UK Politics

[Neil]

9 hours ago, pink_triangle said:

To me not letting Abbott stand is being over cautious, at the same time she showed poor political judgement writing that letter.

itsw the party showing who's boss, necessary cos she won't accept party discipline to do the course.

[steviewevie]

 

[steviewevie]

2 minutes ago, Neil said:

itsw the party showing who's boss, necessary cos she won't accept party discipline to do the course.

 

well that only gets you so far when you need the party to go out and campaign for you and back you in parliament etc.

(and she did the course apparently)

[steviewevie]

 

[kaosmark2]

1 hour ago, steviewevie said:

...and now Labour have to look tough to the electorate, but try not to upset their own MPs and members who are very sympathetic to Abbott and how she's been treated. Having her whip restored and then she is grateful but says she will stand down at next election sounds like what they wanted, but instead they have f**ked it and now many across all parts of labour are upset and it just looks like Labour in-fighting and control freakery. Not a good look.

 

I actually e-mailed my MP about Elphicke's admission. Here's her response:

 

"On Natalie Elphicke, first, I too was surprised to hear that she was becoming a Labour MP. I have my disagreements with Natalie, on a number of policy areas and on issues of personal conduct, and I can assure you that my position on this would be different if she was standing as a Labour candidate at the upcoming General Election. She has stated that she will stand down as an MP at the election, so this is only for one more week, and Natalie does agree with Labour on two of the most important policy areas: that the Tories’ asylum policy is utterly dysfunctional and a colossal waste of taxpayer money; and that the Tories have utterly failed to deliver the housebuilding and housing reform that Britain desperately needs. This won’t change any of Labour’s policy positions, and ultimately won’t make a major difference in any respect, other than underscoring just how useless Rishi Sunak’s Government is."

 

Quite politically couched and mostly a response with the subtext of "yeah, it's a bummer, but she's not going to stand so get over it", but it does kinda imply that she was also irked and reticent to welcome Elphicke herself.

[steviewevie]

6 minutes ago, kaosmark2 said:

 

I actually e-mailed my MP about Elphicke's admission. Here's her response:

 

"On Natalie Elphicke, first, I too was surprised to hear that she was becoming a Labour MP. I have my disagreements with Natalie, on a number of policy areas and on issues of personal conduct, and I can assure you that my position on this would be different if she was standing as a Labour candidate at the upcoming General Election. She has stated that she will stand down as an MP at the election, so this is only for one more week, and Natalie does agree with Labour on two of the most important policy areas: that the Tories’ asylum policy is utterly dysfunctional and a colossal waste of taxpayer money; and that the Tories have utterly failed to deliver the housebuilding and housing reform that Britain desperately needs. This won’t change any of Labour’s policy positions, and ultimately won’t make a major difference in any respect, other than underscoring just how useless Rishi Sunak’s Government is."

 

Quite politically couched and mostly a response with the subtext of "yeah, it's a bummer, but she's not going to stand so get over it", but it does kinda imply that she was also irked and reticent to welcome Elphicke herself.

 

with Elphicke I guess they just thought overall an MP who was so vociferous about stopping the boats was quitting the Tories for Labour because the Tories couldn't stop the boats was an opportunity they couldn't turn down...optics and all that...but yeah for many in Labour this was a defection too far and in hindsight I'm not sure Labour would do it again, but then again maybe they would. The fact she is standing down does lessen the pain.

[Neil]

1 hour ago, steviewevie said:

 

well that only gets you so far when you need the party to go out and campaign for you and back you in parliament etc.

(and she did the course apparently)

Good to hear I hope she learnt something useful.

[kaosmark2]

14 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

 

with Elphicke I guess they just thought overall an MP who was so vociferous about stopping the boats was quitting the Tories for Labour because the Tories couldn't stop the boats was an opportunity they couldn't turn down...optics and all that...but yeah for many in Labour this was a defection too far and in hindsight I'm not sure Labour would do it again, but then again maybe they would. The fact she is standing down does lessen the pain.

 

Oh, I completely agree they viewed it as a political decision. I think they were incredibly naive to do so, as the Tories then unleashed the whips' blackmail material, and undid the political gain it might've had. It was an obvious counter-move from the Tories and I don't really think anyone can argue that anyone gained from it - except possibly Elphicke who has now raised her profile ahead of a potential post-politics career.

