Thatcher is Dead

[gary1979666]

which is (partly) why she was so destructive. Women have many qualities that men could benefit from. What she did was ignore those qualities, and be a .. well, what was she? Women being more like the worst type of man, isn't good for anyone, men & women.

[fred quimby]

It wasn't particularly great for families in the years before Thatcher though - 3 day week, rubbish in the streets, unions striking at will, etc etc. Was far from good times and she stopped that by bring the unions under control, when Labour couldn't. (Not sure they can control them yet?)

The mines were failing - the cost of producing the coal was unaffordable and not competitive - in order to stop haemorraqging money, she had to close them and cosh Scargill.

There's been arguements that there are other ways of achieving this - that may well be, but there's no guarantee that the situation would have ended up any better. We can all play the what if game! Labour had been trying for the last few years, why would another term have made a difference?

[Guest]

She achieved all she did for being herself (love her or loathe her). Not sure what gender really has to do with it. A lot of feminists are up in arms that she did it by behaving like a man - surely by recognising certain gender specific traits, then it kinda goes against feminism.

[fred quimby]

She achieved all she did for being herself (love her or loathe her).

[whisty]

I thought she was generally lucky. Maybe took advantage of situations and was able to see this, but lucky

[gary1979666]

I thought she was generally lucky. Maybe took advantage of situations and was able to see this, but lucky

[gary1979666]

Bit like Phony Blair really, rode the wave and got off just before it crashed into the beach and swamped everybody in a shitstorm of deb't that Brown got blamed for. Perfect timing.

[kaosmark2]

And the biggest influence on the economic crash in '08 was the American economy...

[fred quimby]

But that's life....sometimes just being in the right place at the right time can give anyone that career boost.

[5co77ie]

Talking about this last night.

I iodn't realise that we should have had a state funeral for her. Why? It's not widely publicised why, the Tories are a bit embarrassed to make a big thing of it...

But she's a 'WAR' Prime Minister - she defended the realm, the crown and sovereignty (doesn't matter it was 1,000s of miles away) - and as head of state should be buried (as all previous war PMs throughout history) with miltary honours.

Apparently Tony Blier isn't a war PM - as it's been decided it wasn't 'his' war.

[Rufus Gwertigan]

What Brown got blamed for is the utter fucking mess he made of everything after Blair left. Tax Credits, getting rid of the 10p tax rate and increased borrowing and spending. Nick Robinson did a good piece on it all not long ago. Brown knew we was fucked and kept spending.

[5co77ie]

History:Before the festival circuit became a commercial industry the festivals we all went to (the ones that allowed dogs on strings /old school/however you want to rmeember them) for centuries, perhaps millennia were free or nearly free. Often all the infrastructure from tent erecting to manning the bars, running the fairs, catering, and kids areas and policing the events were toally voluntary done by people who travelled in buses and convoys from one event to the other - it was called the free (traveller) festival scene - and because it was FREE everyone in the community volunteered.

Then Thatcher smashed it, the media sold you on it, and the money men made you pay for it - and for now it's isn't FREE anymore. Festivals will last longer than the money men trying to profit from them, but it will be a long time until the stain from Thatcher is removed.

...and that's today's reason why ....

I STILL hate Thatcher.

...and yes I am called Scott, and no I'm not resigning over saying that....

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-22124015

[Paul ™]

Scott

[kaosmark2]

What Brown got blamed for is the utter fucking mess he made of everything after Blair left. Tax Credits, getting rid of the 10p tax rate and increased borrowing and spending. Nick Robinson did a good piece on it all not long ago. Brown knew we was fucked and kept spending in a desperate attempt of winning the next election.

If Blair had stayed we would of won a fourth term. I have no doubt about that.

The right wing press made a lot of how much the country no longer liked Bliar as he won is third term, after Iraq.... He was on course for a fourth term win if it wasn't for his part having enough and reverting back to its left ways and certain defeat at the polls.

Blair was, and still is, hugely popular with a lot of the UK.

This country is centre right... Any political stance outside of that is doomed.

[Rufus Gwertigan]

Talking about this last night.

I iodn't realise that we should have had a state funeral for her. Why? It's not widely publicised why, the Tories are a bit embarrassed to make a big thing of it...

But she's a 'WAR' Prime Minister - she defended the realm, the crown and sovereignty (doesn't matter it was 1,000s of miles away) - and as head of state should be buried (as all previous war PMs throughout history) with miltary honours.

