Football 18/19

[The Nal]

20 minutes ago, thetime said:

Think that was just Nal wasn’t it? Can’t remember any other united fan on here who that it was a good appointment. 

Well theres only about 3 Utd fans on here. Everyone was saying it'll be 2 and a half to 3 years (including me) and that was accepted. Come in, do a job, leave a stronger squad behind and leave. 

He still won 2 trophies year 1, got Utd back into the Champions League and if he fucked off in June he could have left a team that finished a solid 2nd there for a new long term manager. 

3rd season meltdown though, clockwork isn't it?

9 minutes ago, jyoung said:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-6507475/Manchester-United-star-Paul-Pogba-deletes-Instagram-post-reacting-Jose-Mourinho-sacking.html

Pogba is training at the moment. It was an Adidas post which was clearly mistimed and deleted. 

Carrick doesn't have a pro licence though no. 

[zahidf]

Manchester United need a manager who understands the club and its history, and knows how to avoid relegation. Mark Hughes is available.

 

[kaosmark2]

19 minutes ago, The Nal said:

leave a stronger squad behind 

How often has he done that?

Porto, first stint at Chelsea, and.... that's it?

[thetime]

8 minutes ago, kaosmark2 said:

How often has he done that?

Porto, first stint at Chelsea, and.... that's it?

Inter?

[kaosmark2]

1 minute ago, thetime said:

Inter?

Was it stronger when he left? He made it stronger initially, but it was an aging squad and the next manager couldn't replicate his successes.

[thetime]

9 minutes ago, kaosmark2 said:

Was it stronger when he left? He made it stronger initially, but it was an aging squad and the next manager couldn't replicate his successes.

I would say Jose left Benitez a squad that just won the champions league. 

 

[zahidf]

 

[thetime]

Just now, zahidf said:

 

Would give united a free run for Pochettino. 

[The Nal]

57 minutes ago, kaosmark2 said:

How often has he done that?

Porto, first stint at Chelsea, and.... that's it?

He won the treble with Inter. Only Italian club ever to do it. He won the league 2 years in a row.  Left behind a team with Cesar, Quaresma, Maicon, Motta, Sneijder, Muntari, Cambiasso, Eto'o etc all in their prime in their 20s. 

Madrid. Narrowly finished 2nd and won the cup in the first season. Scored 102 goals. Won the league in his 2nd season by 9 points ahead of Barca with the amount of goals ever scored in the league (121), the most amount of wins, away wins and left Madrid after a 3rd season "meltdown" - got to the CL semi and finished 2nd - and left a great team behind.

So hes done it in most jobs hes had and fucked off. Hence my initial excitement.  

However, I'm not ruling out that hes becoming a dinosaur. 

Edited December 18, 2018 by The Nal

[The Nal]

Obvious example aside I can't think of many managers who have done it at the top for 15 years or so. Wenger didn't, Paisley didn't, Clough didn't, Capello didn't, Cruyff didnt, Mourinho would appear to be falling into the same category.

Ancelotti maybe? Jock Stein? Either way its a very short list. 

[Hugh Jass]

16 minutes ago, The Nal said:

Obvious example aside I can't think of many managers who have done it at the top for 15 years or so. Wenger didn't, Paisley didn't, Clough didn't, Capello didn't, Cruyff didnt, Mourinho would appear to be falling into the same category.

Ancelotti maybe? Jock Stein? Either way its a very short list. 

Guardiola has been doing it for ten years now.

[zahidf]

16 minutes ago, The Nal said:

Obvious example aside I can't think of many managers who have done it at the top for 15 years or so. Wenger didn't, Paisley didn't, Clough didn't, Capello didn't, Cruyff didnt, Mourinho would appear to be falling into the same category.

Ancelotti maybe? Jock Stein? Either way its a very short list. 

Pep would be up there. Wenger deserves more praise for managing to keep.arsenal in contention for almost 20 years or so. (Cladding contention as top 4/trophies)

[Wooderson]

Comparing current managerial crop to that of Clough, Stein, Paisley etc is an interesting one. Lets all look forward to someone capable taking over the reins at Old Trafford. United are needed to improve the general standard of what is a fucking abysmal league.