[Neil]

17 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

 

with Elphicke I guess they just thought overall an MP who was so vociferous about stopping the boats was quitting the Tories for Labour because the Tories couldn't stop the boats was an opportunity they couldn't turn down...optics and all that...but yeah for many in Labour this was a defection too far and in hindsight I'm not sure Labour would do it again, but then again maybe they would. The fact she is standing down does lessen the pain.

I reckon its cos if MPs can't swap sides its just about impossible to remove the govt.

[lost]

 

[steviewevie]

I think Lewis Goodall is one of the better political journalists out there...but also that Wes Streeting is one of the better current Labour ministers at doing this media stuff, which is why he's often doing the media rounds. He probably just wants to talk NHS and it must be frustrating having to defend this whole Abbott saga and Starmer...but that's what he's been dealt with.

 

[kaosmark2]

Just now, steviewevie said:

I think Lewis Goodall is one of the better political journalists out there...but also that Wes Streeting is one of the better current Labour ministers at doing this media stuff, which is why he's often doing the media rounds. He probably just wants to talk NHS and it must be frustrating having to defend this whole Abbott saga and Starmer...but that's what he's been dealt with.

 

I can't imagine why Streeting wants to talk about integrating private healthcare into the NHS:

https://www.thenational.scot/news/24250557.wes-streeting-takes-175k-donors-linked-private-health-firms/

 

He's just Jeremy Hunt in a red rosette. 

[steviewevie]

7 minutes ago, kaosmark2 said:

I can't imagine why Streeting wants to talk about integrating private healthcare into the NHS:

https://www.thenational.scot/news/24250557.wes-streeting-takes-175k-donors-linked-private-health-firms/

 

He's just Jeremy Hunt in a red rosette. 

 

I think he's ok. I don't buy all the funding allegations stuff seriously, maybe I'm naive. Everyone seems to be funded by private health care firms or weapons firms or Israel.

[steviewevie]

Actually Wes and Keir are doing an NHS thingy at the moment...

 

Edited May 29 by steviewevie

[steviewevie]

Starmer says no decision made on whether Abbott can stand yet.

🥴

[steviewevie]

No, I got that kind of wrong. He said that she is not barred from standing, the reports this morning were wrong. Holy moly, bit of a pickle.

[steviewevie]

So...it is not impossible that Abbott might have wanted to stand down...but now will feel like she can't?

[steviewevie]

definitely a bit of a wobble for Labour this. 

[lazyred]

13 hours ago, mattiloy said:

Then you see that the most right wing faction in Labour has an iron grip on the party, and they are every bit as slimey as the tories and are not far off them ideologically.

 

 The dominant faction in the Labour Party is not Labour First. It is a group called Labour Together. This is a soft left anti Corbyn group. It started as a Blue Labour group and was taken over by Morgan McSweeny and used as a vehicle to promote Keir Starmer to the leadership. A lot of the shadow cabinet have links to Labour Together.

[steviewevie]

 

 

[lazyred]

19 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

No, I got that kind of wrong. He said that she is not barred from standing, the reports this morning were wrong. Holy moly, bit of a pickle.

Starmer is doing his usual nothing to do with me innocent face. Under party rules the NEC decide candidates once the election is called. That's why all the resignations are announced now so the oarty can impose who they like in the safe seats. So she isn't barred because the NEC could still allow her to stand. Of course they will do what Starmer tells them to. Peston has mentioned a deal that she would be reinstated then resign gracefully but Labour couldn't resist briefing against her. 

[steviewevie]

22 minutes ago, lazyred said:

Starmer is doing his usual nothing to do with me innocent face. Under party rules the NEC decide candidates once the election is called. That's why all the resignations are announced now so the oarty can impose who they like in the safe seats. So she isn't barred because the NEC could still allow her to stand. Of course they will do what Starmer tells them to. Peston has mentioned a deal that she would be reinstated then resign gracefully but Labour couldn't resist briefing against her. 

I mean maybe the NEC has not made it's decision yet, but there are some in Labour that want her gone and leaked this to the Times...and now the backlash so Starmer will lean on the NEC to not barr her. 

[steviewevie]

6 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

I mean maybe the NEC has not made it's decision yet, but there are some in Labour that want her gone and leaked this to the Times...and now the backlash so Starmer will lean on the NEC to not barr her. 

 

but what this whole thing is doing is distracting from actual policies being announced.

[steviewevie]

[Neil]

33 minutes ago, lazyred said:

Starmer is doing his usual nothing to do with me

hes not allowed to interfere in disciplinary cases, cos of corbyn.