Crowd control issues

[Alvoram]

2 hours ago, steviewevie said:

So jumping the fence is a thing again? Might have a go at that next year, bit of nostalgia.

Apparently it was thought that about 30 people jumped the smaller fence into Sticklinch on Friday night, without knowing there was another fence to pass... This came from a security guard on gully gate when asked why the security checks were more intense that night (they were checking us twice, at either end of the gate, and really checking too.)

A wall jumper was also found hiding in one person's tent (without their permission and to their surprise) that evening. 

I do wonder if this talk of a lack of guards has also had an effect on the difficulty level of getting over the fence, what with some of the lightweight telescopic ladders you can get now, it wouldn't be that difficult to physically do, as long as you don't get seen. And with less guards, is there a lower chance of being seen? 

Having said that, security guards were also working 6 shifts each this year, I made friends with several of them who were Derby fans from Derbyshire up in Sticklinch, and they told me the number of shifts had increased to 6 x 12 hours. So does that cancel out the lower number of guards available?  

Anyway, more on topic, after my initial few days, I soon got used to crowds again. Yes it was busy, but we quickly learned how to manage it again... Stay on the field for a few minutes after acts, leave early if you need the toilet, walk close to the edge if you walking against the majority, and just be nice, give way, apologise if you bump someone, being nice goes a long way.

The last 2 days were incredible. It was very busy and yes we were in what a few of you describe as crushes. (Not sure we should be using that term when nobody got hurt, and given the history of the term, but still.) None of those crushes were as bad as leaving Wembley after almost any major event. I just needed to get used to it again, that's all. 

[jparx]

1 minute ago, ghandi said:

The bad conjestion was caused by terrible band / act placement, simple as that. Putting the Sugababes on at the Avalon at that time when poeple were on the way to the SE corner was madness. Should have been on a bigger stage like the Park. Also who thought it a great idea to put Bastille on at Williams Green on a Thursday? Stupidity. 

Yeah, scheduling was the main contributor to the issues we experienced I think. Going both ways too - acts on too small a stage/too early and acts on too big a stage/too late creating issues elsewhere.

[Isaact]

44 minutes ago, Mark0 said:

Went to the Arcadia twice with my daughter , first time to see Groove Armada and found the crowd there a bit ott leaving my daughter feeling a bit intimidated after being pushed and shoved, which wasn't in keeping with the other stages where most people were pretty considerate considering the crowds. The second time just before Calvin Harris she was actually pushed so hard she hit the floor by some shitfaced young lady trying to drag her even more shitfaced boyfriend to the front. Needless to say she didn't apologise, killed the evening for us.

Ive been to gigs all my life and just found the Arcadia area having a bad vibe, maybe because it was often late and a lot of people were tanked up and being very full on with pushing and shoving , I don't know , people will disagree no doubt but I stand by what I say.

Pretty much everyone at Arcadia after 11pm is on either cocaine or mdma. Most will be on both, which affects the feeling of the crowd.

The scariest crowd for me this year was Sasha at Glade on Thursday, fuck knows what they were thinking putting one of the most famous DJs in the world in a smallish area with very little else on but it got very, very, very busy and it didn't feel safe at all.

[Ryu]

Interesting thread.

Was certainly some edgy moments in crowds, I got to Park early on Friday, so whilst it got busier for Wet Leg, we were at the back of the area listen/watching in comfort. 

That said, I think sitting anywhere near the front of stages especially in chairs is the festival equivalent of the Sun bed towel thing at Holiday resorts. 

I think next year you should be able to pre-empt the bigger draws a bit easier, and plan accordingly. I think 6 months ago, Wet Leg on Park would make sense, but they've taken off. Conversely, Fender has done the same and, due to the Doja reshuffle, it worked out for all. Big stage, big crowd.

It's a trade off on areas like Arcadia...you want the names and line up, but will need to sacrifice time to get there plenty early. 

Edited June 27, 2022 by Ryu

[clarkete]

26 minutes ago, Alvoram said:

 

 

Yes it was busy, but we quickly learned how to manage it again... Stay on the field for a few minutes after acts, leave early if you need the toilet, walk close to the edge if you walking against the majority, and just be nice, give way, apologise if you bump someone, being nice goes a long way.

Very true 😊

[lukemack]

From Friday onwards there didn't seem to be a path anywhere that was completely filled with people, whole site seemed to be massively over capacity.

Saturday night in Shangri-la was a joke, just too many people crushes, and then shoulder to shoulder standing space in most venues, kills the festival for me

[Tom_12]

There was a crush to the right hand side of the pyramid mid way through Macca, seemingly created by people in the crowd putting up a resistance to people leaving the field and there being no spaces by the fences to get out. 

