The final push is starting... get rid of those pesky poor people

[Guest]

My wife told me how her grandmother used to live in the really beautiful old part of Rome. It wasn't posh, it was working class, but it was where they lived. Mussolini didn't like having poor people cluttering up the centre of Rome, so he built ugly apartment blocks on the outskirts of town, and moved those who couldn't afford to stay out of the way. I used to thing "how disgusting that was", believing it couldn't happen here

Well, I hadn't bargained on such nasty twunts as the ones we have in government now

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2013/feb/13/london-council-relocation-benefits-cap

[Rufus Gwertigan]

My wife told me how her grandmother used to live in the really beautiful old part of Rome. It wasn't posh, it was working class, but it was where they lived. Mussolini didn't like having poor people cluttering up the centre of Rome, so he built ugly apartment blocks on the outskirts of town, and moved those who couldn't afford to stay out of the way. I used to thing "how disgusting that was", believing it couldn't happen here

Well, I hadn't bargained on such nasty twunts as the ones we have in government now

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2013/feb/13/london-council-relocation-benefits-cap

[Guest]

This has been going on for the past year with other London authorities with potential places in Stoke, Hull and Manchester. On a personal level it can be good to get the chance of a fresh break especially when in the benefit trap. I do even wonder how some people have coped living in the same area all their life. However there is a dramatic difference to that and having to be uprooted. Not everyone takes to the physical separation of family and community ties.

[Rufus Gwertigan]

But outside of that there is nothing wrong with the principle of having to move if you can't afford the area. It applies to everyone working so why not benefit claimants.

!

[lost]

London is either for the very rich or those on benefits or with a council house unless you bought before the 2001 boom. Most middle income people live outside and commute in as I used to do from Reading.

[mrtourette]

But this has been happening for decades, and not just because of the big bad Tory government (boo! hiss!). They may be putting measures in place that contribute to this situation, but it's not as if we've been living in a socialist paradise up until this point.

[pink_triangle]

Im lucky enough to be a homeowner,if things were financially tight I would be happy to move to another area to make things easier, I dont think that I play a big enough role in the local community to be missed! However if everyone in a similar circumstance to me moved then it clearly would make a significant impact. The village where I grew up was one of those where generations of the same family lived. Now those in their 20/30s looking to get on the housing ladder have been replaced with middle class people who realise that housing prices are slighly cheaper than those in nearby communities who dont send their children to schools in the village or interact with the community, it has completely destoryed the community spirit.

As for being forced to move from london to liverpool, I would personally be quite happy with that move!

[jump]

Community spirit is overplayed...

[kaosmark2]

So what we've established, is that the people who live near Barry don't share any sense of camaraderie with him.

I wonder why

[jump]

The other drawback is similar to what has happened to New York especially to a place like Camden Town, by upping the prices you will drive out the arty creative types which New York has regretted in recent years. On the other hand if that happened earlier it would of meant no Dappy.

Edited February 14, 2013 by jump

[LondonTom]

Instead of this, there should have been a rental cap introduced/second home ownership taxed to fuck, it would be nice if the lower earners down to benefit claimants could actually have some income left over to not spend on transport and subsistence to get to work and didn't have two hour journeys each way every day

The jobless need jobs, what do we do to get them jobs? We move them away from where the majority of jobs are!

[eFestivals]

The govt spends £24Bn on housing benefit each year.

The govt spends just £1Bn on new housing each year.

Either Gideon Osbourne can't do simple maths, or he's very deliberately enriching the already-rich who have properties available to rent as well as helping to ensure that there's less jobs than there could otherwise be.

I'll leave you to work out which it is.

Edited February 14, 2013 by eFestivals

[kaosmark2]

The govt spends £24Bn on housing benefit each year.

The govt spends just £1Bn on new housing each year.

Either Gideon Osbourne can't do simple maths, or he's very deliberately enriching the already-rich who have properties available to rent as well as helping to ensure that there's less jobs than there could otherwise be.

