UK Politics

[kaosmark2]

24 minutes ago, lost said:

 

Already an Islam party in Belgium and there has been a few goes to form one here. Not great for labour as they won't want more seats voting down secartian lines.

 

I really hate the idea that these independent MPs are solely there because of sectarian reasons, or are universally Muslim. It's completely missed their actual messaging, campaign, and is bullshit perpetuated by a salty racist who for some reason has got more media air time since losing his seat than most cabinet ministers put together.

Edited August 9 by kaosmark2

[lost]

5 minutes ago, kaosmark2 said:

 

I really hate the idea that these independent MPs are solely there because of sectarian reasons, or are universally Muslim. It's completely missed their actual messaging, campaign, and is bullshit perpetuated by a salty racist who for some reason has got more media air time since losing his seat than most cabinet ministers put together.

 

Well I havent followed all of them. The one near me was campaigning purely on Palestine and saying people voting labour were not true muslims.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/article/2024/jul/21/labour-candidate-lost-new-pro-gaza-mp-accuses-backers-intimidation

 

[steviewevie]

Just now, lost said:

 

Well I havent followed all of them. The one near me was campaigning purely on Palestine and saying people voting labour were not true muslims.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/article/2024/jul/21/labour-candidate-lost-new-pro-gaza-mp-accuses-backers-intimidation

 

the guy who won in Leicester literally said "This is for the people of Gaza" when he won.

 

[kaosmark2]

40 minutes ago, lost said:

 

Well I havent followed all of them. The one near me was campaigning purely on Palestine and saying people voting labour were not true muslims.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/article/2024/jul/21/labour-candidate-lost-new-pro-gaza-mp-accuses-backers-intimidation

 

Sigh, "no true scotsman fallacy" literally there.

 

I've followed more details on Shockat Adam, who was a local independent councillor, and held a hustings with other local independent councillors to decide who would run against Ashworth. Ashworth has made a bunch of racist comments, repeatedly over the last year, and has (falsely) accused Adam of a violent campaign, while he himself has incited harassment. Adam was also quick to condemn harassment that was done in his name:

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/article/2024/jul/06/shockat-adam-independent-muslim-mp-leicester-south-victory-not-sectarian

 

I would say that I'm very distrustful of the messaging coming out of Labour specifically on these losses. I cheered Jess Phillips holding her seat against Jody McIntyre and his/Galloway's misogynistic thugs, but there has been an intent coming from Labour to frame all these independents as similar to that. The independent ones specifically didn't join Galloway's "workers party", and I'm hoping that's because several of them weren't single issue campaigners, and didn't endorse his abusive and toxic ideology and campaign strategy. I had heard some decent things about Iqbal Mohamed and the pre-election hustings. It was Adnan Hussain whose initial words made me most wary.

 

Given the big dissonance between the Galloway abusive tactics, and how effectively Adam used the local political system and campaigning, I'd be very disappointed if they did fully unite. My impression was very much that 2-3 of these were local efforts by established local campaigners. It's not like Corbyn isn't a somewhat toxic brand as well.

[steviewevie]

 

[steviewevie]

35 minutes ago, kaosmark2 said:

 

Sigh, "no true scotsman fallacy" literally there.

 

I've followed more details on Shockat Adam, who was a local independent councillor, and held a hustings with other local independent councillors to decide who would run against Ashworth. Ashworth has made a bunch of racist comments, repeatedly over the last year, and has (falsely) accused Adam of a violent campaign, while he himself has incited harassment. Adam was also quick to condemn harassment that was done in his name:

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/article/2024/jul/06/shockat-adam-independent-muslim-mp-leicester-south-victory-not-sectarian

 

I would say that I'm very distrustful of the messaging coming out of Labour specifically on these losses. I cheered Jess Phillips holding her seat against Jody McIntyre and his/Galloway's misogynistic thugs, but there has been an intent coming from Labour to frame all these independents as similar to that. The independent ones specifically didn't join Galloway's "workers party", and I'm hoping that's because several of them weren't single issue campaigners, and didn't endorse his abusive and toxic ideology and campaign strategy. I had heard some decent things about Iqbal Mohamed and the pre-election hustings. It was Adnan Hussain whose initial words made me most wary.

 

Given the big dissonance between the Galloway abusive tactics, and how effectively Adam used the local political system and campaigning, I'd be very disappointed if they did fully unite. My impression was very much that 2-3 of these were local efforts by established local campaigners. It's not like Corbyn isn't a somewhat toxic brand as well.

