U.S. Presidential Election

[steviewevie]

26 minutes ago, FloopFiller said:

If the Dems had any hope of running an alternative candidate to Biden then they should’ve been sowing the seeds of it for the last four years, not four months away from the election. The few days post-debate is the first time I’ve thought that Trump might have a chance of winning, but… 

…ultimately, this is what it comes down to. Everybody knows what Trump is like and everybody has had eight years to decide if they’re with or against him and I doubt that single debate has budged anybody in either direction enough to decide the election results.
 

It sucks that Biden is clearly a shadow of his former self at this stage, and it’s a shame his ego wouldn’t allow himself to step aside and let somebody younger take his place, but then he did beat Trump in 2020 so I can understand why he believed he can do it again, and if it’s a feeble old man vs. a literal fascist (who also happens to be an old man) then I imagine the outcome is gonna be near identical to 2020, with Biden possibly even gaining a bigger advantage due to Trump becoming so unhinged in the last few years. 
 

As for if Biden does win, I do wonder if he’ll make it to the end of a second term. He’s always had his gaffes but his frailty and senior moments seem to be becoming the norm rather than occasional slip ups these days and has deteriorated pretty drastically over the last two years at least. 

People have forgotten or don't care how bad Trump was. There will always be an enthusiastic vote for Trump, not sure if there is enough enthusiasm to vote for Biden to stop Trump.

 

[FloopFiller]

9 hours ago, steviewevie said:

People have forgotten or don't care how bad Trump was. There will always be an enthusiastic vote for Trump, not sure if there is enough enthusiasm to vote for Biden to stop Trump.

 

Not a bad point - there does seem to be a weird case of people forgetting what a disaster Trump was, especially when it came to COVID in his final year which Biden then got lumped with. If Biden loses I think it’ll come down to a lot of left leaning voters not bothering to vote at all rather than turning to Trump, and the current Israel vs Palestine conflict is something which might end up having that result. 
 

So many current factors at play that seem to be blinding a lot of people to what a disaster a second Trump term would be in the long run and I sure hope all the people planning on sitting this one out in protest are ready to face the consequences if it happens. 2016 all over again with the left’s blasé attitude to their candidate. 

[charlierc]

14 hours ago, FloopFiller said:

If the Dems had any hope of running an alternative candidate to Biden then they should’ve been sowing the seeds of it for the last four years, not four months away from the election. The few days post-debate is the first time I’ve thought that Trump might have a chance of winning, but… 

…ultimately, this is what it comes down to. Everybody knows what Trump is like and everybody has had eight years to decide if they’re with or against him and I doubt that single debate has budged anybody in either direction enough to decide the election results.
 

It sucks that Biden is clearly a shadow of his former self at this stage, and it’s a shame his ego wouldn’t allow himself to step aside and let somebody younger take his place, but then he did beat Trump in 2020 so I can understand why he believed he can do it again, and if it’s a feeble old man vs. a literal fascist (who also happens to be an old man) then I imagine the outcome is gonna be near identical to 2020, with Biden possibly even gaining a bigger advantage due to Trump becoming so unhinged in the last few years. 
 

As for if Biden does win, I do wonder if he’ll make it to the end of a second term. He’s always had his gaffes but his frailty and senior moments seem to be becoming the norm rather than occasional slip ups these days and has deteriorated pretty drastically over the last two years at least. 

They've unquestionably given themselves a problem and I agree that changing Biden out now can only be a mess.

 

If they're going to win from here, they are going to have to nail every single talking point - nail the fact that they had a plan which did have America in better shape, nail what their plans are to develop this and actually help more Americans feel like the economy is in better shape than it is, nail talking point plans for how to reverse some of the Republican party's antics, and nail the message that putting Trump back in the White House is going to be a disaster.

 

There is still an awkwardness to Trump and co, given they've had a weekend saying the hardline ultra-conservative Project 2025 has nothing to do with the Trump campaign despite it being written by 20 former advisors to the Trump White House. But there's so much noise about Biden being infirm, very much self-inflicted, and a sense that the Democrat Party is entering this not looking united.

 

Certainly, one way or another, it's hard to be confident in the Party in making the tangible campaign that nails every single talking point as said above or indeed making it through their convention next month without some kind of loud shouting match.

[steviewevie]

People talking up Kamala Harris...maybe give her a go...she certainly seems more alive...

 

[charlierc]

2 hours ago, steviewevie said:

People talking up Kamala Harris...maybe give her a go...she certainly seems more alive...

 

Is it hard to look more on it than Biden did at the debate the other week?

[philipsteak]

Crikey

 

 

 

 

[steviewevie]

I guess at this point the question is who has the best chance of beating Trump, Joe Biden or Kamala Harris?

[FloopFiller]

It’s crazy how quickly Dems have turned on Biden. A few weeks ago everybody was all in (or at least that was the message they were putting across) and then one bad (okay, very bad) debate later it’s all gone to total sh*t.

