The Dirty Independence Question

[LJS]

5 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

which translates as: ...

You're voting for your children to live in a country - or perhaps emigrate from it - whose governments better reflect the laughable hopes, flag-waving culture beliefs & poorer aspirations of the poorer Scottish people.

Because the best hopes can never change the facts.

I wouldn't recommend a career as a translator.

[LJS]

4 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

how's that judgement today? Still the same bad judgement? Yep.

I wouldn't recommend a career as a judge, Neil.

[LJS]

A great example of Scottish growth 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-35837773

[eFestivals]

11 hours ago, LJS said:

The bits in black are the bits you posted - the bits in red are the bits you missed  out - I have missed nothing out (except for the next 13 minutes of Neil pursuing a personal vendetta & thereby squandering the opportunity to address really important issues like the Scottish government's record. its taxation policies or the EU referendum)

Yep, the bits in red are the squirrels.

Was the UK deficit in any way a similar deficit to Scotland's? Nope, the UK's wasn't structural it was temporary.

 

11 hours ago, LJS said:

Neil: didn't you oppose most od the efforts of the British government to get the deficit down?.

Nope. I'm smart enough to know that a country has to pay its way, or it punches itself in the face five times harder. Greece!

There are no tricks that can be used for a country to avoid paying its way, there are only tricks to reallocate money within a country.

 

 

11 hours ago, LJS said:

This is a truly appalling interview. Don't get me wrong: he would be failing in his duty if he did not ask about the alleged deficit and how it impacts on the viability of independence. Maybe 5 minutes on this would have been reasonable - but an entire 15 minute interview? And you guys wonder why some folk up here think the BBC is biased! The only similar performance I can remember is Paxman v. Howard where Paxman's grilling lasts less than half the length of Neil's on Sturgeon.

The only problem with that interview is that mostly the interviewers let the politician off the hook rather than hold them to account. Just compare the velvet gloves that Marr used on Sturgeon recently.

Andrew Neil had a grasp of the facts, and put her against the ropes. Sturgeon spent the interview trying obfuscate the facts with irrelevances (how is Norway's oil fund relevant to the questions asked? It's not. Etc, etc, etc).

I applaud Andrew Neil for doing his job properly. I wish that all journalists were like this.

 

11 hours ago, LJS said:

 What  this shows is when you say ...   "As Nicola said at the weekend, she'd have had to deal with the deficit like Westminster did. Cuts cuts and more cuts - much more vicious than anything tory.." - you are yet again making stuff up & in doing so undermining your own argument . 

The facts prove me right tho. There are only very hard solutions to the problem.

Hopes based on nothing at all is your 'solution', but it's pie in the sky. Scotland won't achieve Chinese rates of growth.

I must congratulate Scotland on achieving some recent growth tho ... 3 extra feet to Ben Nevis. Perhaps lots more growth like that might save you, as Scotland might become a successful major ski resort? It's the best idea seen far, so the question is.... does anyone in Scotland have a better idea? And the answer is 'no'. from Sturgeon, you, and everyone else.

 

[eFestivals]

2 minutes ago, LJS said:

A great example of Scottish growth 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-35837773

it's the only growth you're getting, so you might as well celebrate it.

Cos whole Sturgeon says she'll grow the Scottish on-shore economy, it's actually getting worse and not better (refer back to the pretty graph).

 

[eFestivals]

14 minutes ago, LJS said:

I wouldn't recommend a career as a translator.

 

15 minutes ago, LJS said:

I wouldn't recommend a career as a judge, Neil.

 

but you do recommend jumping out of plane and hope that someone might hand you a parachute on the way down.

Yup, it's my judgement that's baaaad.

 

[LJS]

Neil, you replied to this.

 

 

"Neil: didn't you oppose most od the efforts of the British government to get the deficit down?."

 

that was not me asking you a question. It was Andrew Neil asking Nic a question.

I knknow you didn't oppose the Tory cuts. You defended them to the hilt.

 

[eFestivals]

4 minutes ago, LJS said:

Neil, you replied to this.

 

 

"Neil: didn't you oppose most od the efforts of the British government to get the deficit down?."

 

that was not me asking you a question. It was Andrew Neil asking Nic a question.