I would argue that the Independents were more single issue than Galloway's party...he campaigned on Gaza to the muslim population and sounded a bit like Reform to the white population.

[Spuddhism]

2 hours ago, steviewevie said:

whose going to wipe our bottoms?

Well, you do need a hobby... 

[kaosmark2]

25 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

I would argue that the Independents were more single issue than Galloway's party...he campaigned on Gaza to the muslim population and sounded a bit like Reform to the white population.

Galloway's always been a two-faced abusive liar. Some of the independents did at least talk about actual local issues and cost-of-living stuff without being inflammatory and inciteful.

[steviewevie]

2 minutes ago, kaosmark2 said:

Galloway's always been a two-faced abusive liar. Some of the independents did at least talk about actual local issues and cost-of-living stuff without being inflammatory and inciteful.

did they say they'd fix the NHS and social care and the pot holes?

[steviewevie]

and build new homes but not build new homes. Sort out crime. Clean the streets. Get high street thriving again. Make <whatever shithole> Great Again.

[steviewevie]

and then sit in parliament scratching their nuts with f**k all power to do anything

(which is why a independents party might make sense)

[Spuddhism]

If a majority of constituents in some communities voted in an independent (even where the candidate stood on a single issue, opposition to the killing of Palestinians) then, so long as that situation continues, the MP should surely continue putting their energy into that cause? That is a healthy democracy at work, isn't it? 

[Spuddhism]

#OneTierKeir

 

[steviewevie]

1 hour ago, Spuddhism said:

If a majority of constituents in some communities voted in an independent (even where the candidate stood on a single issue, opposition to the killing of Palestinians) then, so long as that situation continues, the MP should surely continue putting their energy into that cause? That is a healthy democracy at work, isn't it? 

Sure...so they can work ending the genocide and freeing Palestine from the river to the sea whilst sitting in Parliament scratching their nuts.

And since when did we have a healthy democracy?

[steviewevie]

 

[kaosmark2]

3 hours ago, steviewevie said:

Sure...so they can work ending the genocide and freeing Palestine from the river to the sea whilst sitting in Parliament scratching their nuts.

And since when did we have a healthy democracy?

I mean, voting to stop supplying Israel with UK weapons could be a thing, and some of them have actually done work as local councillors, so might well be decent constituency MPs. I imagine if they do end up just using the role for impotent single issue campaigns they'll lose their seat next election.

[Nobody Interesting]

Sometimes people baffle me.

A new poll is out, can't find a link for you all though, where increasing inheritance tax is unpopular with the majority of people.

 

Under 4% of people actually pay any though so why on earth would the majority not want it increasing - or is the truth about it so hidden now that the majority think they will pay it?

[steviewevie]

19 minutes ago, Nobody Interesting said:

Sometimes people baffle me.

A new poll is out, can't find a link for you all though, where increasing inheritance tax is unpopular with the majority of people.

 

Under 4% of people actually pay any though so why on earth would the majority not want it increasing - or is the truth about it so hidden now that the majority think they will pay it?

aspiration

[steviewevie]

plus, they probably don't know only 4% pay it (I didn't).

[steviewevie]

.

Edited August 10 by steviewevie

[steviewevie]

Might go to stop the far right thing in town again, but I expect it will merge with the pro palestine thing and if I hear people calling far right here zionists I'll probably just leave it.

Also, whenever on these things get fed up with grizzled hippies trying to sell me socialist worker.

[Nobody Interesting]

16 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

plus, they probably don't know only 4% pay it (I didn't).

 

That surprises me lots as it has been in the news loads over the last 18 months when rumours of the Tories scrapping it came out lots of times.

It is a tax that effects the wealthiest only.

[kaosmark2]

2 hours ago, Nobody Interesting said:

Sometimes people baffle me.

A new poll is out, can't find a link for you all though, where increasing inheritance tax is unpopular with the majority of people.

 

Under 4% of people actually pay any though so why on earth would the majority not want it increasing - or is the truth about it so hidden now that the majority think they will pay it?

So many people buy the Tory lie that inheritance affects getting "the house I grew up in" or similar. It's been an incredibly successful deception campaign.

[steviewevie]

Well, did my bit. So much clichéd cringe at these things though, some woman started singing Something inside so strong fgs.

 

[clarkete]

1 hour ago, steviewevie said:

Well, did my bit. So much clichéd cringe at these things though, some woman started singing Something inside so strong fgs.

 

 

Rather cringe than all the other crazy BS of the last week

Edited August 10 by clarkete