 

I still think he’s the best option personally, but only because switching candidates at this point, especially to the pretty controversial Kamala, seems very risky and more trouble than it’s worth. I’m not sure a lot of Americans would go for a black female president, and not just those on the right.

 

You’ve just gotta hope that people see the bigger picture of what 4 more years of Trump would bring (the Project 2025 and Trump & Epstein stuff currently being hammered is a good start) and not ‘old man bad, I’m gonna stay at home and not vote’. 

 

Biden also needs to be ever present from now until the election to give people reassurance, but that could also backfire as one or two more massive senior moments for the world to see and he’s toast in a lot of peoples eyes.

 

What a terrifying scenario and huge mess - a real wannabe dictator looming over America and Dems are fighting back with a guy who can barely get his words out and looks like he could die at any moment. How have they allowed this to happen?!

[steviewevie]

30 minutes ago, FloopFiller said:

It’s crazy how quickly Dems have turned on Biden. A few weeks ago everybody was all in (or at least that was the message they were putting across) and then one bad (okay, very bad) debate later it’s all gone to total sh*t.

 

I still think he’s the best option personally, but only because switching candidates at this point, especially to the pretty controversial Kamala, seems very risky and more trouble than it’s worth. I’m not sure a lot of Americans would go for a black female president, and not just those on the right.

 

You’ve just gotta hope that people see the bigger picture of what 4 more years of Trump would bring (the Project 2025 and Trump & Epstein stuff currently being hammered is a good start) and not ‘old man bad, I’m gonna stay at home and not vote’. 

 

Biden also needs to be ever present from now until the election to give people reassurance, but that could also backfire as one or two more massive senior moments for the world to see and he’s toast in a lot of peoples eyes.

 

What a terrifying scenario and huge mess - a real wannabe dictator looming over America and Dems are fighting back with a guy who can barely get his words out and looks like he could die at any moment. How have they allowed this to happen?!

Come on...watch that Jon Stewart video. He has been getting progressively more f**ked the last few years, it's not going to get better unless they really do find the right meds to carry him through.

The blind ignorance of the reality by Biden supporters is why we are probably now facing a Trump presidency despite him being a clown c**t. It is probably too late to save it now, it is now a case of hope for the best.

The most ridiculous situation. Comical really. A fitting epitaph.

[FloopFiller]

6 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

Come on...watch that Jon Stewart video. He has been getting progressively more f**ked the last few years, it's not going to get better unless they really do find the right meds to carry him through.

The blind ignorance of the reality by Biden supporters is why we are probably now facing a Trump presidency despite him being a clown c**t. It is probably too late to save it now, it is now a case of hope for the best.

The most ridiculous situation. Comical really. A fitting epitaph.

Oh yeah I know. Tbh I’m completely torn on what the better option actually is. It’s actually incredibly unfortunate timing that Biden’s noticeable decline has come to the surface in the past year or so and coincided with his bid for reelection and didn’t happen either earlier so that they had time to find somebody else or after so that he was already reelected. I just don’t think it’s as simple this late in the game as ‘find somebody else’, even if Biden was willing to budge.
 

The right are gonna turn up to vote for Trump no matter what comes out between now and then, whereas the left have always been more flighty in America and will happily stay home if they don’t like the candidate for whatever reason. It’s f**king stupid, especially when Trump is the opposition, but if they chose a candidate other than Biden that didn’t sit well with people then they could well be handing it to Trump on a platter, whereas Biden at least has the record of having beat Trump before.

 

Real shame that, if Trump wins, Biden’s ultimate legacy is gonna be his hubris allowing Trump to reenter office, and not beating him in the first place. 

[steviewevie]

12 hours ago, FloopFiller said:

Oh yeah I know. Tbh I’m completely torn on what the better option actually is. It’s actually incredibly unfortunate timing that Biden’s noticeable decline has come to the surface in the past year or so and coincided with his bid for reelection and didn’t happen either earlier so that they had time to find somebody else or after so that he was already reelected. I just don’t think it’s as simple this late in the game as ‘find somebody else’, even if Biden was willing to budge.
 

The right are gonna turn up to vote for Trump no matter what comes out between now and then, whereas the left have always been more flighty in America and will happily stay home if they don’t like the candidate for whatever reason. It’s f**king stupid, especially when Trump is the opposition, but if they chose a candidate other than Biden that didn’t sit well with people then they could well be handing it to Trump on a platter, whereas Biden at least has the record of having beat Trump before.

 

Real shame that, if Trump wins, Biden’s ultimate legacy is gonna be his hubris allowing Trump to reenter office, and not beating him in the first place. 

well, the people around Biden have kept his cognitive issues shielded from public view as much as possible, limited unscripted/unprepared public appearances etc. Anyway, not sure he's going anywhere if he can get through this NATO thing unscathed...and maybe he'll still manage to win after a campaign which scares enough people about a Trump presidency...