I knknow you didn't oppose the Tory cuts. You defended them to the hilt.

 

Lol @ my own numpty-ness.

and lol @ your lies.

Meanwhile, iScotland has to make cuts into Osborne's cuts. There's no escaping from it apart from with fantasies.

Edited March 19, 2016 by eFestivals

[LJS]

If you want to spend your Saturday morning replying to what I said 2 years ago whilst ignoring the reason why I posted them, then go ahead. Have fun.

[eFestivals]

7 minutes ago, LJS said:

If you want to spend your Saturday morning replying to what I said 2 years ago whilst ignoring the reason why I posted them, then go ahead. Have fun.

the reason you posted them is because you believe that Scotland wouldn't be in the shit.

You said you'd vote 'no' if you thought it would be.

Which only puts the issue in your own thoughts, and nowt to do with me.

One day, if you get your dream, you'll have to admit you got it wrong and voted badly - cos the words I found of yours are clear.

Oh dear.

[LJS]

 

6 hours ago, eFestivals said:

the reason you posted them is because you believe that Scotland wouldn't be in the shit.

NO ... you're wrong again  - the reason I posted them was to prove that you lied about what I said. You said " You gave your initial reason as "to protect the poor" "

I have clearly shown that that was not what I gave as my initial reason ( please don't be an arse & pretend that means I don't want to protect the poor)

So now we have demonstrated that you have lied about what Salmond said, you have lied about what Sturgeon said & you have lied about what I said. 

And you say the SNP are the big liars.

6 hours ago, eFestivals said:

You said you'd vote 'no' if you thought it would be.

Which only puts the issue in your own thoughts, and nowt to do with me.

One day, if you get your dream, you'll have to admit you got it wrong and voted badly - cos the words I found of yours are clear.

Oh dear.

I refer the "honourable" gentleman to my earlier answer...

 

Quote

Tell you what, Neil. If it's ok with you I'll decide my vote the next time we have a referendum which most of us agree is likely to be in a few years. In the meantime i remain in favour of independence in principle.

 

[LJS]

Aye, so it does, Gordon!!!

[LJS]

 

I do like to keep everyone informed..

 

Quote

 

Public trust in the Scottish Government is more than three times higher than its UK counterpart, according to the latest Scottish Social Attitudes Survey (SSA).

The 2015 SSA survey found that 73 per cent of people in Scotland trust the Scottish Government, the highest level since the Scottish Parliament was established, compared with 23 per cent who trust the UK Government.

The Scottish Government was also more trusted than the UK Government to make fair decisions, with 49 per cent backing it, compared with 18 per cent for Whitehall. The survey found that 34 per cent of people trusted their local council to make fair decisions.

https://www.holyrood.com/articles/news/public-trust-scottish-government-three-times-higher-uk-counterpart

 

Cue rant from Neil...

[LJS]

This is one of the worst colums I have read for a long time ( & he's on my side)

 

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/mar/19/scottish-independence-nationalists-unionists-nicola-sturgeon

[eFestivals]

11 hours ago, LJS said:

Aye, so it does, Gordon!!!

So iScotland would be significantly poorer - see GERS for all of the last 40 years - but it could protect its pensioners, and its poorer types (we can't have those earning £20k paying just an extra tenner a year, it would be wrong for them to pay more than the English), and will invest hugely, humongously, in its economy to give it faster growth than China ... while the rich are squeezed u ntil they swqueak to ensure that Scotlland is the fairest country in the world.

These are all the idea you're vocalising support for.

But what no one can tell us is where the money is for any of that.

You tell us that that SNP will find a way ... tho if it's that easy for iScotland, all other countries must be choosing to do worse than they could be doing (if they were as smart as Nationalist Scots) .... so the people of Scotland must be truly exceptional.

And you wonder why I question your thoughts.

[eFestivals]

12 hours ago, LJS said:

 

I do like to keep everyone informed..

 

Cue rant from Neil...

who needs to rant to point out that the trust you crow about is based within the Dundee cake of 23% of Scots believing Scotland would be richer just by separating from the UK?

I'd be embarrassed and ashamed to share a country with them, just as I'm ashamed to share the UK with kippers.

