UK Politics

[steviewevie]

labour manifesto with lots of pics of Starmer looking like a middle manager.

Change – The Labour Party

[Nobody Interesting]

1 minute ago, steviewevie said:

labour manifesto with lots of pics of Starmer looking like a middle manager.

Change The Labour Party

 

I improved that for you 😉

[Nobody Interesting]

43 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

 

Listening to Starmer now I think 'Boring' needs to be even bigger

[mattiloy]

52 minutes ago, lazyred said:

Getting to european tax levels around 40% of gdp means everyone needs to pay more.

Within that tax rates should be fairer. That includes lowering the high marginal tax rates as the tax allowance is withdrawn but also paying full NI on all earnings. 

Unearned income and wealth gains  should d be taxed the sane as earnings.

 

The obsession with tax in the UK is bizarre. I pay more income tax here in Sweden than I would in the UK.

 

But i find it very easy to forego a bit of additional private income for the benefit of having a kid in preschool 36 hours a week for 100 quid a month, better healthcare, cheaper better transport, free tertiary education, greater investment in climatey sh*t etc etc.

 

Depends what kind of a world you wanna live in.

Heres a picture of a gated community in south africa which is ultimately the end state of the low tax mentality.

[steviewevie]

No surprises in that Labour manifesto...

[mattiloy]

Anyway Labour manifesto a mixed bag. Glad the rail nationalisation made the cut, along with some stuff around the edges like stopping badger culls but in regards to most things and in particular the welfare system and health its (probably deliberately) very wishy washy on actual policies and funding. Also sorry to see other peripheral policies like right to roam not make the cut. The landed gentry lobby won that argument.

Edited June 13 by mattiloy

[steviewevie]

 

[Nobody Interesting]

46 minutes ago, mattiloy said:

 

The obsession with tax in the UK is bizarre. I pay more income tax here in Sweden than I would in the UK.

 

But i find it very easy to forego a bit of additional private income for the benefit of having a kid in preschool 36 hours a week for 100 quid a month, better healthcare, cheaper better transport, free tertiary education, greater investment in climatey sh*t etc etc.

 

Depends what kind of a world you wanna live in.

Heres a picture of a gated community in south africa which is ultimately the end state of the low tax mentality.

 

In the UK political parties, well Labour and Tory, seem to want USA levels of tax but EU levels of service.

The 2 of course cannot happen side by side.

If you want services, higher tax.
If you want lower tax, less services.

[steviewevie]

1 minute ago, Nobody Interesting said:

 

In the UK political parties, well Labour and Tory, seem to want USA levels of tax but EU levels of service.

The 2 of course cannot happen side by side.

If you want services, higher tax.
If you want lower tax, less services.

well...our taxes aren't as low as US, and they are going up under tory and labour because of frozen tax bands..but yes still below G7 average (I think).

[Nobody Interesting]

1 minute ago, steviewevie said:

well...our taxes aren't as low as US, and they are going up under tory and labour because of frozen tax bands..but yes still below G7 average (I think).

 

Didn't say they were as low as the US - I said that the UK main 2 parties want low taxes like the US and good services like the EU and that you cannot have both.

[steviewevie]

8 minutes ago, Nobody Interesting said:

 

Didn't say they were as low as the US - I said that the UK main 2 parties want low taxes like the US and good services like the EU and that you cannot have both.

and both are putting up taxes.

But yes, they need to go up more, or it will be spending cuts...and they've tied their hands with all these commitments not to raise the main taxes...so they'll have to find money from somewhere unless they miraculously get the economy growing again.

[steviewevie]

and Lib Dems have also committed to not raise these main taxes...Reform want to cut loads, Greens want to raise loads.

[steviewevie]

 

[Nobody Interesting]

15 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

and Lib Dems have also committed to not raise these main taxes...Reform want to cut loads, Greens want to raise loads.

 

I clearly stated the TWO MAIN PARTIES and even named them......................... they both WANT to have lower taxes like the USA and WANT better services like the EU. How do I know that? Cos they both say they want lower taxes and want to improve services.

Still, words, words words. Just read those you fancy and ignore the rest.

[fraybentos1]

26 minutes ago, Nobody Interesting said:

.. they both WANT to have lower taxes

Labour certainly don't ? They haven't talked about lowering taxes to that level

 

27 minutes ago, Nobody Interesting said:

better services like the EU.

Where in the EU? That's a lot of countries you're grouping. How to public services compare in Greece & Germany for example

 

Also I don't know many people clamouring for welfare like you get in Scadinavia tbh- just back somewhere like the UK in say 2005. A time where things worked a bit & you could get a Dr appointment. 

[steviewevie]

44 minutes ago, Nobody Interesting said:

 

I clearly stated the TWO MAIN PARTIES and even named them......................... they both WANT to have lower taxes like the USA and WANT better services like the EU. How do I know that? Cos they both say they want lower taxes and want to improve services.

Still, words, words words. Just read those you fancy and ignore the rest.

Labour hasn't said that

[steviewevie]

What Labour have been saying is they will not raise taxes on working people. Not sure what that doesn't include.

[steviewevie]

[Nobody Interesting]

26 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

Labour hasn't said that

 

Labour has said so many times that they want lower taxes but only when the country can afford them. Labour always says they want better services.

Many read their manifesto in full.

[Nobody Interesting]

42 minutes ago, fraybentos1 said:

Labour certainly don't ? They haven't talked about lowering taxes to that level

 

Where in the EU? That's a lot of countries you're grouping. How to public services compare in Greece & Germany for example

 

Also I don't know many people clamouring for welfare like you get in Scadinavia tbh- just back somewhere like the UK in say 2005. A time where things worked a bit & you could get a Dr appointment. 

 

Labour have said they want to have lower taxes on 'working people' and have many times said they want lower taxes like in the USA. There are loads of examples in Hansard.

In the EU taxes are higher than the UK and services per capita are better funded. It is an EU wide statistic which is why I said the EU.

I don't expect you to understand that though as you will, as always, just select a little random part of one sentence to quote and question rather than the full post that has the context.

[Nobody Interesting]

13 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

 

You are still proving  apoi nt I did not make.

 

The point I said that is both main parties say often that they want better services (the EU has them) and they want lower taxes (the US has that)................. I then simply point out that you cannot have them both.

I did not say at any point that what any of them are doing now actually backs that up. Believe it or not some people actully write exactly what they are sayi g rather than writing something that might mean anything.

I have re-read my initial post and it really is very clear about what it says.

I shall now end this cos it is rather boring like the whole election and I have no doubt you will still ignore what I actually wrote as history suggests that is highly likely.

[steviewevie]

8 minutes ago, Nobody Interesting said:

 

You are still proving  apoi nt I did not make.

 

The point I said that is both main parties say often that they want better services (the EU has them) and they want lower taxes (the US has that)................. I then simply point out that you cannot have them both.

I did not say at any point that what any of them are doing now actually backs that up. Believe it or not some people actully write exactly what they are sayi g rather than writing something that might mean anything.

I have re-read my initial post and it really is very clear about what it says.

I shall now end this cos it is rather boring like the whole election and I have no doubt you will still ignore what I actually wrote as history suggests that is highly likely.

you said they both want lower taxes like the US.

 

But I will now end this so that I have the last say on the matter which no doubt you will ignore.

[steviewevie]

[steviewevie]

 

[Nobody Interesting]

2 hours ago, steviewevie said:

they both want lower taxes I say no doubt

 

We agree then