[LoraMaze]

Just now, lukemack said:

From Friday onwards there didn't seem to be a path anywhere that was completely filled with people, whole site seemed to be massively over capacity.

Saturday night in Shangri-la was a joke, just too many people crushes, and then shoulder to shoulder standing space in most venues, kills the festival for me

I was there on Friday night, and was quite surprised at the lack of toilets. When we asked a steward where the nearest loos were he said “you’re not going to like this” 🤣

 

[Mark0]

39 minutes ago, ghandi said:

The bad conjestion was caused by terrible band / act placement, simple as that. Putting the Sugababes on at the Avalon at that time when poeple were on the way to the SE corner was madness. Should have been on a bigger stage like the Park. Also who thought it a great idea to put Bastille on at Williams Green on a Thursday? Stupidity. 

Couldn't agree with this more , I mean we had Tom Walker in the Rabbit Hole on Thursday when he could have been on pretty much any other stage. We also had the Ukrainian band playing on the Pyramid stage in front of a tiny crowd at the exact time when George Ezra was on the John Peel stage and the crowds could have filled the tent up 10 times over , we had to give up there 

Edited June 27, 2022 by Mark0

[Isaact]

Yeah Shangri-la had a ridiculously small number of toilets for the size of the area.

Also award to the compost toilets which had to be the worst smelling toilets on site. The smell of hundreds of half digested comeup poos was something else.

[Splatt]

Didn't experience anything dangerous but was just so busy everywhere it did take some of the magic away this year. Can't believe 7k extra tickets would have made that much of a difference. Would not be fun in a muddy year. 

[Peroni]

I was talking to my friend about this who is in the police and they are having more briefings about the behaviour of crowds pre/post pandemic.

Apparently there's definitely a return to previous behaviour traits that we thought were long gone...people are actively acting differently which is pushing things and the lack of experienced staff is playing into it as well.

[Reckoner]

Wet leg felt super busy and was very slow moving but I never felt in any danger, just that it was going to take ages to move anywhere. Same as leaving most headline acts  

The Park/Arcadia one felt dangerous and that it could have turned out badly with the right amount of pressure. There was no direction form security so people were just pushing in every direction. The only sign was that the Park was closed, yet that was the only point in that junction that had space to fall into. 

It definitely put me off similar situations for the remainder of the weekend. I expect it to be busy, I expect slow moving shoulder to shoulder walking

I don’t expect having to put my arms on a defense position to ensure I keep people away from my chest. 

Edited June 27, 2022 by Reckoner

[robin]

9 minutes ago, Isaact said:

Yeah Shangri-la had a ridiculously small number of toilets for the size of the area.

Also award to the compost toilets which had to be the worst smelling toilets on site. The smell of hundreds of half digested comeup poos was something else.

The compost loos were by far the best and least stinky in my experience. Might have depended on the location, but the ones nearest my camping area were pretty much perfect all the time, just the very occasional cubical that people refused to use. 

[ghandi]

14 minutes ago, Splatt said:

Didn't experience anything dangerous but was just so busy everywhere it did take some of the magic away this year. Can't believe 7k extra tickets would have made that much of a difference. Would not be fun in a muddy year. 

Hadn't realised there was 7k extra tickets. Certainly why it seemed a lot busier.

[robin]

Really didn't feel that it was any busier than normal. But seems that all the complaints about people being stuck in crowds are based on having gone to the only entertainment on at that time, or what would quite obviously be the busiest thing on at that moment. 

Plenty of other places to go and see or do something that isn't as busy. 

[willgooneday]

15 minutes ago, Peroni said:

I was talking to my friend about this who is in the police and they are having more briefings about the behaviour of crowds pre/post pandemic.

Apparently there's definitely a return to previous behaviour traits that we thought were long gone...people are actively acting differently which is pushing things and the lack of experienced staff is playing into it as well.

It could be a generational shift that's taken place, but only really being noticed now because it hasn't had time to gradually happen - if you'd had 3 years in a row of some of these behaviours there'd be massive police efforts to deal with it. Football is normally a good bellweather for society as a whole and we've seen last year during the Euro's what that's turning into - that sort of thing is going on at local matches across the country as well. There does also seem to be a massive section of young people now who live to get coked/pissed off their fucking face, be really rude to figures of authority and smash shit up for no good reason - this was a thing when I was younger but most of us were much happier with a joint in our hand - it almost seems like societies regressing on anti-social behaviour. 

[4AssedMonkey]

So what’s the deal with the increased attendance? Common knowledge or not? I’d heard they had to do a deal to get out of a financial hole after 2020 getting cancelled at short notice and had to add circa 20k tickets as collateral.

