vaccine passports

[eFestivals]

 Looks like there will soonbeaccine passports for access to various countries and events and Venues.

What do you think about them.

Edited March 16, 2021 by eFestivals

[eFestivals]

Everyone in the UK will have free access to vaccines so there's no reason anyone should feel discriminated against.

[mcshed]

Vaccines for international travel are already pretty standard so it seems silly to object to that being extended to COVID as for domestic passports, I can see why people feel more squeemish about that but personally I have no issue with it. 

[lost]

No. As we know Captain Tom couldn't take the vaccine for health reasons and so I wouldn't want those people to become second class citizens.

Infact a business refusing to hire someone or serve someone due to a disability which meant they couldn't take the vaccine I would think would be able to be challenged under the disability discrimination act. 

Edited March 16, 2021 by lost

[mcshed]

58 minutes ago, lost said:

No. As we know Captain Tom couldn't take the vaccine for health reasons and so I wouldn't want those people to become second class citizens.

Infact a business refusing to hire someone or serve someone due to a disability which meant they couldn't take the vaccine I would think would be able to be challenged under the disability discrimination act. 

There could easily be medical exemptions.

[lost]

3 minutes ago, mcshed said:

There could easily be medical exemptions.

Possibility yes we could have a land yard system like facemasks but really that is the whole definition of herd immunity. The strong in the herd protecting to weak and so when we hit that amount through a combination of people who have had the virus and been vaccinated I don't see any reason not to get back to normal.

I don't think we will though I think the government will string this out as long as possible.

[mcshed]

1 minute ago, lost said:

Possibility yes we could have a land yard system like facemasks but really that is the whole definition of herd immunity. The strong in the herd protecting to weak and so when we hit that amount through a combination of people who have had the virus and been vaccinated I don't see any reason not to get back to normal.

I don't think we will though I think the government will string this out as long as possible.

Don't need lanyards just whatever app or whatnot is recording vaccinations can record exemptions.

I agree that with high vaccine uptake here it is probably unnecessary, but if uptake drops as we go down the age groups or as we open up then vaccine passports seem like a sensible carrot to get that herd immunity and protect those people you were saying you were worried about being excluded.

The government won't string this out any longer than necessary they want us back in shops spending money.

[lost]

14 minutes ago, mcshed said:

Don't need lanyards just whatever app or whatnot is recording vaccinations can record exemptions.

Is the government going to buy us all the latest phone 😃 I know I live in a poor area but as with track and trace when I saw people being challenged at the door of bars to sign in they were all pulling out really old mobile phones which couldn't run apps and had to sign in the old fashioned way on paper.

It'll end up as another extremely expensive project with lots of money for the governments mates but will achieve very little.

Interest rates on government debt have quadrupled since the start of the year. We should probably start dealing with the amount we've already spent rather than spaff another $40bn up the wall on a vaccine app.

Edited March 16, 2021 by lost

[mcshed]

17 minutes ago, lost said:

Is the government going to buy us all the latest phone 😃 I know I live in a poor area but as with track and trace when I saw people being challenged at the door of bars to sign in they were all pulling out really old mobile phones which couldn't run apps and had to sign in the old fashioned way on paper.

It'll end up as another extremely expensive project with lots of money for the governments mates but will achieve very little.

Interest rates on government debt have quadrupled since the start of the year. We should probably start dealing with the amount we've already spent rather than spaff another $40bn up the wall on a vaccine app.

The implementation may end up being a disaster but that doesn't make it a bad idea in principle.

[gizmoman]

6 hours ago, eFestivals said:

Everyone in the UK will have free access to vaccines so there's no reason anyone should feel discriminated against.

Feel? They WILL be discriminated against for refusing the vaccine, if you think it's right to stop people having a normal life because of this then say so but don't pretend this is anything but coercion and punishment for those that don't comply, how much should the refuseniks suffer? should they be banned from polling stations and so have the right to vote taken? What about going to the doctor? why should they be allowed to risk infecting medical staff, should they be refused treatment without the jab? Should this be extended to the flu jab too? if not why not flu kills too.