 

 

[steviewevie]

 

[Crazyfool01]

Can they just simply transfer to Kamala if he wins presidency ? Too late to have any alternative to her ? 

[steviewevie]

1 hour ago, Crazyfool01 said:

Can they just simply transfer to Kamala if he wins presidency ? Too late to have any alternative to her ? 

They could, not sure how doing it straight away would go with the public, but if he was ill and showing real signs of dementia then yes could transfer to her.

Not too late to have an alternative, but more difficult. They would have to start from scratch in terms of funding etc.

[FloopFiller]

1 hour ago, Crazyfool01 said:

Can they just simply transfer to Kamala if he wins presidency ? Too late to have any alternative to her ? 

I think they’re more focused on if he can win the presidency in the first place at this point - seems to have been a huge shift from ‘we’ve got this’ to ‘we’re f**ked’ since his debate performance. But yeah, if he became too impaired to continue once reelected it would get passed to Kamala by default I think. Don’t think there would be any talk of an alternative in that instance.
 

Best thing they can do at this point is try and keep focus and really hammering how awful Trump is by comparison. Yes, Biden is old, but Trump is a wannabe tyrant, child molester, and the rest. Only problem is that people have known all of this stuff all along and either deny it, don’t care, or in many instances like him more for it.

[Crazyfool01]

2 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

They could, not sure how doing it straight away would go with the public, but if he was ill and showing real signs of dementia then yes could transfer to her.

Not too late to have an alternative, but more difficult. They would have to start from scratch in terms of funding etc.

just so utterly bonkers this 

[steviewevie]

3 hours ago, Crazyfool01 said:

just so utterly bonkers this 

Basically it is up to Biden. 

[steviewevie]

GEORGE CLOONEY SAYS BIDEN MUST STEP DOWN

[charlierc]

On 7/9/2024 at 11:23 AM, philipsteak said:

Crikey

 

 

 

 

If nothing else at least Stewart is still as good as he was when I watched the Daily Show in his last 3/4 years before leaving the first time.

[charlierc]

8 hours ago, Crazyfool01 said:

just so utterly bonkers this 

When has America not been insane?

 

Although granted having the only two men that can be President from next January both being too old for the job is a bizarre look.

[Crazyfool01]

1 minute ago, charlierc said:

When has America not been insane?

 

Although granted having the only two men that can be President from next January both being too old for the job is a bizarre look.

true but this is next level bonkers 

[philipsteak]

16 minutes ago, charlierc said:

If nothing else at least Stewart is still as good as he was when I watched the Daily Show in his last 3/4 years before leaving the first time.

Indeed. I've only started watching again since he came back. 

Shame he only does Mondays

[FloopFiller]

2 hours ago, steviewevie said:

GEORGE CLOONEY SAYS BIDEN MUST STEP DOWN

Just came here to post this. This isn’t just some rando celeb saying their piece - Clooney hosted Biden’s fundraiser just last month and is saying that the Biden he saw at that fundraiser is the same one everybody saw at the debate and is a shadow of his former self, and that all of the Dems he has spoken to, even those currently having Biden’s back, are saying he should drop out behind the scenes. 
 

Very much coming around to Biden dropping out now and Kamala running instead. Got no idea what chance Kamala actually has of winning, but Biden has very quickly become irreparable damaged goods. I’m sure he initially chose to stay in hoping that this would all quickly go away, but it’s all gotten too loud with too many prominent people speaking up for Biden to ignore. I know I’m doing a total 180 on what I was saying just yesterday, but it wouldn’t at all surprise me to see him bow out in the next couple of weeks at this point.

Edited Wednesday at 06:29 PM by FloopFiller

[charlierc]

13 hours ago, philipsteak said:

Indeed. I've only started watching again since he came back. 

Shame he only does Mondays

I think he's also done some stuff for the show's podcast but yeah, far as the main show goes, it is just Mondays. Although some of his support players are still decent value.

[charlierc]

12 hours ago, FloopFiller said:

Just came here to post this. This isn’t just some rando celeb saying their piece - Clooney hosted Biden’s fundraiser just last month and is saying that the Biden he saw at that fundraiser is the same one everybody saw at the debate and is a shadow of his former self, and that all of the Dems he has spoken to, even those currently having Biden’s back, are saying he should drop out behind the scenes. 
 

Very much coming around to Biden dropping out now and Kamala running instead. Got no idea what chance Kamala actually has of winning, but Biden has very quickly become irreparable damaged goods. I’m sure he initially chose to stay in hoping that this would all quickly go away, but it’s all gotten too loud with too many prominent people speaking up for Biden to ignore. I know I’m doing a total 180 on what I was saying just yesterday, but it wouldn’t at all surprise me to see him bow out in the next couple of weeks at this point.

There's certainly a sense of the Democrats tying themselves in knots with this throughout and it's displaying in this sense almost of a party civil war, which at the very least means the convention next month will be contentious.