festivals report in the observer yesterday

[russycarps]

And neither did I...

I would describe myself as a environmentalist, socialist (to an extent - all for workers rights etc) as well...

Tree hugging gives an image of messy hair and munching rabbit food though... So won't claim that one...

[russycarps]

You are sounding more and more like "my type" with every post...

I don't really care but its fair to point out that while saying the festival needs less of me... Maybe it needs less of you as well ? If we are following your point of view ?

[russycarps]

Aren't I ? Or am I ? Would you really know ?

Going off what you posted I get the feeling you wouldn't give them a chance to be anything other than the stereotype you keep pushing...

A post ago you was saying I was exactly the type which is wrong and now I am not...

Maybe give more people more of a chance... I have met very few dickheads at Glastonbury... and the ones who I thought where dickheads tended to be young ones making too much noise for my old git ears too early in the morning (the problem was really me)

Edited April 5, 2012 by russycarps

[russycarps]

Has there been any studies into the demographic currently attending Glastonbury ?

I must say, the majority of conversations I have with people at Glastonbury rarely get on to what financial position that person is in...

[russycarps]

Probably not a safe way of establishing facts regarding demographics...

[thetime]

Well you seem to be the only person denying the undeniable!

You believe the demographic of glastonbury hasnt changed in that time scale, and hasnt moved towards the wealthy middle-class? Come on, you're just arguing for the sake of it now.

[eFestivals]

How would you class middle class and working class?

This should be interesting.

Who cares? Those definitions and how they're used is a part of the issue which is impacting on Glastonbury.

By the standard definitions, a huge majority of people are working class - but the majority of those working class people now like to view themselves as being middle class. And along with viewing themselves as that they now also take on many of the middle class views and actions, so end up coming across as the sorts that Russy is commenting about.

All of this reminds me of a friend of a friend who visited Glastonbury for her one and only time in the early 90s and afterwards said "it's shit". She never did anything but go to the main stages; she doesn't even to this day know what the fuck the green fields are. But the main reason she thought it was shit was because she got a tummy bug when sher was there, and that made it all the festival's fault ... tho when she was asked the question if she ever washed her hands while she was there the answer was 'no'.

Away from Glastonbury, at around the same time, me and her got into a discussion about people's class. Her dad was in the army - a (sub, of some kind) general. Because he was in the army and a high rank, the army had paid for her to go to fairly low-grade 'public school'. She considered herself solidly "upper class" (definitely not "upper middle class") - tho not a jot about her or her mother was classy. She was the worst kind of snob as was her mother, tho it has to be said that her father of working class background was a very nice bloke.

She absolutely hated it when I said (more out of jest than absolutely meant) that the children like her of squaddies like her dad were working class.

In reality, she classed as middle-class and not a jot more than that - but the delusions of grandeur she had were hilarious (in a sad way). She's the sort of person that you end up hoping that her parents would get financially ruined so that she could spend her working life cleaning the bogs.

[thetime]

My thoughts as well...

It shouldn't matter...

[Yoghurt on a Stick]

I don't think people should worry about what class the attendees at Glastonbury are in. It's more to do with have they got any class ie are they w*nkers or not. Not every middle class person at Glasto is going to be a w*nker.

[eFestivals]

I don't think people should worry about what class the attendees at Glastonbury are in. It's more to do with have they got any class ie are they w*nkers or not. Not every middle class person at Glasto is going to be a w*nker.

you're spot on, but it's also spot on to say that if a person is middle class they're less likely to be open to the alternatives that Glastonbury presents than was the case with the average Glastonbury goer of old.

But I don't think the receptiveness of middle class people has necessarily changed over that time frame. What has certainly changed is the proportion of people within the festival that themselves and wider society would consider to be middle class.

Edited April 5, 2012 by eFestivals

[russycarps]

"Middle class" is just a lazy description of the new breed of glastonbury goer I chose to use. You could also call them hunter welly wearers, richies, little-lord-fauntleroys, flashmobfannies. It doesnt matter at all.

My only point is there is more of <insert whatever name you want for these people here> than before, and they now massively outnumber the old crowd. Whatever you choose to call them also doesnt matter. Crusties, hippies, tree huggers, lefties, scruffs. Whatever. That is the fact. I know everyone is an individual, but it is perfectly acceptable to group people in this way.

The matter of opinion is whether or not you think the festival is better or worse for it. In my opinion its worse because of it (and the other associated changes). In some peoples opinion its just as good, or better.

But I dont think its deniable that there are more of "those sorts of people".

[russycarps]

heaven forfend....

[The Nal]

There's a TINY amount of dickheads who attend Glastonbury compared to pretty much any other large gathering anywhere - festivals, gigs, protests, sports, religious ceremonies etc.

Its superb. Was talking to 4-5 toff halfwits in the pit before U2 last year and they're the only people I've met who I thoughts were c**ts. Not bad after 6-7 Glastos.

[russycarps]

I just miss the sense of chaos and anarchy the place used to have, the new crowd is so damn sensible.

I mean, we've got tonyblair walking round the place using shakespearean language, bazza talking about stocks and shares at the stone circle while carrying his Goldman Sachs flag. I despair

Edited April 5, 2012 by russycarps

[Rufus Gwertigan]

I just miss the sense of chaos and anarchy the place used to have, the new crowd is so damn sensible.

[strummer77]

Edit: Shit wrong thread!

Edited April 5, 2012 by strummer77

[russycarps]

I often have worked with many ex travellers at other festivals. Their main reason for not bothering any more is the fence and the ticketing system. Whilst I have no direct evidence I would suspect that the ticketing system contributes to making the festival less inclusive.

[fred quimby]

Yeh I can well believe it. The necessity of having to have the internet and a bank account to get a ticket I guess makes a big difference to those who like to live on the edges of society.

[russycarps]

yea cos "those" types don't have either. Russy the 80's are calling for you.

I went in 82 and it all changed for the worse when they let the police in

no wait

it all went bad when they put in the dance tent

no wait

it was the mid 90's when it got popular and and it wasn't just the freaks and hippies

no wait

it all went bad when the fence came down and all the theiving and over crowding

no wait

it all went bad when the superfence went up

no wait

it all went bad when the BBC were allowed in

no wait

it went bad when it was trendy

yada yada yada yada

It is what it is. Maybe time to stop looking at reasons you don't like it and focus enjoying the bits you do.

I know plenty of the "old" crowd who stopped because it just got too big and corporate in the late 90's

[Rufus Gwertigan]

or more inclusive because people who might not otherwise go feel safer (and that's not me or the people I know)

not sure why travellers are seen with such high regard

[fred quimby]

And besides, this time it REALLY has got worse

[fred quimby]

ha I know loads of people that dont have bank accounts

[Ed209]

I just miss the sense of chaos and anarchy the place used to have, the new crowd is so damn sensible.

I mean, we've got tonyblair walking round the place using shakespearean language, bazza talking about stocks and shares at the stone circle while carrying his Goldman Sachs flag. I despair

[russycarps]

So how do you contribute to the chaos and anarchy, Russy? Are you breaking in and going around naked on a unicycle shaking your nob at the police? Or do you blend into the "sensible" crowd like most others.

[Yoghurt on a Stick]

You should be allowed to shoot anyone who does laughing gas at the Stone Circle. It would be like the glorious 12th.