A year ago people forecast that this was coming and they were called conspiracy theorists, people on here ridiculed any suggestion jabs would be mandatory or ID passes would be needed for normal life, now a majority are happy to go along with this, even though there is zero medical need and it takes away freedoms for everyone, you all need to think back to what life should be and not be brainwashed into accepting government tyranny.

[eFestivals]

2 hours ago, lost said:

Is the government going to buy us all the latest phone 😃 I know I live in a poor area but as with track and trace when I saw people being challenged at the door of bars to sign in they were all pulling out really old mobile phones which couldn't run apps and had to sign in the old fashioned way on paper.

It'll end up as another extremely expensive project with lots of money for the governments mates but will achieve very little.

Interest rates on government debt have quadrupled since the start of the year. We should probably start dealing with the amount we've already spent rather than spaff another $40bn up the wall on a vaccine app.

The passport function is going to be added to the existing app I think.

[eFestivals]

On 3/16/2021 at 11:51 AM, gizmoman said:

Feel? They WILL be discriminated against for refusing the vaccine, if you think it's right to stop people having a normal life because of this then say so but don't pretend this is anything but coercion and punishment for those that don't comply, how much should the refuseniks suffer? should they be banned from polling stations and so have the right to vote taken? What about going to the doctor? why should they be allowed to risk infecting medical staff, should they be refused treatment without the jab? Should this be extended to the flu jab too? if not why not flu kills too.

A year ago people forecast that this was coming and they were called conspiracy theorists, people on here ridiculed any suggestion jabs would be mandatory or ID passes would be needed for normal life, now a majority are happy to go along with this, even though there is zero medical need and it takes away freedoms for everyone, you all need to think back to what life should be and not be brainwashed into accepting government tyranny.

They can refuse the vaccine as it's not compulsory on the basis of my gbodymy say.id like to have a say over someone else infecting me.

Edited March 17, 2021 by eFestivals

[lost]

18 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

The passport function is going to be added to the existing app I think.

Doesn't the existing app use anonymous contract testing data? I would think it would be a pretty big job adding in an API to some sort of database of everyone's medical data. Security would need to be massively upgraded for a start as you suddenly get a back door to data which would be useful for hackers.

The are laws around the segregation and storage of personal data, its extremely expensive and I'm sure dido harding will be adding a couple of zeros to the quote to carry out this sort of work.

Edited March 16, 2021 by lost

[lost]

Infact the more I think about it having worked with this stuff for 20 years. Adapting an app that's been built from the ground up to use anonymous data, to start using non-anonymous data has more red flags than a Chinese parade. 

Personally even though I'm happy to take a vaccine I wouldn't be using such an app and I'd goto the bars that have borrowed so much to stay afloat they'll be happy to turn a blind eye for custom.

Saying all that though this conversation maybe redundant as we apparently are going to be completely back to normal on June the 21st even though furlough has been extended till September 😁

[stephos83]

58 minutes ago, lost said:

Doesn't the existing app use anonymous contract testing data? I would think it would be a pretty big job adding in an API to some sort of database of everyone's medical data. Security would need to be massively upgraded for a start as you suddenly get a back door to data which would be useful for hackers.

The are laws around the segregation and storage of personal data, its extremely expensive and I'm sure dido harding will be adding a couple of zeros to the quote to carry out this sort of work.

I think @eFestivals was referring to the existing main NHS app, which can (if your GP is up to it) display your vaccinations, prescriptions etc already.

[lost]

14 minutes ago, stephos83 said:

I think @eFestivals was referring to the existing main NHS app, which can (if your GP is up to it) display your vaccinations, prescriptions etc already.

