The Cuts. Is YOUR arse twitchin?

[llcoolphil]

so show me the facts for your claims that it JUST about "community based schooling".

And then there was silence from worm.

[worm]

so show me the facts for your claims that it JUST about "community based schooling".

[eFestivals]

You made claims for The Browne Report that don't exist, mainly because yu haven't read it when you said you had.

I've read it, along with many other things.

Of most important to me is remembering what is said within a piece of work, rather than remembering the exact piece of work it's come from.

If you had read it you would have known it didn't - and would also have known it made recommendations you are diametrically opposed to.

Really? I hadn't realised that I was against fees - thanks for telling me.

You then cited a news report as being inicative of how things are going to change whilst also saying that there was nothing new in the news report.

See, you just can't help but make it up.

I cited a news report as bringing to your attention the very things that you'd said only the day before couldn't happen.

And there was nothing new in that news report. If you'd been following the news on this subject more closely (and for more than just a few weeks) you'd know that there was nothing new.

You have given us 'fact' after 'fact' after 'fact' but not a single piece of evidence to support it. Because you couldn't find a single thing on a google search.

have you provided references for everything you've sdaid? Nope.

Tell you what, I'll do it when you do - but your references must also categorically state that what I've said is wrong to prove you right. The absence of anything on what I've said proves nothing about what I've said.

Id say that's a pretty good definition of being found out.

Ditto - see above.

But it's dead funny how those who say it's just about research skills have so little of their own.

[worm]

Do you have an account with any of the major research sites Neil? ERIC, ScienceDirect, JSTOR, PsychInfo etc.....

[llcoolphil]

here

it's just an example.

I'm no expert on education abroad, what I do know is that ours has been messed around with for the last 20-30 years, getting bogged down with league tables and tests (and uniforms), and the kids are just part of an ongoing, not very succesful experiment

[eFestivals]

Ive provided you with many links to substantiate my claims. You can find them on these very forums.

So why the silence from you?

You have provided no link that addresses what I've said in any way - they have not said what I have said is right, and they have not said what I have said is wrong.

Yet you are saying they prove me wrong, despite you providing no evidence to back up your claim.

I give you silence, you give me stuff you've made up. One of us is on the better ground and it's not you.

[feral chile]

yea, we heard all those arguments, and in the end they don't really have much to back them up.

The equality thing fails straight away. The kids who wear second hand uniforms with patches and holes or too big or too small etc etc are identified just as easily. In fact compared to kids who are happy to wear jeans and trainers, where a bit of 'wear' is desired sometimes, it's more obvious.

It was also argued that it helped them have an identity... being identified as a child from a given school was the only identity it gave them. It was also suggested it helped make the kids 'proud' of their school... they're going to be really proud to wear clothes they wouldn't out of choice. What's so great about identifying with anything at that age. As a parent I'm trying to encourage individuality while the school is trying to knock it out of them

there was also issues with gangs from other schools attacking other gangs from other schools. A unifrom simply makes the 'target' more obvious

kids getting sent home for wearing dark, not black tights... it was a tiresome episode all round

why is it only uk schools that think uniforms are so great? Arrogance is all I can put it down to

[eFestivals]

I'm not trying to convince you.

To turn your own take back on you: no evidence = bullshit.

[worm]

what split?

[eFestivals]

Do you have an account with any of the major research sites Neil? ERIC, ScienceDirect, JSTOR, PsychInfo etc.....

personally, no. Do I have access to those and an awful lot more? Yes I do.

As I've told you before, the funniest one is the site about who are the good 'researchers'. You get a LOT of mentions, I wonder why?

[worm]

To turn your own take back on you: no evidence = bullshit.

[worm]

personally, no.

Edited February 11, 2011 by worm

[eFestivals]

Once again, I'm not trying to convince you.

To turn your own take back on you: no evidence = bullshit.

It's funny how you've taken this line since I brought to your attention the fact that discrimination at about the same level existed before the 'community based education' you say is the only cause of the discrimination.

It's funny how you've taken this line since I brought to your attention that it's not possible for what you said about 'community based education' to bring any academic results at all.

It's a strange world, eh?

[llcoolphil]

You have provided no link that addresses what I've said in any way - they have not said what I have said is right, and they have not said what I have said is wrong.

[worm]

As I've told you before, the funniest one is the site about who are the good 'researchers'. You get a LOT of mentions, I wonder why?

[llcoolphil]

I'd prefer the school imposing a dress code than the peer group. It's less socially excluding overall, I think.

I've had similar conversations regarding my own work wear. There's no dress code at work, but my friend pointed out that makes it far easier to identify the nonconformists.

[llcoolphil]

Care to disclose this illegal site to me?

[worm]

To turn your own take back on you: no evidence = bullshit.

Edited February 11, 2011 by worm

[eFestivals]

That's a shame because I won't be able to send you the research you crave.

You just this minute said that you don't have access to those research sites. And you wonder why people give up on you.

again, you get to show why you're so f**king stupid - you just can't read,. and from that you get almost everything wrong.

I answered your question precisely.

You asked "do I have an account". The answer to that is no.

I stated that I have access to them, because I do. I have access to them via the accounts of other people or organisations - some I can't name, but one is the educational/academic publisher for whom I worked for for about 10 years.

FFS, you're a f**king dullard.

If you do, then have a scan over the many sub-topics raised here particularly in relation to the decision making process at entry level and the different forms of education.

I already know what the unis claim themselves, thanks.

But I also know that their own admission figures prove those claims as lies. Check the historicals, which show that little has changed with the proportional number of state school applicants while state schooling has changed a lot.

The thing I fear is that you just want to win and argument and enforce your view rather than actually learn that it's wrong.

My only interest in all such things is getting to the correct solution to the problems. But that requires a correct recognition of the problems in the first place.

The facts get to show that there is cultural discrimination since the year dot, nothing at all to do with any differences in the manner of schooling - this is proven by the historicals.

And please do note that I've at no point dismissed the validity of the idea that some schools don't prepare their students for uni as well as others (tho your take on community based schooling is utter bollocks) - but that is not all of the problem; the problem is more than JUST that, it's also one of institutional discrimination based on background.

[eFestivals]

I'm not trying to convince you, I'm simply rebuking your claims to the contrary.

but you're doing so on the basis of NO evidence. You've presented NOTHING which rebukes what I've said.

Fact? What discrimination at what level? How could discrimination exist at a community versus research based level when there was no level?

f**king dullard.

I've said that about the same level of discrimination against state school pupils existed BEFORE the "community based schooling" you say is the ONLY cause of the discrimination.

Learn to f**king read properly. No wonder you're always so full of shit.

[eFestivals]

Care to disclose this illegal site to me?

Why do you think that private conversations are illegal?

People are doing nothing illegal in giving their experiences.

[worm]

I answered your question precisely.

[eFestivals]

How the f**k do you know? By your own admission you didnt read them

Because you'd be willy waving it in my face if it refuted what I've said.

So what I said remains true: you've no evidence that what I've said is wrong.

Yet you state I'm wrong on the basis of no evidence. Is that a part of the high academic levels your own ideas are aiming at?

[worm]

People are doing nothing illegal in giving their experiences.

[eFestivals]

No, you answered it ambiguously.

Yeah, I'm so ambiguous, and you're the world's perfect reader. But, oh dear, look.....

Do you have an account with any of the major research sites Neil?

personally, no. Do I have access to those and an awful lot more? Yes I do.

The only ambiguity there is with your own poor reading skills.