Apparently Tony Blier isn't a war PM - as it's been decided it wasn't 'his' war.

[kaosmark2]

Name some policies that came through under Brown that are considerably left-wing.

There's a constant theme of wanting our schools, hospitals and public transport systems to be better, but wanting the tax burden to fall on other people more.

Please point out precisely which bit is bullshit, bearing in mind that I emphasised the second paragraph as speculation, albeit speculation I'd guess is about right.

[feral chile]

Brown removed the 10p tax rate fucking over a lot of people, realised the backlash and fixed it with the tax credits. Not sure what happened as my memory has faded a bit but they where uped or something to plug the gap.

[GuitarManDan15]

I don't understand people celebrating her death, everybody has to die its not like something unfortunate has happened to her, surely if people hate her politics the real victory was her being chucked out of power?

People in defense of her seem to accept that some people dislike her but those who hated can't seem to see not everyone did.

Yes lots of people were disadvantaged by her policies but just as many were empowered and were helped by the Thatcher government, many of them working class and lower middle class families.

Someone must have liked her, she won 3 general elections in a row, and she won more votes in her 3rd election (post the miners strike) than her first.

Say what you like about thatcher, and many people will, but to become Prime Minister of a country that 50 years earlier had only just given equal voting rights to women is an astonishing achievement. To rise to the top of a world that even now is still dominated by men has to be respected.

From a personal point of view, looking back at her policies and decisions she did make mistakes, but I agree with many things she did which probably puts me in a minority. Though I'm not here to debate her policies as I have a life.

But then again the Thatcher the government implemented policies that enabled my family to go from being poor working class people who lived in council flats in brixton and peckham to home owners with good jobs and comfortable lives.

[kaosmark2]

From a personal point of view, looking back at her policies and decisions she did make mistakes, but I agree with many things she did which probably puts me in a minority. Though I'm not here to debate her policies as I have a life.

But then again the Thatcher the government implemented policies that enabled my family to go from being poor working class people who lived in council flats in brixton and peckham to home owners with good jobs and comfortable lives.

[davidd]

I don't understand people celebrating her death, everybody has to die its not like something unfortunate has happened to her, surely if people hate her politics the real victory was her being chucked out of power?

People in defense of her seem to accept that some people dislike her but those who hated can't seem to see not everyone did.

Yes lots of people were disadvantaged by her policies but just as many were empowered and were helped by the Thatcher government, many of them working class and lower middle class families.

Someone must have liked her, she won 3 general elections in a row, and she won more votes in her 3rd election (post the miners strike) than her first.

Say what you like about thatcher, and many people will, but to become Prime Minister of a country that 50 years earlier had only just given equal voting rights to women is an astonishing achievement. To rise to the top of a world that even now is still dominated by men has to be respected.

From a personal point of view, looking back at her policies and decisions she did make mistakes, but I agree with many things she did which probably puts me in a minority. Though I'm not here to debate her policies as I have a life.

But then again the Thatcher the government implemented policies that enabled my family to go from being poor working class people who lived in council flats in brixton and peckham to home owners with good jobs and comfortable lives.

[feral chile]

And for the millions,yes millions that were completely fucked by her ? No,she fucked too many people over for spiteful and selfish ideologial purposes and for that, in a great many areas she will not and cannot be forgotten or forgiven.

[davidd]

All the same, she did her best to brutalise and dehumanise large sections of society, and actively celebrating her death feels like she achieved her aim.

i wouldn't want to give her the satisfaction of turning me into a hater.

[abdoujaparov]

I am not sorry that she is dead. I hated her and everything she stood for - greed, selfishness, callous disregard for the human impact of her policies, an ideologically driven war on working class communities, homophobia, authoritarianism, cosying up to murdering dictators. I hated her when I was 19 and stood on a picket line with striking miners, I hated her when I saw innocent miners' families being baton charged in Whitehall and I hated her on the Wapping picket line in 1985.

But I won't celebrate her death. The only thing that I might conceivably have celebrated would have been her asking for forgiveness for all the suffering she caused.

[Rufus Gwertigan]

All the same, she did her best to brutalise and dehumanise large sections of society, and actively celebrating her death feels like she achieved her aim.

i wouldn't want to give her the satisfaction of turning me into a hater.

[GuitarManDan15]

Well done for proving thetime's point.