Football 2013-2014

[kaosmark2]

The fans who are post prem and only know the glory years might give his pressure, certainly not the ones who remember the lean times.

[thetime]

Which would be most of them now?

And you say the club's always given the manager time, but that used to be the case at Liverpool before the recent changeovers of owner. The Glazer's couldn't sack Fergie, but they might well be prepared to sack Moyes.

[kaosmark2]

I would say the most that go are still pre prem era.

Its alot of ifs you got going on, we walked the league last year and I dont understand your thinking from going to 1st to 5th.

That was with a dodgy goalkeeper, oap centre backs, poor wingers and a dead midfield. To me it does not add up.

We need a creative midfielder but we have for 3 or 4 years, thats no great insight but its been good enough for the prem. No point getting one in now as you think we will be fighting fulham for a europa league place next season.

[eFestivals]

The fans who are post prem and only know the glory years might give his pressure, certainly not the ones who remember the lean times.

so that's the vast majority of fans who'll pile on the pressure then.

[thetime]

so that's the vast majority of fans who'll pile on the pressure then.

[daniel.k]

I think for end of season;

1) Chelsea if they get Cavani

2) Man City if they get a few more signings

3) Man Utd if they dont get Bale or Ronaldo, or another top name

4) Tottenham if they keep Bale

5) Arsenal if they can get the best from Walcott

I dont think Moyes will get the sack unless Man U finish outside the top 4 two years running, which I cant see happening really

[eFestivals]

Were both old enough to remember united have always had big support even in the 80s.

true, but how many of those goes to games nowadays?

The vast majority don't know of Utd without fergie in charge, and they believe they've a right to win stuff by default.

As i've always thought, whoever took over from fergie would pretty much have a poisoned chalice, because anything less than Fergie was doing won't be acceptable.

I think they've got the right manager in Moyes, I genuinely wish him success in the role and I think he will be successful to a reasonable level (tho perhaps not at fergie's level). But none of that means I don't expect a sizeable number of Utd fans to be regularly calling for his head on a plate every time things aren't going as well as hoped for.

The difference between "successful to a reasonable level" and "as well as hoped for" is going to be more than enough to have me laughing at Utd fans at various points thru the seaosn.

[thetime]

true, but how many of those goes to games nowadays?The vast majority don't know of Utd without fergie in charge, and they believe they've a right to win stuff by default.As i've always thought, whoever took over from fergie would pretty much have a poisoned chalice, because anything less than Fergie was doing won't be acceptable.I think they've got the right manager in Moyes, I genuinely wish him success in the role and I think he will be successful to a reasonable level (tho perhaps not at fergie's level). But none of that means I don't expect a sizeable number of Utd fans to be regularly calling for his head on a plate every time things aren't going as well as hoped for.The difference between "successful to a reasonable level" and "as well as hoped for" is going to be more than enough to have me laughing at Utd fans at various points thru the seaosn.

[pink_triangle]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2013/jun/19/premier-league-protest-ticket-prices

I completely agree with the fact that premiership tickets are too expensive. However fans making banners and going on protests will achieve absolutely nothing. The only thing that will cause the price of tickets to go down is if fans organize a mass boycott of games or refuse to buy season tickets, however when it comes down to it they moan and still put their hands in their pockets. Away prices is a slightly different thing and I would hope something can be done about it.

[eFestivals]

I do think the plans have been in place for a few years, getting young payers into the club and team.

has there really been any difference in the last couple of years to any period of fergie's reign? I can't see it.

Like any manager (listen to 'Arry), fergie has done what is firstly good for him, not for the club. He knows his buying isn't great, so far better to buy young and cheap where the failures don't get noticed as much because they matter less, and then less reflects back onto him. The fact that that's been overall good for the club too is in-part* a lucky coincidence.

(* 'in-part' because the club hasn't really had better options open to them even if they wanted to. They've just not had the cash to spunk in the manner of other world-big clubs).

I also think united will try and not make the mistakes they did when sir matt busby retired and got relegated a few years after winning the European cup.

"will try and not make the mistakes".

Care to tell me how that doesn't apply any differently to (say) QPR?

Every club is aiming for the same. The result cannot be different to it working out for some and failing for others. Flip a coin to decide who it fails for, and one day that coin has Utd's name on it.

----

Someone posted yesterday about how Utd don't sack managers quickly (which I guess was accurate for the time period covered.

But it was also selective. This from wiki shows that Utd are little different to other clubs.