[kaosmark2]

1 hour ago, The Nal said:

Obvious example aside I can't think of many managers who have done it at the top for 15 years or so. Wenger didn't, Paisley didn't, Clough didn't, Capello didn't, Cruyff didnt, Mourinho would appear to be falling into the same category.

Ancelotti maybe? Jock Stein? Either way its a very short list. 

I think Wenger left behind a squad that was better than the results he was getting with it.

[The Nal]

1 hour ago, Hugh Jass said:

Guardiola has been doing it for ten years now.

He had to take a year off due to exhaustion after 4 years at Barca. Burned himself out. And he said in his first season at City that he was already eyeing up retirement. "I'm coming to the end of my coaching career" or something like that. Which is sort of my point. Managers shelf life at the top is quite short. Maybe Mourinho is coming to end/has come to the end of his at the top level.

Feel free to quote this when he wins the Champions League 1-0 with PSG in 2020! 

21 minutes ago, kaosmark2 said:

I think Wenger left behind a squad that was better than the results he was getting with it.

But didn't come close to challenging for the league in his last 12 or 13 seasons. And the squad he left won't either. 

[Hugh Jass]

32 minutes ago, The Nal said:

He had to take a year off due to exhaustion after 4 years at Barca. Burned himself out. And he said in his first season at City that he was already eyeing up retirement. "I'm coming to the end of my coaching career" or something like that. Which is sort of my point. Managers shelf life at the top is quite short. Maybe Mourinho is coming to end/has come to the end of his at the top level.

Feel free to quote this when he wins the Champions League 1-0 with PSG in 2020! 

 

The game changes and evolves over time and the best managers know when to change their styles to keep up with it (Fergie was great at this). Mourinho has always struck me as too arrogant and stubborn to change and as a result the game has moved on and left him behind.

[kaosmark2]

What does Guardiola have left to do after city? Italy maybe, but I'm not sure the league would suit him and its not the force it was. I can't really see him in international football. 

[Dan R]

9 minutes ago, kaosmark2 said:

What does Guardiola have left to do after city? Italy maybe, but I'm not sure the league would suit him and its not the force it was. I can't really see him in international football. 

Hasn't he said he wanted to coach Brazil at some point?

[kaosmark2]

3 minutes ago, Dan R said:

Hasn't he said he wanted to coach Brazil at some point?

Not that I heard about, but that doesn't mean it didn't happen.

I guess that's probably the job in international football that would suit him best. It's less part-time than lots of the big European jobs.

[thetime]

1 hour ago, Wooderson said:

Comparing current managerial crop to that of Clough, Stein, Paisley etc is an interesting one. Lets all look forward to someone capable taking over the reins at Old Trafford. United are needed to improve the general standard of what is a fucking abysmal league.

Even your Fergie’s and pep’s of the world, should never be put into the same category as shankly/Busby/Steins/clough 

[thetime]

22 minutes ago, Hugh Jass said:

The game changes and evolves over time and the best managers know when to change their styles to keep up with it (Fergie was great at this). Mourinho has always struck me as too arrogant and stubborn to change and as a result the game has moved on and left him behind.

To be fair jose won the league at Chelsea just befor Utd, I think that he’s been left behind is an over exaggeration.

did not work at Utd, there will be a few that fail at Utd for other reasons. 

[thetime]

Looks like it could be Ole Gunnar Solskjaer as interim. 

[Wooderson]

8 minutes ago, thetime said:

Even your Fergie’s and pep’s of the world, should never be put into the same category as shankly/Busby/Steins/clough 

The transformative impact these men had is pretty incomparable.

[thetime]

4 minutes ago, Wooderson said:

The transformative impact these men had is pretty incomparable.

At least we can agree on that. 

[The Nal]

50 minutes ago, Hugh Jass said:

The game changes and evolves over time and the best managers know when to change their styles to keep up with it (Fergie was great at this). Mourinho has always struck me as too arrogant and stubborn to change and as a result the game has moved on and left him behind.

I'm not sure he can do it. He never has before. Hes never built a team. 5 transfer windows at Utd, 11 players signed, 350 million. And plopsies. Zlatan the only good one. Although if he plays and stays fit I think Bailly could be great. 

Edited December 18, 2018 by The Nal