't just angry with politicians, people are angry with each other. All over the world people are being split down the middle and in a way being encouraged to abuse each other.

Name calling like "remoaners", "remainiacs", "libtards", "snowflakes"... might not seem like much but it just seems like we're moving in a dangerous direction where this is being normalised and seems ok. The usual suspects in the media are partly responsible.

Basically, I don't want to be a part of that. People can have different opinions and a good debate/borderline argument is healthy but getting abusive is not.

[Tartan_Glasto]

2 hours ago, phil the shrew said:

Love the idea of debating politics and brexit in a meaningful, transparent and open way, but it's clear from last years referendum and subsequent events in government those days are gone. 

May's speech outside Downing Street is one of the scariest I've heard in 35 years following politics where anyone opposing her views is a traitor or trying to undermine her brilliant brexit plan (which no one has actually seen). 

Sadly for various reasons she'll win by a landslide and start the process of driving us off an economic cliff while the NHS and welfare state get hacked to pieces by her financial backers. All the while she will be looking for a minority or victim to blame when it all goes wrong

Thank goodness for a few days at Glastonbury after the election is all over. The next five years look bleak 

This. I couldn't believe the words coming out her mouth.

The Tories aren't going to lose, she's way ahead in the polls. However, in an attempt to oust the Tory party, a vote for anyone other than Labour will be a wasted vote.

[russycarps]

10 minutes ago, chatty said:

Ah the good old, dont agree with me and ill call you a bunch of names argument that has proven to be so brilliant. 

Honestly, I think the left probably pushed Brexit into happening with those tactics. It clearly had a lot of undecided voters but instead of inviting them into civil debate and showing them why they should vote against a large portion just abused them till they got their backs up and voted for leaving. 

Its the worst method of debate out there because for one you dont nake any points to change their mind and secondly by abusing people you just make them feel more rightful in their choice and stick to their guns. 

Worst thing in recent elections is that people cant dind any middle ground. Its either everyone falls on one side or the other without giving anything at all to the other side. Politics cant work like that, it needs converstauon, real debate and willingness to compromise to find neutral ground on many points of both sides of the argument. 

Its obviously not all people on the left and obviously the right do it as well but calling people racists, thicketc because you dont agree is thwarting your own argument and makes you look a little pathetic at the same time. 

Funny thing is both sides of the spectrum whinge at the other side for doing it whilst continuing to do it themselves. Its bizarre and why the country is in political ruin. 

Its also easy to exploit which has been proven time and again over many decades. 

This is complete and utter bollocks.

The undecideds were persuaded to vote leave by lies about the NHS and lies which preyed on their racist instincts.

Lies which they believed because they are thick c**ts.

 

[phil the shrew]

49 minutes ago, Mardy said:

The thing is with all this 'lets not call brexiters/tories c**ts, lets instead try to understand them' is that these people have made my life substantially worse, they've done genuine harm to me and my family.

And i'm pretty sure if someone comes to you and gives you a big old punch in the cobblers you're not going to be 'well, i'm sure they had their reasons, and we shouldn't just condemn them but instead try to see their point of view'

And let's not forget the media's role in dumbing down debate. At the last election we had Milliband ridiculed for eating a bacon sandwich, a vile attack on his father for being a traitor to Britain and attacks on female Labour politicians for the way they looked

Large numbers of people in the U.K. lap that up as fact whilst totally oblivious to the way the Tories have been shafting them for the last decade. It's a fantastic trick to play yet millions fall for it. I don't think name calling helps but it's so frustrating seeing that kind of dross get regurgitated as facts I can see why people get so frustrated

[shuttlep]

2 hours ago, russycarps said:

I'm calling them thick c**ts after the event.

The thick c**ts.

 

 

Think c**ts is a bit harsh

 

uneducated cock wombles , more like it

[Jamie D]

Just to add something else that I believe has been responsible for many misguided votes, read this if you have a spare 20 minutes...

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/feb/26/robert-mercer-breitbart-war-on-media-steve-bannon-donald-trump-nigel-farage

In a nutshell, a billionaire with ties to Trump and Farage has allegedly been responsible for creating huge numbers of very intelligent social media bots that have created pro Trump and pro Brexit narratives.

Absolutely terrifying stuff.

[Lad]

3 hours ago, Zac Quinn said:

that wouldn't make any sense 

 

33 minutes ago, russycarps said:

This is complete and utter bollocks.

The undecideds were persuaded to vote leave by lies about the NHS and lies which preyed on their racist instincts.

Lies which they believed because they are thick c**ts.

 

Spoken like the entitled middle class gobshite you are.

[russycarps]

1 minute ago, Lad said:

 

Spoken like the entitled middle class gobshite you are.

Ladies and gentleman, the king of the thick c**ts has entered the building.

 

[Lad]

5 minutes ago, russycarps said:

Ladies and gentleman, the king of the thick c**ts has entered the building.

 

Any news on your imaginary family?I've told you just how essential to brexit were stuck up their own arse big heads.So cheers Tarquin.

Edited April 19, 2017 by Lad