Definitely the busiest I’ve seen by a long way. Everywhere, all the time but particularly in certain areas. I was at TLC and Sugababes. Not only were they busy, the crowd was extremely pushy and disrespectful to the stewards. My wife had a huge argument with a real w*nker at Sugababes, who’d just rushed the line of stewards, then rammed straight through the crowd with a huge backpack on. I’ve never felt tempted to swing for anyone at the G before but almost went for that prick.

[Nobby's Old Boots]

17 minutes ago, robin said:

Really didn't feel that it was any busier than normal. But seems that all the complaints about people being stuck in crowds are based on having gone to the only entertainment on at that time, or what would quite obviously be the busiest thing on at that moment. 

Plenty of other places to go and see or do something that isn't as busy. 

Just not the case. Lots and lots of people saying it was busier.

[4AssedMonkey]

3 minutes ago, Nobby's Old Boots said:

Just not the case. Lots and lots of people saying it was busier.

Yep. All 30 or so of our gang and everyone I spoke to on site said exactly the same. 

[MEGABOWL]

It certainly seemed a bit busier in parts with the odd pinch point. I do think there was an element of unfamiliarity with the festival though. It’s always been very busy.

Definitely some weird scheduling though. I guess the lack of festivals last two years has made it hard to judge some of the placements. That’s no excuse for not knowing the likes of TLC and Sugababes would get big crowds though. Hopefully next year will be better on that front.

[willgooneday]

Could part of the issue be people demanding more space and people getting fatter - it seems daft but as an armchair theory lets roll with it. 

This Paul McCartney at the 2022 festival, a bigger draw than either of the below surely yet it seems like people have a massive amount of personal space around them in comparison. Both of the other headliners were post fence so that's not an explanation. If you replicate that over a field of a thousand people you're going to end up with crushes going on at the back because there's another shit tonne of people who could fit in the past if people weren't keeping a personal bubble around them. And then obvious with the weight increase in the general population and you're going to start having issues. 

This is Arctic Monkeys in 2007 - not quite as rammed but people still packed in pretty tight - seem not to want to jam arms though

This is Faithless in 2002 - everyone packed in like absolute sardines, arms pressed up against eachother.

 

(I'm taking the piss, I just wanted to post photos of old sets, clearly though people are less jammed in these days to a small extent which is going to create minor issues at other areas where people would have been at the front in that crowd now are) 

Edited June 27, 2022 by willgooneday

[DeanoL]

3 hours ago, DTichborne said:

Some things are hard to predict - I thought Jarvis Cocker would have a big crowd, but we were near the front in loads of space. But one thing they should definitely do is cut out the "secret sets" and poor schedulings of large acts. Other than that, it was noticeably busier than when I last went in 2016 but I didn't have any major problems. This however is coming from someone who has been going since 1994, and experienced an horrific crush in 1999 that meant - whether it's in the "spirit of things" or not, the superfence was a necessary thing.

They need to just lower the intensity of acts on at the secret sets, like in 2019 when Frank Turner did half of them.

2 hours ago, kemosabe said:

Couldn't agree more. Also, if we all spent our time in the T&C fields and/ or Greenfields then they would be fucked too. On that note actually a friend of ours who spends the entire festival in those fields said even they were far busier this year then normal...
 

Yeah, they were still comfortable but noticeably busier. Like, I would have to queue for a couple of minutes for food or toilets there which I don't think I've ever had to do previously, you'd just walk right up/in.

[DeanoL]

Was there maybe a plan for a new area to go with the increased capacity as a 2020 celebration thing, which they then didn't have the funds to follow through on?

Could it have been where the Pylon staff camping ended up going?

[robin]

32 minutes ago, Nobby's Old Boots said:

Just not the case. Lots and lots of people saying it was busier.

Yes, but that is from people going to Williams Green on the Thursday to see Mel C and being surprised that lots of other people had the same idea, or lots of people going to The Park at the same time and also being surprised that they were not alone. 

Now if there were reports of the Pyramid Field being over capacity on Saturday evening or Sunday afternoon at points when there were expected to be big crowds then there might be a point. There may well have been crowd managem issues with them scheduling things on the wrong stages at the wrong times, but I really didn't get the feeling that there was more people than normal. The camping areas didn't seem any busier than normal and certainly not at 2000 and before levels. 

I was going around all areas at different times of the weekend and never felt it was too busy, and was even going through the middle of the Saturday evening and Sunday afternoon peak crowds at the Pyramid with my 7 year old in tow... Was just normal Glastonbury crowd overall... Just some bad crowd management in some areas, not excessive numbers on the site as a whole.