no doubt about it, Ian Watkins is a nonce

[Rufus Gwertigan]

Statutory rape but yeah. Basically a 14/15 year old's "consent" isn't considered informed enough to count.

[kaosmark2]

and the weirder thing is that the moment it was revised upwards, the Daily Mail had rounded up a possie with pitchforks looking for everyone that they were now retrospectively labelling as paedophiles.

[mrtourette]

True but I don't remember being intrested in sex at 10.

[kaosmark2]

I thought 13 and under was statuary rape... 14/15 was a lesser offence of sexual activity... ? or something to that affect.

[eFestivals]

Statutory rape is if the child is under 13.

that's a fairly recent definition/wording/law, isn't it?

(10 to 15 years-ish, I think).

Edited November 27, 2013 by eFestivals

[Rufus Gwertigan]

that's a fairly recent definition/wording/law, isn't it?

(10 to 15 years-ish, I think).

[russycarps]

The weird thing is a few centuries ago the age of consent was 10 in this country.

[Rufus Gwertigan]

I dont think the age of consent has ever been 12 months....

this case is about more than just sex

[russycarps]

Just pop psychology but I would think it's a power and sadism thing.

[eFestivals]

Just pop psychology but I would think it's a power and sadism thing.

or perhaps just an opportunities thing.

Society, for whatever reason, has a proportion of sick fuckers. If one of those sick fuckers ends up being a pop star then extra opportunities mighty be available to him that wouldn't otherwise have been.

Is paedophilia about power? Or is it a 'normal' sexual desire targeted at an un-normal age range?

I'd always thought that it was mostly the 2nd of those, but now you've got me thinking I've been mistaken.

[russycarps]

or perhaps just an opportunities thing.

Society, for whatever reason, has a proportion of sick fuckers. If one of those sick fuckers ends up being a pop star then extra opportunities mighty be available to him that wouldn't otherwise have been.

Is paedophilia about power? Or is it a 'normal' sexual desire targeted at an un-normal age range?

I'd always thought that it was mostly the 2nd of those, but now you've got me thinking I've been mistaken.

Edited November 27, 2013 by russycarps

[eFestivals]

this case doesnt seem like a "normal" paedo case to me.

I think you are spot on, in normal cases I think they do genuinely "love" children and even see nothing wrong with it.

I dunno, how "normal" is a normal paedo case? I guess we'd all feel a similar horror to the details of a 'normal' case, but we're probably not exposed to the details in the same way.

But I get the distinction you're making; from what I've just googled it sounds like 'normal' paedos are people with a mis-directed sexual orientation, and the smaller number of 'ab-normals' are more extreme/more abusive/more predatory than what is regarded as the norms of sexuality.

This guy is just a sadistic, twisted weirdo. And a paedo. the blowing crack smoke in the kids faces, is a about way more than sex (and lord knows what else he got up to, there are some suggestions in the court transcripts about "not going so easy on the child next time")

yup.

[russycarps]

I think you are right.

Its beyond sex... Its all about raw abuse it would seem...

[russycarps]

I dunno, how "normal" is a normal paedo case? I guess we'd all feel a similar horror to the details of a 'normal' case, but we're probably not exposed to the details in the same way.

But I get the distinction you're making; from what I've just googled it sounds like 'normal' paedos are people with a mis-directed sexual orientation, and the smaller number of 'ab-normals' are more extreme/more abusive/more predatory than what is regarded as the norms of sexuality.

yup.

Edited November 27, 2013 by russycarps

[thetime]

I've been thinking of this all day and still undecided.

Do you think your born with an attraction to children, or is it circumstances/episodes in your life that makes you that way.

In the same way your born hetrosexual/gay

Is there a way to get help before you commit these sort of offences? Rather than get sex offenders treatment when you have been sentenced.

,

[VCK]

I seem to recall reading that Pete Doherty and Carl Barat once had a threesome with a fifteen year old girl. Maybe one of those Internet rumours, but then again it could be one of their "romantic Arcadian japes."

I think even Doherty would draw the line at blowing crack in a baby's face though!

[Mouseboy11]

Isn't the guy from Blood On The Dancer Floor constantly accused of rape of underage girls? I'm surprised he's never been investigated.

[t8yman]

my 2p, is that this is not a "normal" paedo case. this appears to be as much about power, control, and manipulation of others, coupled with a psychopathic level of non-empathy.

I read what I believe to be the "full" details that were discussed in court, which many of you have probably read. He knew those women were prepared to do anything to get his approval and attention, and he used that to some fucking horrible, twisted end.

The fact that he didnt appear to have just one deviant desire, but most of them, including pissing, animals and all the kiddies stuff.

[Rufus Gwertigan]

or perhaps just an opportunities thing.

Society, for whatever reason, has a proportion of sick fuckers. If one of those sick fuckers ends up being a pop star then extra opportunities mighty be available to him that wouldn't otherwise have been.

Is paedophilia about power? Or is it a 'normal' sexual desire targeted at an un-normal age range?

I'd always thought that it was mostly the 2nd of those, but now you've got me thinking I've been mistaken.

[Rufus Gwertigan]

Its a form of fetish from what I can make out. Its part of the person As someone posted above a couple of hundred years ago no one would of cared. So I struggle with the concept that its just full stop wrong to find a young adult not attractive. It gets harder to understand when they are like 13 and younger for example. Hence the stance in law.

But as a modern society we have decided to expect full grown adults to have some grasp over their urges due to the vulnerability of the ages involved. And sure you can help people control these urges via treatment.

I think the whole thing is fucked up. Both the level of abuse that can go on to the public opinion that treats someone who viewed an image the same way as someone like Watkins.

I think what Watkins did though would of been viewed as vile, wrong and fucking evil no matter what century we was living in. It went beyond sex as I said above. It was all about abuse and power which is something way beyond as simple urge / fetish.

[Amy Lawn]

It sounds to me like a taboo thing, perhaps he got off on doing the most depraved things, the forbidden fruit so to speak. Reportedly he was completely straight edge up until a couple of years ago, didn't touch any drink or drugs, then he started taking drugs and that's when the crimes started. His obsession could have been with wrongdoing itself, the things he's done are so over-the-top that it makes me think he was out to do the sickest things he could, the wronger the better. A lesser poster would make the link to the outsider identity of being in an emo rock band as a precedent for these urges... but yours truly is better than that.

Just for the record; my above musings are not based on anything academic whatsoever, I left school at 16 with shit GCSEs, so I have no educational background on anything psychological.

[justanothername]

Isn't the guy from Blood On The Dancer Floor constantly accused of rape of underage girls? I'm surprised he's never been investigated.

Edited November 27, 2013 by justanothername

[thetime]

'H' from steps is getting an awful lot of stick about all this, has had to come of twitter and media outlets putting his photo up instead.

Edited November 27, 2013 by thetime

[Alcatraz]

This case has really made me uneasy about seeing 'fandom' in music and entertainment. For a talentless arsehole to have had so much control over some people is terrifying.

[Gre]

There's also some poor bloke in America who is @ianwatkins on twitter, no doubt getting a load of abuse too.

The power over a fan/groupie thing is certainly not unique to Watkins; I am reminded of this story from a few years ago about a group with a similar fan base; http://www.kerrang.com/blog/2007/04/bring_me_the_horizon_vocalist.html