Euro 2012

[pink_triangle]

I think England did well to get to penalties. This squad was the weakest in a long time, and to hold off a team that dominated the game like that is impressive. If key players had turned up like you said, the result had been different. I think there is a gulf, not just between England and Italy, but between England and the rest of the semi finalists. While they should be competing with the best, the fact is the quality isn't there currently. I think Roy did well to take a group of players of that standard through to that stage, and as mentioned, could have done better if not for the absence of some.

[pink_triangle]

Annoying thing is during the group phase I wanted to put a bet on sem finalists being spain, germany, portugal and Italy but it either wasnt available or I couldnt work out how to do it. I think portugal and Italy have both done well but I think this tournament deserves the best 2 teams in the world to go head to head,

[pink_triangle]

Post match quotes

Wellbeck "Every game we got better, we kept improving, and we are bitterly disappointed to go out tonight"

Disagree completely, I think Englands perfromance level was pretty consistent throughout the tournament. Todays game defintely wasnt their best performance.

"Hart "I went in confident we would win the game, I was required to step-up and didn't make the saves"

Hart just comes across a great guy, not a bit of arrogance in him, unlike several of his teammates. I think his lower league experience has helped him stay grounded. Also Englands player of the tournament for me.

[kaosmark2]

Im not too proud to admit only 1 welsh players would make the England squad.

[lharris92]

we seemed awful tonight apart from a few spells in the first half. as soon as it went to penalties i knew we would somehow screw it all up. also was the first 0-0 of the tourny - which is quite good considering it was the last quarter final

[Ed209]

We had an extremely average team which got within a whisker of the semi-final.

Well done Roy Hodgson

[pink_triangle]

I think czechs, france and england were all poor in the quarters, greece I thought did as well as they could. I think both Croatia and Denmark must be annoyed seeing how poor these 3 teams were, I would argue that they were the 5th and 6th best teams in the tournament but screwed by a draw that created 2 strong groups and 2 weak ones.

Im not buying this argument that England have this significantly weaker team than any in their history. Compare it to the team who played germany (which most had high expectations for) you had James, Upson, Lampard, Barry and Defoe instead of Hart, Lescott, Parker, Young and Wellbeck. I think ithe team has gained in defence, lost in midfield but theres not much in it. For all their flaws I think the entire team had premier league winner or runners up medals and several champioins league titles. I know they play with top foregin player but you dont stay at these clubs for long if you are useless. England are definitely in the top 10/15 in the world and nobody at that level should be dominated to that extent. Italy have some good players, but from what I have seen this tournament they are far from unbeatable. Im sure I have heard they have only won 1 game in 2012 against a poor ireland team. England shouldnt necessarily be beating a team like Italy but they should be more competitive.

Semis will be interesting now, while Germany have looked good Italy (historical) and spain (recent) are bogey sides. I have a sneaky feeling they may pull it off against the germans.

[eFestivals]

Same old England. Who's surprised?

Woy the tactical genius on substitutions fucked that one right up. He could be Sven or Postman Pat in disguise.

[pink_triangle]

To me the biggest shocker watching the game yesterday was the fact Milan were stupid enough to hand Pirlo to Juventus for free and give them the title.

[A-Rob]

The substitions were not the best yesterday, Carroll for Wellbeck made sense. But I didn't agree with the others

However he should have taken off Ashley Young as he was having a terrible game.

However Roy deserve some credit as he goes out of this tournament 'unbeaten' despite all the injuries and problems that he had

[The Nal]

Should've brought the Ox on for Young. I thought. Everything Italy did was going down Englands left side. Johnson on the other hand was good on the right.

Also, Andy Carroll. Its like a routine with him. Win the ball from a long pass, lose the ball. Repeat.

But what about PIrlos peno?! Hart laughing at him after was great.

Edited June 25, 2012 by The Nal

[eFestivals]

To me the biggest shocker watching the game yesterday was the fact Milan were stupid enough to hand Pirlo to Juventus for free and give them the title.

what was even more stupid was after every pundit saying that England had to shackle Pirlo, Welbeck & Rooney only bothered to do it for the first 25 minutes - which they did quite successfully - and then they gave him a free hand.

Why there were no instructions from the bench for them to get back on the job I've no idea.

The substitutions were not the best yesterday, Carroll for Welbeck made sense. But I didn't agree with the others

However he should have taken off Ashley Young as he was having a terrible game.

Welbeck was one of the better players on the pitch, as was Milner. They both should have stayed on.

If Woy wanted Carroll on the pitch (and I understand why he wanted to try him) then it would have made FAR more sense to take Young off and put Rooney on the left.

And if Woy wanted Walcott on - tho I'm not sure why, he's fuck all good if no one gives him the ball - then with Parker clearly being knackered the answer was to take Parker off and move Milner there.

[kaosmark2]

I don't get why Woy stuck with Milner on the right, instead of moving him centrally to assist Gerrard and Parker (who I thought was awful). 4-3-3 with Rooney operating from a side and floating in just makes more sense. With Milner's lack of pace he can't do as good a job on a wing as Walcott or Ox would if they played at a time they'd have the ball, or Young theoretically can.

Young as the worst player in the tournament overall? Maybe a few of the Dutch players could make that claim, but I don't think anyone else has been as consistently awful.

[eFestivals]

Young as the worst player in the tournament overall?

possibly, but defo the worst English player.

