UK Politics

[steviewevie]

1 minute ago, Nobody Interesting said:

 

Our current network cannot cope - that is the whole point.

We need new infrastructure.

That can be enlarged gird stations on land fed by all the new pylons or offshore new grid stations.

Either will work or a mix of both.

They are not mutually exclusive and if one can be done faster like offshore grid stations can be then why not do that?

And you're saying all these offshore grids can just be connected to current network with no new pylons required? Something that wasn't even suggested in that ESO report...

[steviewevie]

and also if it was the usual Tory MPs objecting to this stuff we wouldn't even be discussing it.

[Nobody Interesting]

1 minute ago, steviewevie said:

And you're saying all these offshore grids can just be connected to current network with no new pylons required? Something that wasn't even suggested in that ESO report...

 

The ESO report was not about offshore grids - I did say that earlier.

Here, if you can be bothered to read them, are a couple of links about offshore grid.
https://www.offshorewind.biz/2024/01/24/eu-grid-operators-publish-offshore-network-development-plans/
https://windeurope.org/newsroom/news/meshed-grids-the-next-frontier-in-leveraging-the-potential-of-offshore-wind/

and to answer your first question, which I already have done, if we use offshore grids then a smaller number of new pylons onshore will be needs, about 5% approx on the last report I saw of what would be needed without offshore grids.
Grids are where electrons go to so they can be distributed or stored on the exisitn gdelivery system to homes and businesses. That part of the system is pretty OK - the part that needs adding is the delivery to the grid stations which are all currently onshore. So set new ones offshore and most pylons are no longer required.

I hope this all makes sense but it is what I have said lots already.

[clarkete]

5 hours ago, Nobody Interesting said:

 

It's all in the original article that started this ongoing conversation several days ago - the energy comapnies that back the offshore method are those who say it will be quicker and chaeaper and I take them as experts in that field so will trust them on it.

 

The offshore part IS NOT windfarms as your links all refer too - the off shore part is tjhe new grid infrastructure, the part that requires all the new pylons that people do not want onland.

 

Who shared the article?   I'm not reading through 314 pages 😉

 

One of my key uses of the thread is Stevie's news aggregation, but it does mean there's a lot of content 😊

[Nobody Interesting]

Just now, steviewevie said:

and also if it was the usual Tory MPs objecting to this stuff we wouldn't even be discussing it.

 

no and nor would the media - but if the usual Tory objectors offered an alternative, as the Green MNP backed by many energy companies, has then I would point it out as well - which is what I hve been doing as it seems most others ignored that part.

[Nobody Interesting]

1 minute ago, clarkete said:

 

Who shared the article?   I'm not reading through 314 pages 😉

 

One of my key uses of the thread is Stevie's news aggregation, but it does mean there's a lot of content 😊

 

It was, I think, a link Stevie shared from the Torygrapoh or similar maybe a week ago - yes this debate has gone on that long LOL

In simple terms they attacked the Green MP for being a NIMBY (followed by posters on here) ignoring the fact that they had suggested, backed by some energy compaines, a viable and cost effective alternative to hundreds of new pylons.
That alternative is to build new grid stations offshore rather than  have hundreds of new pylons on shire taking electricity to existing grid stations all based on land.
Some links in a post just above about hwo Europe is looking to do this too.

[steviewevie]

In that ESO report thing it does have all the options they went through, which includes keeping it all offshore...see in here from p26 onwards.  You can see the traffic light gradings for environment/community/cost etc for the different options, none are perfect. What comes first, environment, cost, or community?

https://www.nationalgrideso.com/document/304496/download

[steviewevie]

12 minutes ago, Nobody Interesting said:

 

It was, I think, a link Stevie shared from the Torygrapoh or similar maybe a week ago - yes this debate has gone on that long LOL

In simple terms they attacked the Green MP for being a NIMBY (followed by posters on here) ignoring the fact that they had suggested, backed by some energy compaines, a viable and cost effective alternative to hundreds of new pylons.
That alternative is to build new grid stations offshore rather than  have hundreds of new pylons on shire taking electricity to existing grid stations all based on land.
Some links in a post just above about hwo Europe is looking to do this too.

?

this?

On 7/17/2024 at 8:57 AM, steviewevie said:

 

 

[steviewevie]

BMA Latest

 

[Crazyfool01]

Those just stop oil sentences ridiculously harsh when we have a problem with prison overcrowding. Hopefully new govt will take a look 

[steviewevie]

13 minutes ago, Crazyfool01 said:

Those just stop oil sentences ridiculously harsh when we have a problem with prison overcrowding. Hopefully new govt will take a look 

they can put them in that massive new prison they're building in Waveney Valley.

[steviewevie]

 

[steviewevie]

besties

 

[Nobody Interesting]

3 hours ago, steviewevie said:

?

this?

