Football 2021/2022

[Gnomicide]

Anyway, I hate to be the Twitter dump guy but....

WAHEY!!!

[pink_triangle]

I'm not a huge fan of Bruce as a manager, but never really got the personal stuff. I have always been pretty apathetic about him.

[thetime]

Bruce gone.

The abuse he got went further than criticising a manager. Shameful from what used to be a pretty good fanbase. 

[lost]

Unusual that both Bruce and Ashley got the abuse as you'd expect either the manager is given the money and is shit or the manager gets no money and so its not really his fault if the team is shit.

[WS_Jack_III]

57 minutes ago, Gnomicide said:

😄

 

Get ready for the sob story for the rest of time. He never helped himself from the off, the little digs about Rafa, blaming the fans, local media and everything and anyone but himself for our poor performances. 

 

Don't feel sorry for him, got millions for being a failure. Good riddance.

[kaosmark2]

22 minutes ago, thetime said:

Bruce gone.

The abuse he got went further than criticising a manager. Shameful from what used to be a pretty good fanbase. 

He blamed the fans the 2nd week he arrived.

[kaosmark2]

16 minutes ago, lost said:

Unusual that both Bruce and Ashley got the abuse as you'd expect either the manager is given the money and is shit or the manager gets no money and so its not really his fault if the team is shit.

Bruce spent £60m. Rafa spent -£20m. The fans blame Ashley for supporting a shit manager more, and blame the shit manager for Joelinton and inability to have any defensive shape, or any attacking strategy past "pass it to ASM".

[kaosmark2]

22 minutes ago, WS_Jack_III said:

Get ready for the sob story for the rest of time. He never helped himself from the off, the little digs about Rafa, blaming the fans, local media and everything and anyone but himself for our poor performances. 

 

Don't feel sorry for him, got millions for being a failure. Good riddance.

So much this. It's 2 years late, not 2 weeks late.

[pink_triangle]

30 minutes ago, kaosmark2 said:

He blamed the fans the 2nd week he arrived.

It's a two way relationship. Was he treated great by the fans when he was appointed. I don't feel huge sympathy for Bruce as he is getting paid well for not having the job. However if his greatest crime is tactical ineptness or answering back to fans. I rank those crimes way below crimes against women, homosexuals and journalists.

 

[The Nal]

2 hours ago, WS_Jack_III said:

Doesn't matter, just needed him gone. Just the Sports Direct signs left now, unfortunately they are staying up for a bit.

Does matter. Don't rule out the Saudis using the club to appoint dodgy business partners as managers and directors as sweeteners for other business deals, putting mates in just for the craic a la Gary Neville at Valencia, using the club to hide money and so on. 

"With a deep appreciation for the Newcastle community"

The idea that Mbappe, Haaland and Lewandowski are coming in January followed by a load of Galacticos and Zidane next summer is naive.

Serious job ahead to even stay in the league this season. Abysmal squad. 

Edited October 20, 2021 by The Nal

[pink_triangle]

53 minutes ago, kaosmark2 said:

Bruce spent £60m. Rafa spent -£20m. 

I thought I had read he had no say in the Joelinton signing, or are you not counting that one?

[The Nal]

2 hours ago, Gnomicide said:

Anyway, I hate to be the Twitter dump guy but....

WAHEY!!!

Took it well. Thats about as wide a peno as you'll see.

[lost]

Yeah seems a bit unfair both allan saint maximin and Joelinton were in FIFA's future stars squad that season. One pays off one doesn't, As I've said before I think very few clubs are hitting 80 - 90% success rates on transfers.

[thetime]

1 hour ago, kaosmark2 said:

Bruce spent £60m. Rafa spent -£20m. 

That's a bit skewed isn't it? Newcastle have sold most of the decent players already leaving eafa with favourable figures, leaving Bruce with a poor squad. 

 

[kaosmark2]

28 minutes ago, pink_triangle said:

It's a two way relationship. Was he treated great by the fans when he was appointed. I don't feel huge sympathy for Bruce as he is getting paid well for not having the job. However if his greatest crime is tactical ineptness or answering back to fans. I rank those crimes way below crimes against women, homosexuals and journalists.

No, the fans liked Rafa, didn't like the appointment, and that was well-known, but it wasn't him answering back to fans, he attacked them right from the start before it got to any sense of regular negative treatment.

It's perfectly possible to say that Bruce was an atrocious manager within a football context and brought a lot of the criticism and ill-feeling upon himself. The nature of Bruce's relationship with the fans has nothing to do with the Saudis.

Also, I've publicly said I'm not going to give any financial or moral support to the club under the new regime, can we ever discuss the club without bringing them up? Or should I start referencing how Green Lantern was a crime against cinema every time you talk about Wrexham?

[kaosmark2]

11 minutes ago, pink_triangle said:

I thought I had read he had no say in the Joelinton signing, or are you not counting that one?

I am counting that, and whether he had the say or not, there was a large net spend under Bruce, and a large negative spend under Rafa.

[kaosmark2]

7 minutes ago, lost said:

Yeah seems a bit unfair both allan saint maximin and Joelinton were in FIFA's future stars squad that season. One pays off one doesn't, As I've said before I think very few clubs are hitting 80 - 90% success rates on transfers.