I'll leave you to work out which it is.

[Guest]

Community spirit is overplayed...

Edited February 14, 2013 by tonyblair

[Guest]

I wouldn't discount the possibility he's incompetent that easily.

[AcademicPistol]

Yup... It's already gone if it was ever there

[Kyelo]

Why not just stop putting council tenants into expensive places? Don't kick the current ones out, leave them until they leave by their on accord. I understand the argument of families being in areas for generations etc but the cruel fact is that is now collectively costing us more than it should. Either they pay up or move to a more affordable area. I know plenty of people in low paid jobs that pay upto half their wage for a ROOM, they don't get any help. That's not really fair on them either but it is the way it is.

[Guest]

Why not just stop putting council tenants into expensive places? Don't kick the current ones out, leave them until they leave by their on accord. I understand the argument of families being in areas for generations etc but the cruel fact is that is now collectively costing us more than it should. Either they pay up or move to a more affordable area. I know plenty of people in low paid jobs that pay upto half their wage for a ROOM, they don't get any help. That's not really fair on them either but it is the way it is.

Edited February 14, 2013 by tonyblair

[eFestivals]

Why not just stop putting council tenants into expensive places? Don't kick the current ones out, leave them until they leave by their on accord. I understand the argument of families being in areas for generations etc but the cruel fact is that is now collectively costing us more than it should. Either they pay up or move to a more affordable area. I know plenty of people in low paid jobs that pay upto half their wage for a ROOM, they don't get any help. That's not really fair on them either but it is the way it is.

it's all very well saying that, but unemployment is meant to be a temporary condition, and the welfare state is supposed to support a person until they're able to get back into work. If you start insisting that they move, then you're just completing the life-destruction that unemployment started.

Remember, it's not just the individual who is effected by this, but whole families - uprooting children from school and friends, uprooted from the support systems of families and friends, perhaps uprooting your partner from their own employment, etc, etc, etc.

And also ... why, by an what is the accident of a person's location by birth, upbringing, or circumstances, should some people be forced to move and have their lives destroyed while others in cheaper areas are saved from having to suffer that?

There's got to be a better way than this ... especially where 'this' is often benefit recipients turning on other benefit recipients, with one believing themselves entitled but having no belief in others entitlement to the same - in a propaganda scam cooked up by the rich to take the heat off themselves.

The amount of benefit fraud - the 'not entitled' - is tiny in the scheme of things. The amount of tax fraud by the treasury's own figures is 20 times as much, and 'legal tax avoidance' (by immoral scumbags) is another 20 times the benefit fraud amount.

Or put another way, getting the defrauded tax would cover every single penny of the Housing Benefit payments every year and still have change to spare, and the tax that is avoided could pay for it a second time with change to spare.

But yeah, let's turn on the unemployed and needy. It's all their fault.

[abdoujaparov]

Why not just stop putting council tenants into expensive places? Don't kick the current ones out, leave them until they leave by their on accord. I understand the argument of families being in areas for generations etc but the cruel fact is that is now collectively costing us more than it should. Either they pay up or move to a more affordable area. I know plenty of people in low paid jobs that pay upto half their wage for a ROOM, they don't get any help. That's not really fair on them either but it is the way it is.

[abdoujaparov]

Community spirit is overplayed...

[thesecretingredientiscrime]

Why not just stop putting council tenants into expensive places? Don't kick the current ones out, leave them until they leave by their on accord. I understand the argument of families being in areas for generations etc but the cruel fact is that is now collectively costing us more than it should. Either they pay up or move to a more affordable area. I know plenty of people in low paid jobs that pay upto half their wage for a ROOM, they don't get any help. That's not really fair on them either but it is the way it is.

Edited February 14, 2013 by thesecretingredientiscrime

[AcademicPistol]

Seriously what is community spirit? Can anyone put a finger on it...

[abdoujaparov]

Seriously what is community spirit? Can anyone put a finger on it...

[Guest]

Seriously what is community spirit? Can anyone put a finger on it...