 

No, that's just a simple tweet that ignores 99% of what was said/written

[Nobody Interesting]

45 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

 

 

Yawn

Just quote the one part and ignore the rest - for me all this does is make the new government start to look more like the last one - rather than work together, listen and discuss simply thrown a small p[art of the whole picture to try and score political points.

Din't take them long to start did it

[steviewevie]

8 minutes ago, Nobody Interesting said:

No, that's just a simple tweet that ignores 99% of what was said/written

you said I posted something about me sharing an article that started all this. I just posted that tweet.

[steviewevie]

7 minutes ago, Nobody Interesting said:

 

Yawn

Just quote the one part and ignore the rest - for me all this does is make the new government start to look more like the last one - rather than work together, listen and discuss simply thrown a small p[art of the whole picture to try and score political points.

Din't take them long to start did it

gobstopper

[Neil]

On 7/17/2024 at 2:14 PM, kaosmark2 said:

This is my concern really, when progressive Green policies are stopped by local "Green" NIMBYism. The issue is priorities, and like with other politicians, Greens' priority is their own seat/career. It shouldn't come as a surprise, just another reminder that it's naive to hope for anything better.

Its why they're called tree Tories 

[Neil]

1 hour ago, Nobody Interesting said:

 

Yawn

Just quote the one part and ignore the rest - for me all this does is make the new government start to look more like the last one - rather than work together, listen and discuss simply thrown a small p[art of the whole picture to try and score political points.

Din't take them long to start did it

Glad you've spotted the greens are like the Tories.

[kaosmark2]

6 hours ago, Crazyfool01 said:

Those just stop oil sentences ridiculously harsh when we have a problem with prison overcrowding. Hopefully new govt will take a look 

They also look ridiculous in comparison to sentencing (and conviction rates) for sexual assault, aggravated assault, hate crime, domestic abuse, etc.

 

This is vengeance sentencing, not practical sentencing, and goes against all the reasoned logic that seemed to go into appointing Timpson as prisons minister.

 

Protest is disruptive yes, but it isn't dangerous, and this was politically motivated sentencing.

 

Batshit.

[clarkete]

18 minutes ago, kaosmark2 said:

They also look ridiculous in comparison to sentencing (and conviction rates) for sexual assault, aggravated assault, hate crime, domestic abuse, etc.

 

This is vengeance sentencing, not practical sentencing, and goes against all the reasoned logic that seemed to go into appointing Timpson as prisons minister.

 

Protest is disruptive yes, but it isn't dangerous, and this was politically motivated sentencing.

 

Batshit.

"With environmental protest rising in the UK, ministers have sought to crack down on public disruptions by introducing legislation to curtail such activities — notably the Police, Crime, Sentencing and Courts Act 2022 and the Public Order Act 2023.

These changes, which strengthen police powers to restrict protests, to stop and search people “without suspicion”, as well as create new offences, have raised questions about civil liberties being encroached.

In January Michel Forst, the UN’s special rapporteur on environmental defenders, criticised the UK’s “increasingly severe crackdowns” on protest. He noted “it had been almost unheard of since the 1930s for members of the public to be imprisoned for peaceful protest in the UK”".

https://www.ft.com/content/f0bf8226-2072-4c15-b162-f611d93459b6

[steviewevie]

6 hours ago, clarkete said:

"With environmental protest rising in the UK, ministers have sought to crack down on public disruptions by introducing legislation to curtail such activities — notably the Police, Crime, Sentencing and Courts Act 2022 and the Public Order Act 2023.

These changes, which strengthen police powers to restrict protests, to stop and search people “without suspicion”, as well as create new offences, have raised questions about civil liberties being encroached.

In January Michel Forst, the UN’s special rapporteur on environmental defenders, criticised the UK’s “increasingly severe crackdowns” on protest. He noted “it had been almost unheard of since the 1930s for members of the public to be imprisoned for peaceful protest in the UK”".

https://www.ft.com/content/f0bf8226-2072-4c15-b162-f611d93459b6

 

Maybe Labour will repeal these new laws? 

I actually think there should be some sort of punishment for this and you can't just use we're worried about climate change as an excuse, but not silly prison sentences like the ones dished out to this lot. Short suspended sentence or a fine or community service planting trees or something.

Edited July 19 by steviewevie

[steviewevie]

w*nker

[LJS]

1 hour ago, steviewevie said:

 

Maybe Labour will repeal these new laws? 

I actually think there should be some sort of punishment for this and you can't just use we're worried about climate change as an excuse, but not silly prison sentences like the ones dished out to this lot. Short suspended sentence or a fine or community service planting trees or something.

or maybe they won't

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/oct/24/keir-starmer-backs-stiff-sentences-for-climate-protesters-who-block-roads

[Nobody Interesting]

There are very few countries that send people to prison for peaceful protest.

The likes of Iran, Belarus, Russia, China and the UK are included in them.