Ah ok I've never come across that. My GP is useless and the last time I went for an inhaler they didn't even know I had asthma and I'd somehow dropped off their system completely. I'm still half expecting I won't even get the call for a vaccine 😁

I got a bit of paper when I had the vaccines to visit south east Asia which told me how long they would last and that was it.

So it seems to be a mute point, it can't be implemented around here as we don't have the tech yet.

Edited March 16, 2021 by lost

[gizmoman]

2 hours ago, eFestivals said:

They can refuse the vaccine as it's not compulsory on the basis of my govt my syay.id like to have a say over someone else infecting me.

You have the choice to have the vaccine to protect you, if the vaccine doesn't protect you enough what's the point of it? If you're so worried even after having the vaccine then you can stay away from public spaces and let the rest of us who are more rational get on with our lives. All this for a disease that has little more impact (for the vast majority) than Flu, people have lost all sense of proportion.

[henry bear]

When we start going to gigs/festivals etc again, it’ll largely be down to the fact that people have done their bit by being vaccinated. I don’t see why anti-vaxers should benefit from this. 

[kaosmark2]

Considering that young people may well not get their 2nd vaccine until July/August, it seems pretty horrible to not allow them into venues/events when things open up in June/July.

[eFestivals]

3 minutes ago, kaosmark2 said:

Considering that young people may well not get their 2nd vaccine until July/August, it seems pretty horrible to not allow them into venues/events when things open up in June/July.

It'll be horrible of Greece Malta and turkey not to let them in.

 

I suspect the govt won't make them available untill all ages have been called.

[kaosmark2]

4 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

It'll be horrible of Greece Malta and turkey not to let them in.

 

I suspect the govt won't make them available untill all ages have been called.

I'd say international travel and domestic policy are different issues and should be viewed as such.

If they don't make them available until everyone has had the offer of their 2nd vaccine, then it might be fair enough, but it also seems fairly pointless by then? 

[eFestivals]

2 minutes ago, kaosmark2 said:

I'd say international travel and domestic policy are different issues and should be viewed as such.

If they don't make them available until everyone has had the offer of their 2nd vaccine, then it might be fair enough, but it also seems fairly pointless by then? 

Domestic sand international are about the same thing not letting in peeps who might infect others

[kaosmark2]

1 minute ago, eFestivals said:

Domestic sand international are about the same thing not letting in peeps who might infect others

So my issue with doing it before everyone has had the chance to take up 2 vaccines, is it potentially discriminates against the young, who have given up more opportunity and less risk to themselves, as well as an economic situation which is going to hurt them for decades. The vaccine rollout is largely being done in the right order (although why NHS staff and teachers weren't prioritised higher I don't get), but if that's then turned into how much you're allowing people to do, it's a completely different issue.

International travel isn't our own government doing it to our own citizens, it is picking and choosing, but at least it's not the endless same demand of younger generations to sacrifice themselves for the elderly.

Also, most people working in any venues are likely to be younger.

[lost]

13 minutes ago, kaosmark2 said:

although why NHS staff and teachers weren't prioritised higher I don't get

I don't think teachers were but NHS staff definitely were. I've a mate in a non-customer facing role for the NHS, in his early 30's in perfect health and he doesn't even work in a hospital rather an office building where he sits in a room on his own configuring laptops. He was one of the first to get the vaccine before many 80 year olds.

[eFestivals]

10 minutes ago, kaosmark2 said:

So my issue with doing it before everyone has had the chance to take up 2 vaccines, is it potentially discriminates against the young, who have given up more opportunity and less risk to themselves, as well as an economic situation which is going to hurt them for decades. The vaccine rollout is largely being done in the right order (although why NHS staff and teachers weren't prioritised higher I don't get), but if that's then turned into how much you're allowing people to do, it's a completely different issue.

International travel isn't our own government doing it to our own citizens, it is picking and choosing, but at least it's not the endless same demand of younger generations to sacrifice themselves for the elderly.

Also, most people working in any venues are likely to be younger.

 Of sure if two doses will be required.we still need to see detailssrill to be revesaelled.