UK Politics

[charlierc]

Anyone else trying to figure out how this new EES/ESTA stuff for travelling to Europe that's coming in for us as non-EU citizens is meant to work?

[Nobody Interesting]

35 minutes ago, charlierc said:

Anyone else trying to figure out how this new EES/ESTA stuff for travelling to Europe that's coming in for us as non-EU citizens is meant to work?

 

Sounds pretty similar to what most other countries have and the details will be issued soon I read earlier.
 

[steviewevie]

Yay..time for tough decisions and hard choices etc.

 

[steviewevie]

..if the tories were still in they'd probably just reverse those NI cuts.

[Nobody Interesting]

Just now, steviewevie said:

..if the tories were still in they'd probably just reverse those NI cuts.

 

Nah, they would cut it more and cut services and benefits to pay for it.

[lost]

First time I have seen Labour are planning austerity along with the tax rises in October. £5.5bn in cuts coming apparently.

 

 

[steviewevie]

5 minutes ago, Nobody Interesting said:

 

Nah, they would cut it more and cut services and benefits to pay for it.

I don't think there is much more that can be cut...enough to make up for the short falls anyway. Probably a mix of tax rises and spending cuts whoever is in power.

[Nobody Interesting]

2 minutes ago, lost said:

First time I have seen Labour are planning austerity along with the tax rises in October. £5.5bn in cuts coming apparently.

 

 

 

The most un Labour, Labour, I have ever seen.

and this will only be the start I am afraid.

Re-opening immigration centres that you campaigned to get closed while in opposition really is rather baffling!!!

[steviewevie]

4 minutes ago, lost said:

First time I have seen Labour are planning austerity along with the tax rises in October. £5.5bn in cuts coming apparently.

 

 

£5.5bn in efficiency savings.

[Nobody Interesting]

Just now, steviewevie said:

I don't think there is much more that can be cut...enough to make up for the short falls anyway. Probably a mix of tax rises and spending cuts whoever is in power.

 

The Tories were going to cut £12 billion from benefits, primarily PIP....................... which is the main reason we have the black hole as that £12 billion plus the nearly £10 for pay rises gives you the total you need.
I saw one economist actually say this but mostly it has been ignored. The Tories set it all up so they had covered the 'shortfall' but if not elected it would be there for Labour to sort.

Basic snide economics to trap the opponents.

Why oh why will nobody tax those with the majority of money - that will fill the holes with relative ease.................... but instead they let them grow wealthier as that helps to grow GDP which we keep being told helps all of us........................... one day 'all of us' will realise GDP helps those that have and helps cover up the unsustainable debt countries have and never really helps 'us'.

[steviewevie]

Just now, Nobody Interesting said:

 

Why oh why will nobody tax those with the majority of money - that will fill the holes with relative ease.................... but instead they let them grow wealthier as that helps to grow GDP which we keep being told helps all of us........................... one day 'all of us' will realise GDP helps those that have and helps cover up the unsustainable debt countries have and never really helps 'us'.

You mean tax wealth? I think that is where we will see tax rises...inheritance, cgt maybe. Problem is people find ways to avoid it and may not raise as much has hoped for...and also some argue could hurt the whole investment thing needed for the whole growth thing.

But yeah, I think go for wealth. Should go for higher incomes too but they've ruled that out.

[steviewevie]

..and reverse those NI cuts...or even better reform it so pensioners pay NI too or bin it and stick it all on income tax or something or other.

Need to get all the hard sh*t out of the way early in parliament, and hope that economy keeps improving so have more money to spend at public services so things feel at least a bit better by the next election.

[steviewevie]

Also winter fuel payment cut has gone down like a cup of cold sick. Don't f**k with pensioners. 

[steviewevie]

[lost]

Based on population we appear to losing more rich people than anywhere else on the planet:

 

[steviewevie]

13 minutes ago, lost said:

Based on population we appear to losing more rich people than anywhere else on the planet:

 

Yeah tax receipts down..this part of the reason?

Don't f**k with pensioners and don't f**k with rich people.

[steviewevie]

tax the rich etc

 

[clarkete]

1 hour ago, steviewevie said:

Yeah tax receipts down..this part of the reason?

Don't f**k with pensioners and don't f**k with rich people.

 

Can't find anything about New World Wealth, other than they're a SA firm who track through property purchases and the like.  Lots of folks report their data but no comment on the quality for better or for worse. 

 

Still, if it's true at least we know we're not missing out on the trickledown effect. 

