the large hadron collidor particle accelerator

[King Blue]

Put me on the trail of 'lucifer's hammer' as well.Apparently there's some huge conspiracy to turn Saturn into the second sun by crashing a spaceship into the planet. This will reveal the anti Christ according to my sources.

There seems to be an awful lot of dooms day predictions being bandied about by religious types these days.September 10,Lucifer's hammer,Mayan Calender ending,Nostrodamus predicts 2012 as end of world year. I was watching a documentary about Christians who are sure the end is nigh. Their judgment day is pretty drawn out and harsh.

[worm]

it should be over before we know it,painful though that split second would be.

[llcoolphil]

[Makes me wish I got science though.Try as I might,I'm utter tripe at it. Seems like whatever we discover as a result of the experiment will be the biggest moment in modern physics,which is quite exciting.What that could lead to,they don't even know.

Edited September 2, 2008 by llcoolphil

[worm]

That's not really true. Scientists already knew there were sub atomic particles - protons and neutrons. What they discovered was that the existing sub atomic particles are made up of smaller particles - quarks, bosuns, gluons and a whole host of others. In essence, it wasn't smaller atoms they found, but a whole new sub atomic world. They're hoping to find the Higgs Bosun on this experiment. They don't know even whether it exists but there is too much matter in the universe that is unaccounted for and they're hoping the discovery of the HB might provide some answers.

[llcoolphil]

Yeah, fair point. I was using laymans terms. Basically, raising the whole russian doll syndrome in that things become smaller and smaller to the point of nothingness, whereas objective science entirely depends upon a base element.

My point was that it takes more than a split second for pain to register in consciousness. This is well established knowledge. I wouldn't be breaking any moulds with that, I'm afraid.

Edited September 2, 2008 by llcoolphil

[worm]

Karl Sagan (I think don't quote me on it) posits that there might not actually be a base just a neverending russian doll in both directions.

Edited September 2, 2008 by worm

[ste4_20]

One philosophy claims that the base of matter is mathematical formula, and therefore, you'd be able to link the two worlds together.

We're not doing anything really different to what the ancient civilisations did when they ground up rocks into dust to try and discover more, we're just doing it on a smaller scale. Personally, I don't think we'll ever discover what everything actually is absolutely, if we do claim to do so, then it'll be thrown out by the next Euclid/Newton/Einstein. Science is only ever as good as its latest theory.

[llcoolphil]

But wouldn't time be relative to the impulse as well? Surely our bioloical system doesn't depend upon external and abstract concepts of time? Surely if a split second lasted hours our consciousness would perceive this as a split second.

[worm]

One philosophy claims that the base of matter is mathematical formula, and therefore, you'd be able to link the two worlds together.

[worm]

Time is an entirely abstract concept unrelated to our biological system

Edited September 2, 2008 by worm

[ste4_20]

My relativity theory isn't great, but according to the rocket argument, if you're experiencing time dilation, then you experience time 'normally' but to someone observing you, time is 'slower' than normal.

So if you experience pain as stated, then it would seem to be a split second, but to someone else observing it outside of your conditions, it would be a longer stretch of time.

Like I said, my relativity isn't great though. And all this is assuming Einstein is right.

[Mellowfella]

I think I just found my Limit.

Interesting as this is I cant understand a bloomin word. And the Vids been removed.

[rabid]

I think you're right.

However, I'd suggest that science (well, objective science) is not the right place to look for what everything actually is.

[worm]

Let me guess. Post-modernism is the right place.

[worm]

My relativity theory isn't great, but according to the rocket argument, if you're experiencing time dilation, then you experience time 'normally' but to someone observing you, time is 'slower' than normal.

So if you experience pain as stated, then it would seem to be a split second, but to someone else observing it outside of your conditions, it would be a longer stretch of time.

Edited September 2, 2008 by worm

[Katster]

Damn. There are many things I'd want to do if the world is going to end in eight days.

Most obviously, it's been a bit too long - anyone fancy a shag?

[Katster]

My relativity theory isn't great, but according to the rocket argument, if you're experiencing time dilation, then you experience time 'normally' but to someone observing you, time is 'slower' than normal.

So if you experience pain as stated, then it would seem to be a split second, but to someone else observing it outside of your conditions, it would be a longer stretch of time.

Like I said, my relativity isn't great though. And all this is assuming Einstein is right.

[Spiderden]

Like I said, my relativity isn't great though. And all this is assuming Einstein is right.

[Radar]

Aye, go on then.

I hate things like this. I always want to be interested, but I never understand any of it. I was much better at biology at school than I was physics and chemistry

Edited September 2, 2008 by Radar

[Radar]

.. that's very sweet......

...i think

[ste4_20]

Experimental results indicate that he probably is correct. Atomic clocks placed in space craft/satellites show a difference in the relative speed of time exactly as Einstein predicted. They've even shown that gravity bends light when they measured the position of a star visibly close to the Sun during a solar eclipse. The perceived position of the star was exactly where Einstein said it would be.

Edited September 2, 2008 by ste4_20

[snorky]

It's not the daftest thing science has come up with.. remember when they were seriously considering putting mirrors in space to reflect the sun so it would always be day time?

If the world ends, I can deal with it.. death's gonna happen.. I'd just rather have a party.

Plus there are so many predictions that the world'll end 2012 I'm going to sway with that date. NYE 2011'll be fun.

[worm]

They're all old arguments and experiments though, the star one was as far back as 1919 if memory serves. Its not so much his overall quantum theory, its some of the finer points, like faster than light travel, that are under scrutiny, as shown in the EPR experiments, so there are more and more scientists (still a minority however) are accepting Leibniz's more philosophical minority view, something which Einstein had begun to realise towards the end of his career.

[Spiderden]

.

Einstein's only right until someone else comes along with a better theory, empiricism at its finest.

[worm]

Similar to when Einstein showed that Newton's Laws of motion produce approximate results at slow velocities but completely fall apart at high velocity (nearing c).

Ar you sure about Leibniz? He was a contemporary of Newton, not Einstein.