[kaosmark2]

possibly, but defo the worst English player.

[The Nal]

Young as the worst player in the tournament overall?

[A-Rob]

what was even more stupid was after every pundit saying that England had to shackle Pirlo, Welbeck & Rooney only bothered to do it for the first 25 minutes - which they did quite successfully - and then they gave him a free hand.

Why there were no instructions from the bench for them to get back on the job I've no idea.

Welbeck was one of the better players on the pitch, as was Milner. They both should have stayed on.

If Woy wanted Carroll on the pitch (and I understand why he wanted to try him) then it would have made FAR more sense to take Young off and put Rooney on the left.

And if Woy wanted Walcott on - tho I'm not sure why, he's fuck all good if no one gives him the ball - then with Parker clearly being knackered the answer was to take Parker off and move Milner there.

[lharris92]

But what about PIrlos peno?! Hart laughing at him after was great.

[thesecretingredientiscrime]

Im not buying this argument that England have this significantly weaker team than any in their history. Compare it to the team who played germany (which most had high expectations for) you had James, Upson, Lampard, Barry and Defoe instead of Hart, Lescott, Parker, Young and Wellbeck. I think ithe team has gained in defence, lost in midfield but theres not much in it.

[The Nal]

but if the keeper stays there and catches it you look like a complete tw*t.

Edited June 25, 2012 by The Nal

[ministe2003]

I think young has been the worst player of the tournament overall. I've watched every game and no one player has been so standout bad as him. He seemed to give the ball away with almost every pass and I don't remember him dribbling past a player without going down. Everything he did was bad and when he stepped up to take a penalty my jaw nearly hit the floor. Roy shouldn't have let him anywhere near.

Milner was rubbish in the group stages but played much better yesterday. Unlike the previous three games, he actually managed to pass forwards, win the ball off the opposition and put in crosses that didn't go out for throw ins. Have to say though, Glen Johnson is uselss. Every oppostition attack came down his side as everyone could see he was the weak link. Ashley Cole had little to do in some games, despite Young giving the ball away constantly. France's goal came from Johnson's side, he played the swede on for their first goal and lost his man for their 2nd. Micah Richards must be wondering who he's upset to be constantly overlooked. Milner only keeps his place in order to protect Glen, if Glen weren't playing I dare say we could play a winger like Theo on the right and be more attacking.

All that said, we played some good football, came back to win against Sweden which I really don't think we would've done had Capello been in charge, and Roy has probably got us further than most people thought. We scored the 2nd most goals in the group stages and all 3 of the strikers scored (defoe barely played so I'll discount him) which is very rare for us. in 2014 we could have a better Walcott and Young, Micah Richards (hopefully) Gary Caill, a more experienced Carroll and Welbeck, Wiltshire and who knows who else might make a name for themselves over the next two years. We've definitely done better this time than in South Africa so there's progress been made. Plenty of positives to take away.

[kaosmark2]

Parker who looked like he couldn't handle international football anymore

[pink_triangle]

With regards to your second bit, I don't think the team has gained in defence. I'd argue Terry was a stop gap, and a poor one at that. He looked average throughout the tournament, and was constantly getting beaten last night. Bringing through a new centre back is a must. Terry's positioning was akin to the Stevie Wonder knife throw.

While Gerrard was good throughout the tournament, he took himself out of the game last night, through concentrating on Pirlo.

I think overall Gerrard and Hart could be given player/s of the tournament for England, but Hart's distribution was poor last night, one of the only things preventing him from being world class.

Priorities would have to be one or two new centre backs, definitely replacing Terry (I'd definitely look at Jones), a central for Parker who looked like he couldn't handle international football anymore, possibly replacing Young, and attempting to find a consistent goalscorer.

[pink_triangle]

Milner was rubbish in the group stages but played much better yesterday. Unlike the previous three games, he actually managed to pass forwards, win the ball off the opposition and put in crosses that didn't go out for throw ins. Have to say though, Glen Johnson is uselss. Every oppostition attack came down his side as everyone could see he was the weak link. Ashley Cole had little to do in some games, despite Young giving the ball away constantly. France's goal came from Johnson's side, he played the swede on for their first goal and lost his man for their 2nd. Micah Richards must be wondering who he's upset to be constantly overlooked. Milner only keeps his place in order to protect Glen, if Glen weren't playing I dare say we could play a winger like Theo on the right and be more attacking.

All that said, we played some good football, came back to win against Sweden which I really don't think we would've done had Capello been in charge, and Roy has probably got us further than most people thought. We scored the 2nd most goals in the group stages and all 3 of the strikers scored (defoe barely played so I'll discount him) which is very rare for us. in 2014 we could have a better Walcott and Young, Micah Richards (hopefully) Gary Caill, a more experienced Carroll and Welbeck, Wiltshire and who knows who else might make a name for themselves over the next two years. We've definitely done better this time than in South Africa so there's progress been made. Plenty of positives to take away.

[kaosmark2]

Im not as convinced that things will be better in 2014, I am not sure South America will suit the England players. I think England will still have the same problems, strikers who dont score enough goals, midfielders who cant keep the ball, a lack of real match winners and wingers who have their limiatations exposed against anyone half decent. I see Young, Walcott, Milner, Wellbeck as fine against your bog standard international teams but I cant see any ever really being consistent performers against the world elite.