[steviewevie]

 

[Nobody Interesting]

3 hours ago, lost said:

Based on population we appear to losing more rich people than anywhere else on the planet:

 

 

Latest estimates are that there are over 2,500,000 UK millionaires so losing 9,500 is peanuts. The UK also, according to Statistica, has more elderly millionaires that other averages so likely many of the reduction simply died.

I always take charts like this with huge pinches of salt as the are almost always put together by groups representing the wealthy who want to make us all think they wil pack up and leave if we tax them - which the vast majority will not.

[gary1979666]

30 minutes ago, Nobody Interesting said:

 

Latest estimates are that there are over 2,500,000 UK millionaires so losing 9,500 is peanuts. The UK also, according to Statistica, has more elderly millionaires that other averages so likely many of the reduction simply died.

I always take charts like this with huge pinches of salt as the are almost always put together by groups representing the wealthy who want to make us all think they wil pack up and leave if we tax them - which the vast majority will not.

No, that can't be right - 3.5% of the UK population?  

I suppose with house prices, that might be possible, but just because someone's house has increased in value lots over time, doesn't mean they have the cash to pay any more in taxes.  I know Labour don't care about pensioners, but forcing a million or so of them to sell their house in order to pay a wealth tax will not go down well......actually might be quite popular with those wanting house prices to drop!

 

[lost]

4 hours ago, steviewevie said:

Yeah tax receipts down..this part of the reason?

Don't f**k with pensioners and don't f**k with rich people.

 

Yep. The guardian seem quite happy about it:

 

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/article/2024/jun/21/britain-millionaires-leave-tax-havens-uk

 

Not sure I fancy Dubai myself. If your not going with a partner that 70% / 30% male to female ratio is going to be hard work.

Edited August 21 by lost

[Nobody Interesting]

33 minutes ago, gary1979666 said:

No, that can't be right - 3.5% of the UK population?  

I suppose with house prices, that might be possible, but just because someone's house has increased in value lots over time, doesn't mean they have the cash to pay any more in taxes.  I know Labour don't care about pensioners, but forcing a million or so of them to sell their house in order to pay a wealth tax will not go down well......actually might be quite popular with those wanting house prices to drop!

 

Latest numbers are 4.8% according to this.

https://uk.finance.yahoo.com/news/percentage-brits-millionaires-does-compare-162600003.html

[Nobody Interesting]

5 hours ago, steviewevie said:

 

The UK, so we are told, has a £22 billion black hole that must be filled to cancel out the gap between tax receipts and spending and yet here we have a graph showing UK annual borrowing at £51.9 billion.........

So why does the other £39.9 billion not matter or are we keeping on pretending that GDP growth will 'cancel that out'?

Are we all really supposed to believe that £22 billion is a problem when the UK debt is now over £3 Trillion and growing at £5170 per second?
https://www.nationaldebtclock.co.uk/

Global debt levels are unsustainable, global debt grows all the time and yet there is no more money - they print bonds to create money that will never be paid back. $307 trillion at the end of 2023..................... who did we 'borrow' it all from and why don't those people ever seem to want it paying back?

The entire global finance system is based on pure folly, folly that crashed when the pandemic hit and then crashed again when it ended and yet we carry on doing the same again afterwards.

Good luck with the future if you are young cos debt levels will hit 200% of GDP in the next 100 years here in the UK and will never reduce.

Edited August 21 by Nobody Interesting

[steviewevie]

3 minutes ago, Nobody Interesting said:

 

The UK, so we are told, has a £22 billion black hole that must be filled to cancel out the gap between tax receipts and spending and yet here we have a graph showing UK annual borrowing at £51.9 billion.........

So why does the other £39.9 billion not matter or are we keeping on pretending that GDP growth will 'cancel that out'?

Are we all really supposed to believe that £22 billion is a problem when the UK debt is now over £3 Trillion and growing at £5170 per second?
https://www.nationaldebtclock.co.uk/

Global debt levels are unsustainable, global debt grows all the time and yet there is no more money - they print bonds to create money that will never be paid back. $307 trillion at the end of 2023..................... who did we 'borrow' it all from and why don't those people ever seem to want it paying back?

The entire global finance system is based on pure folly, folly that crashed when the pandemic hit and then crashed again when it ended and yet we carry on doing the same again afterwards.

Good luck with the future if you are young cos debt levels will hit 200% of GDP in the next 100 years here in the UK and will never reduce.

you mean we should live within our means or something...household budget economics?