[eFestivals]

11 hours ago, LJS said:

This is one of the worst colums I have read for a long time ( & he's on my side)

 

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/mar/19/scottish-independence-nationalists-unionists-nicola-sturgeon

Erm ... McKenna knows how to troll with the best of them. Haven't you noticed before now?

I'd be a bit cautious about claiming him for your side. His biggest interest is collecting his weekly cheque.

[LJS]

11 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

So iScotland would be significantly poorer - see GERS for all of the last 40 years - but it could protect its pensioners, and its poorer types (we can't have those earning £20k paying just an extra tenner a year, it would be wrong for them to pay more than the English), and will invest hugely, humongously, in its economy to give it faster growth than China ... while the rich are squeezed u ntil they swqueak to ensure that Scotlland is the fairest country in the world.

These are all the idea you're vocalising support for.

But what no one can tell us is where the money is for any of that.

You tell us that that SNP will find a way ... tho if it's that easy for iScotland, all other countries must be choosing to do worse than they could be doing (if they were as smart as Nationalist Scots) .... so the people of Scotland must be truly exceptional.

And you wonder why I question your thoughts.

We haven't had GERS for 40 years...just over 20, I believe.

[LJS]

17 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

who needs to rant to point out that the trust you crow about is based within the Dundee cake of 23% of Scots believing Scotland would be richer just by separating from the UK?

I'd be embarrassed and ashamed to share a country with them, just as I'm ashamed to share the UK with kippers.

So presumably 77% of us don't...that's a pretty healthy majority.

Edited March 20, 2016 by LJS
Maths fail

[LJS]

21 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

who needs to rant to point out that the trust you crow about is based within the Dundee cake of 23% of Scots believing Scotland would be richer just by separating from the UK?

I'd be embarrassed and ashamed to share a country with them, just as I'm ashamed to share the UK with kippers.

Where does your 23% come from? I certainly can't see it in the article I linked to.

[Comfy Bean]

2 minutes ago, LJS said:

So presumably 67% of is don't...that's a pretty healthy majority.

Morning Sir, I`m surprised Neil is taking us down this road and talking about being ashamed about sharing his country with them. Should we remind him what over 50% of his country voted for at the last GE ?

Are we all saying that 67% did not vote for their own selfish reasons over money then ? Russy will have a fit if Neil is slagging off his "brave" heroes 

See GERS for the last 40 years 

[Comfy Bean]

2 minutes ago, LJS said:

Where does your 23% come from? I certainly can't see it in the article I linked to.

Good question.

I see Neil has also fired it off ( that stat ) in the EU thread..........for reasons known only to him.

I sense it`s from one of his carrot for the angry type polls or he has added it up from comments on those websites he`s always on about.

He will now dispute the 67% part which he hadn`t thought about, even though they are " his " numbers 

 

[eFestivals]

25 minutes ago, LJS said:

We haven't had GERS for 40 years...just over 20, I believe.

Alex saw it as his duty to attempt to backdate it, so that he could tell people like you just how much has been 'stolen' from you, that you nice social sharey types don't deem worthy of sharing.

FFS, you've even opened the document yourself. 

[eFestivals]

26 minutes ago, LJS said:

So presumably 77% of us don't...that's a pretty healthy majority.

yeah, but what you've missed is that >50% of the support for indy comes from the nutters.

[Comfy Bean]

On 3/18/2016 at 0:42 PM, eFestivals said:

I can only conclude that it's hatred of anything English or grasping an empty flag but you're too ashamed to put it in writing, but you're welcome to provide some words to show you have a different reason.

You have made this point several times now over the past few days. Hopefully everyone apart from your good self has read the various replies and fully understands that this has nothing to do with hating anyone. I accept that you will have your own reasons just as I have mine 

This post above came a few hours after I had stated that I did not hate England or London in response to one of your other posts around this and I said I didn`t understand why me saying I didn`t hate England made you feel uncomfortable. Anywayz.....what I wanted to add was that you could perhaps reflect on what you have said now across several recent posts.

Do you think it could be seen as being... even a wee bit...arrogant when you state that Scots want to leave the UK because they hate England ?

After all these posts you can only conclude it`s about hatred says way more about you than it does of any other poster on either side of our discussion....in my opinion