The pre-sale con....

[jump]

Realistically my guess is Sons & Daughters, been around awhile to have a fan club but not big enough that anyone actually gives a shit about them and the reasson Oafish doesn't want to say their name as he has a crush on one of the lasses.

[rexclark]

My bets are either Sally Morgan, Phsycic or Roy Chubby Brown.

He seems the type.

[minute5072]

Will Young? Elton John? George Michael? John Barrowman?.....

[Kowalski]

I vote for Jim Davidson.

[Jackmypie]

Katherine Jenkins.

[The Nal]

Lee Evans.

[MrZigster]

I've just bought some tickets in a pre-sale through seetickets.

Ticket limits

MAXIMUM 4 TICKETS PER PERSON

Please adhere to published ticket limits.

[jump]

I've just bought some tickets in a pre-sale through seetickets.

So, are they just relying on a touts honesty? Don't they do ANY checks themselves for same address, card number, etc.?

[eFestivals]

I always thought it was an automated system so when both transactions are processed the computer cancels them and that's why every now and then you can still get the odd tix even when it's sold out?

it's certainly the case that See takes the order but doesn't process the credit card at the moment of taking the order (it processes the money part separately at a later time), so might well do anti-tout checking at that later time too.

But my personal belief (I don't know how they actually do this) is that they only do anti-tout checks if it's been asked for by the promoter (and it's unlikely that many would ask for them) - after all, both the promoter and the ticket agent is really only interested in selling tickets and taking the money. There's no reason why either would care very much about who is buying the tickets.

It's certainly the case that when the govt asked ticket agents to run anti-tout checks as standard they refused on-mass, wanting instead the govt to introduce anti-touting laws which would have guaranteed those agents position in the ticketing market. Thankfully the govt said they'd only introduce anti-touting laws if the agents first introduced their own measures to demonstrate that laws were needed beyond some fairly simple measures that the agents could do themselves.

The fact that the agents wouldn't introduce those simple measures got to demonstrate that the agents don't much care about touts.

[kaosmark2]

it's certainly the case that See takes the order but doesn't process the credit card at the moment of taking the order (it processes the money part separately at a later time), so might well do anti-tout checking at that later time too.

But my personal belief (I don't know how they actually do this) is that they only do anti-tout checks if it's been asked for by the promoter (and it's unlikely that many would ask for them) - after all, both the promoter and the ticket agent is really only interested in selling tickets and taking the money. There's no reason why either would care very much about who is buying the tickets.

It's certainly the case that when the govt asked ticket agents to run anti-tout checks as standard they refused on-mass, wanting instead the govt to introduce anti-touting laws which would have guaranteed those agents position in the ticketing market. Thankfully the govt said they'd only introduce anti-touting laws if the agents first introduced their own measures to demonstrate that laws were needed beyond some fairly simple measures that the agents could do themselves.

The fact that the agents wouldn't introduce those simple measures got to demonstrate that the agents don't much care about touts.

[eFestivals]

Considering that most of the agents are touts themselves with their spinoff agencies (Seatwave, Viagogo, etc.), it's damn obvious.

As far as I'm aware, neither seatwave or viagogo are anything to do with legit first-sale ticket agents. They are simply scumbag touts, and that fact isn't changed by them putting on corporate suits.

Ticketmaster has GetMeIn, tho I'm not sure if that's something they started independently cos they thought it was a good idea, or if it's in response to the existence of the likes of Scumwave and Viaripoff.

I know that See has started a 'resale ticket agency' (tout), but that's definitely been started in response. A sort-of "if you can't beat them, join them".

Like so much else that's going on in the world right now, these things are just yet another drive to the bottom, and none of it is sustainable long-term.

[kaosmark2]

As far as I'm aware, neither seatwave or viagogo are anything to do with legit first-sale ticket agents. They are simply scumbag touts, and that fact isn't changed by them putting on corporate suits.

Ticketmaster has GetMeIn, tho I'm not sure if that's something they started independently cos they thought it was a good idea, or if it's in response to the existence of the likes of Scumwave and Viaripoff.

I know that See has started a 'resale ticket agency' (tout), but that's definitely been started in response. A sort-of "if you can't beat them, join them".

Like so much else that's going on in the world right now, these things are just yet another drive to the bottom, and none of it is sustainable long-term.

[eFestivals]

Viagogo is Gigantic's.

nope, 100% wrong.

I'm sure I've seen Seatwave at least advertised by legit first-sale agents if not directly associated.

It might be the case that some agents have decided to use Seatwave as a secondary outlet rather than start up their own, but as far as I'm aware both Seatwave and Viagogo are both independently owned and have been financed to-date (they're both losing money hand over fist) via funds they've raised in 'the City'.

[jump]

I think Viagogo go further than just being owned by Gigantic, you only have to go to their site to see the amount of "partners" they have...

http://www.viagogo.co.uk/partners.aspx

[eFestivals]

Viagogo are NOT owned by Gigantic. As far as I'm aware - and I talk to the bosses at Gigantic monthly at least - there is absolutely no relationship between the two. It's certainly never been mentioned.

[kaosmark2]

nope, 100% wrong.

It might be the case that some agents have decided to use Seatwave as a secondary outlet rather than start up their own, but as far as I'm aware both Seatwave and Viagogo are both independently owned and have been financed to-date (they're both losing money hand over fist) via funds they've raised in 'the City'.

[jump]

Maybe not owned, but definitely associated.