 

1 minute ago, thetime said:

That's a bit skewed isn't it? Newcastle have sold most of the decent players already leaving eafa with favourable figures, leaving Bruce with a poor squad. 

 

I mean, I was asked how the blame was on both Ashley and Bruce, I gave the answer?

[pink_triangle]

56 minutes ago, kaosmark2 said:

No, the fans liked Rafa, didn't like the appointment, and that was well-known, but it wasn't him answering back to fans, he attacked them right from the start before it got to any sense of regular negative treatment.

It's perfectly possible to say that Bruce was an atrocious manager within a football context and brought a lot of the criticism and ill-feeling upon himself. The nature of Bruce's relationship with the fans has nothing to do with the Saudis.

Also, I've publicly said I'm not going to give any financial or moral support to the club under the new regime, can we ever discuss the club without bringing them up? Or should I start referencing how Green Lantern was a crime against cinema every time you talk about Wrexham?

I am not calling you out, but as a fanbase as a whole the Newcastle fans treatment of Ashley, Bruce and the Saudi regime is massively out of proportion to the ills all 3 have been involved in. Would other fans be happily bought off in the same way, certainly but I would hope they would be called out as well.

My view as a neutral is Bruce tenure was a mixed bag rather than complete failure. I thought last season was a perfectly fine finish for the resources he had.

Happy for you to call out Green Lantern. I remember it being bad, but I think I have seen worse!!

 

[pink_triangle]

1 hour ago, kaosmark2 said:

I am counting that, and whether he had the say or not, there was a large net spend under Bruce, and a large negative spend under Rafa.

I think that's a bit unfair to count that. I listen to loads of football podcasts and the south American and European ones were all universally amazed by the fee Newcastle paid, don't see how Bruce could be responsible for that.

[lost]

I actually think the issue is the premier league has moved on more than we realise even since Rafa was Newcastle manager and maybe taken another step up. Villa have big bucks, Leeds are back in there, Palace, Wolves, Leicester all have money. Its now getting to be a struggle to pick 5 of 6 teams who you wouldn't expect to be there for the next decade.

[kaosmark2]

21 minutes ago, pink_triangle said:

I am not calling you out, but as a fanbase as a whole the Newcastle fans treatment of Ashley, Bruce and the Saudi regime is massively out of proportion to the ills all 3 have been involved in. Would other fans be happily bought off in the same way, certainly but I would hope they would be called out as well.

My view as a neutral is Bruce tenure was a mixed bag rather than complete failure. I thought last season was a perfectly fine finish for the resources he had.

Happy for you to call out Green Lantern. I remember it being bad, but I think I have seen worse!!

It's mostly that I get tired of it, and I didn't see it happening to the same extent with City or Chelsea, which are the obvious comparisons.

A big thing about Bruce's tenure is that he got the investment Rafa never did, and then players who had looked good under Rafa regressed massively under Bruce, when they were at an age where they should have been improving or adding consistency. Lascelles, Hayden, Dummett, Almiron, Dubravka, and Longstaff all look a lot worse than they did 3 years ago. Even if you don't judge Bruce on Joelinton (and there has to be questions about coaching and scouting), Rafa only got 6 months with Almiron, and 0 with ASM, who are the 2 other big (over £10m) signings made in recent years. I also feel like ASM is the best player we've had in 15 years, and the manager and rest of the squad don't really deserve him.

[TheGayTent]

46 minutes ago, lost said:

I actually think the issue is the premier league has moved on more than we realise even since Rafa was Newcastle manager and maybe taken another step up. Villa have big bucks, Leeds are back in there, Palace, Wolves, Leicester all have money. Its now getting to be a struggle to pick 5 of 6 teams who you wouldn't expect to be there for the next decade.

I think you’ll find the Chinese have tightened the purse strings at Molineux. Look at their net spend in the last year or so and add that to the cancellation of ground expansion plans. Not the endless money pit they liked to portray a couple of seasons back. 

[lost]

30 minutes ago, TheGayTent said:

I think you’ll find the Chinese have tightened the purse strings at Molineux. Look at their net spend in the last year or so and add that to the cancellation of ground expansion plans. Not the endless money pit they liked to portray a couple of seasons back. 

I hadn't actually noticed that. Fábio Silva seemed a hell of alot of money for an unproved youngster similar to Joelinton and I wasn't aware Hwang Hee-chan was only a loan but yes you forget both Jota and Doherty moved for big money.

[pink_triangle]

1 hour ago, kaosmark2 said:

It's mostly that I get tired of it, and I didn't see it happening to the same extent with City or Chelsea, which are the obvious comparisons.

 

It's a different time though. Chelsea takeover was nearly 20 years ago, City 13 years ago. I think as a society people are more aware of these things, social media certainly very different. I think the criticism Newcastle fans have taken for being willing to take the cash and ignore the human rights is no different to what any other club would have had in 2021. Also I think it's a stretch comparing Abrahamovic and the Saudis, even though I accept the former isn't a great person.

[charlierc]

7 hours ago, Gnomicide said:

Anyway, I hate to be the Twitter dump guy but....

WAHEY!!!

Ha yeah saw that. Good on the steward for cheering it regardless of any pain he might've had.