'However you can buy The Cure tickets now through Gigantic's ticket resale partner, viagogo. Where we don't have tickets to sell directly, we recommend viagogo for safe and secure access to the tickets you want.

More Information

Why have Gigantic partnered with viagogo?

We'd love to have tickets to sell to everyone who visits us, but it's not always possible. Sometimes we don't get an allocation of tickets to sell. Sometimes we sell out in next to no time. We recognize that people will still want to go and see their favourite bands, and will try to get tickets wherever they can.

Unfortunately there are some unscrupulous people out there who take advantage of this, and take people's money (often lots of it) for fake or non-existent tickets. We've seen people's heartbreak at gigs first hand, but don't just take our word for it. In a survey by the Office Of Fair Trading, 1 in 12 ticket buyers admitted to being caught out by scam ticket websites, losing an average of £80 each*.

viagogo offers a safe and secure alternative. It's Europe's largest online ticket exchange, allowing fans to buy and sell tickets directly. viagogo guarantees that you'll get the tickets you ordered in time for the event, or your money back in full.

* Online survey of 3,000 UK consumers. Research data released 10 September 2009. What will tickets cost?

The ticket price is set by the seller. For sold out shows, ticket prices will reflect demand, so they're likely to be higher than the face value. But there are also bargains to be had!'

http://gigantic.com/...e_the_cure.html

[kaosmark2]

With the amount of fees you have to pay there's no bargains on that site.

[eFestivals]

Maybe not owned, but definitely associated.

that's simply them as an 'affiliate' of Viagogo, where they get a percentage of any sales they drive onto Viagogo (you can see that via the URL they use to link they make to viagogo).

To put that in perspective, there's a shit festivals website that is an affiliate of Viagogo, while efestivals is an affiliate of Gigantic, See, Ticketmaster, Ticketline and some others (but none of the tout sites).

I doubt you'd say that efests was 'associated' with the agents its an affiliate of simply by linking to tickets they have on sale. You certainly wouldn't say that efests owns any of those agents.

I'm very disappointed that Gigantic feels the need to work with Viagogo, but perhaps they're struggling so much by themselves that they need every penny they could make from anywhere in order to survive.

My own take on this sort of thing is that I'd give up on efestivals and close it down before I'd cosy up to those scumbag touts. They keep trying to cosy up to me, cos just about every time they get a new person working for them I get emailed (their staff turnover is high, so they're not only scumbags they're clearly shit to work for too). And everytime I get a mail like that I send back a not polite email calling them scumbag touts and worse, because it's never wrong to say what you mean.

[kaosmark2]

that's simply them as an 'affiliate' of Viagogo, where they get a percentage of any sales they drive onto Viagogo (you can see that via the URL they use to link they make to viagogo).

To put that in perspective, there's a shit festivals website that is an affiliate of Viagogo, while efestivals is an affiliate of Gigantic, See, Ticketmaster, Ticketline and some others (but none of the tout sites).

I doubt you'd say that efests was 'associated' with the agents its an affiliate of simply by linking to tickets they have on sale. You certainly wouldn't say that efests owns any of those agents.

I'm very disappointed that Gigantic feels the need to work with Viagogo, but perhaps they're struggling so much by themselves that they need every penny they could make from anywhere in order to survive.

My own take on this sort of thing is that I'd give up on efestivals and close it down before I'd cosy up to those scumbag touts. They keep trying to cosy up to me, cos just about every time they get a new person working for them I get emailed (their staff turnover is high, so they're not only scumbags they're clearly shit to work for too). And everytime I get a mail like that I send back a not polite email calling them scumbag touts and worse, because it's never wrong to say what you mean.

[mikeb]

Re Viagogo:

In the spring of 1999, Eric Baker wanted to surprise his girlfriend by taking her to see the new Broadway hit show, The Lion King. Unfortunately, the show was sold out, so Eric soon found himself dealing with ticket touts. Eric finally secured two tickets, but it was a painful process and he had to pay an astronomical price for the seats.

Frustrated, Eric investigated ways to allow fans to buy and sell tickets directly on the Internet, avoiding the pain of dealing with touts. Convinced that there was a real need, Eric partnered with a classmate at Stanford Business School and launched StubHub, the world’s first secondary ticketing exchange. StubHub took off, and was ultimately acquired by eBay for $310MM.

Having pioneered the model with StubHub in the United States, Eric decided to bring his proven business model to Europe and introduce secondary ticketing to European sports, music and theatre fans.

viagogo launched in August 2006 and immediately brought efficiency and transparency to this previously murky marketplace. viagogo is now Europe’s leading ticket exchange and allows fans to buy and sell tickets online in a safe, secure and guaranteed way. By managing payment and delivery, viagogo ensures that buyers receive their tickets and sellers receive payment.

Quoted from their "About Us" pages HERE

Edited October 26, 2011 by mikeb

[PeterD]

I find this alot, Brad Paisley at the o2 the presale was bad seats, its normally the larger venues in my experience.

[Rufus Gwertigan]

Did I read some kerfuffle about people been able to get half price tickets for a Britney Spears concert through Groupon, or some discount site. I know a one day event during the summer did the same and those paying full whack were not happy bunnies.

[Paul ™]

Ticketmaster were doing 1/2 price Britney tickets recently, poor sales it seems then.

[fairy_]

Wading in a bit late here, but Hop Farm last year had day tickets on sale from some website (cant remember which!) going for a fiver, about a week before the event. Incredibly frustrating.

This was for two of the three days - the day Prince headlined wasn't included yet wasn't sold out.