(don't forget, managers lasted on average much longer back then than they do now)

Following an eighth-place finish in the 196970 season and a poor start to the 197071 season, Busby was persuaded to temporarily resume managerial duties, and McGuinness returned to his position as reserve team coach. In June 1971, Frank O'Farrell was appointed as manager, but lasted less than 18 months before being replaced by Tommy Docherty in December 1972.[36] Docherty saved Manchester United from relegation that season, only to see them relegated in 1974; by that time the trio of Best, Law, and Charlton had left the club.[32] The team won promotion at the first attempt and reached the FA Cup final in 1976, but were beaten by Southampton. They reached the final again in 1977, beating Liverpool 21. Docherty was dismissed shortly afterwards, following the revelation of his affair with the club physiotherapist's wife.[34][37]

Dave Sexton replaced Docherty as manager in the summer of 1977. Despite major signings, including Joe Jordan, Gordon McQueen, Gary Bailey, and Ray Wilkins, the team failed to achieve any significant results; they finished in the top two in 197980 and lost to Arsenal in the 1979 FA Cup Final. Sexton was dismissed in 1981, even though the team won the last seven games under his direction.[38] He was replaced by Ron Atkinson, who immediately broke the British record transfer fee to sign Bryan Robson from West Bromwich Albion. Under Atkinson, Manchester United won the FA Cup twice in three years in 1983 and 1985. In 198586, after 13 wins and two draws in its first 15 matches, the club was favourite to win the league, but finished in fourth place. The following season, with the club in danger of relegation by November, Atkinson was dismissed.[39]

[TheGayTent]

For 89 years West Ham had just 5 different managers.

In the last 24 years we've had 9.

Game has changed.

Though I'd guess 14 in total is probably less than most clubs.

[eFestivals]

For 89 years West Ham had just 5 different managers.

In the last 24 years we've had 9.

Game has changed.

Though I'd guess 14 in total is probably less than most clubs.

The game has defo changed.

That doesn't mean that I'm expecting Utd to necessarily be hasty if Moyes is doing not so well at any point this season, but I am expecting their fans to be.

As I say, there's lots of scope for some amusement next season.

[TheGayTent]

As I say, there's lots of scope for some amusement next season.

[eFestivals]

Agreed. With Rogers in charge at Anfield that's virtually guaranteed

The expectations are wildly lower, just as were when 'King Kenny' came back.

There's nothing like 20 years in the doldrums to drum a modicum of sense into most fans, and conversely, the opposite has happened with Utd fans. That's the bleedin' point.

You're mistaking high hopes for expectations.

Still, as a WHU fan you'd know of neither, aside from the expectation of regular relegation.

[TheGayTent]

Caught me a marlin !

[eFestivals]

Caught me a marlin !

Keep celebrating, I know it's the best life ever gets for you.

[metallimuse]

There doesn't seem to be a Scotland end for the game against England in augustis this wise?I'd feel much safer in a Scotland end then risk being sat amongst England fans while in my kilt and stuff.I heard there were Afew fights breaking out at the Ireland game earlier this year.

[pink_triangle]

Spain are such a scary squad you look at their 2nd 11 and its probably better than any other country in the worlds first 11 apart from maybe Germany. With their u21 side looking strong as well, its hard to see them not challenging for the next 10 years minimum.

[kaosmark2]

Prem's attempting to block streaming websites:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-23004880

No surprise, and what shocks me is the conflict-of-interest in that EVERY internet provider is also a TV/media provider.

What really irks me is that almost anything that's actually on Sky, I watch legitimately (albeit often in a pub), I primarily use streaming sites to watch matches that aren't actually broadcast here at all.

[pink_triangle]

Im going to be a bit hypocritical when it comes to streaming. When it comes to Saturday 3pm matches, Im completely against it because I think it has the potential to effect attendances at lower league matches. If however wrexham are on premier sports or there is a big premiership match on a sunday, maybe it isn't such a terrible thing!

[TheGayTent]

So Mignolet to Liverpool for £9m, value?

Seems overpriced to me. Then again, no doubt better value the £9m paid for Craig Gordon...

[daniel.k]

Sky Sports claims its above 9m

"Liverpool have agreed a fee in excess of £11m with Sunderland for goalkeeper Simon Mignolet, according to Sky sources"

Could it be 9m with 2m in add ons and bonus payments. Guess that means Reina is going Barca and maybe Valdes going to Monoco or PSG or somewhere, doubt Barce would keep him and put him on the bench for a year when they can get money for him

[kaosmark2]

Im going to be a bit hypocritical when it comes to streaming. When it comes to Saturday 3pm matches, Im completely against it because I think it has the potential to effect attendances at lower league matches. If however wrexham are on premier sports or there is a big premiership match on a sunday, maybe it isn't such a terrible thing!

[RobertProsineckisLighter]

Begovic is an absolute class act, he went of the boil a little for me last season but he will go on to be a top top keeper. and a top bloke, also speaks 4 languages.

Whatever her goes for, we will not see a penny of it, as Daniel Azougy* sold him.... infact we also owed spurs a million for Begovic (he has never been a spurs play) because of Azougy and his actions. At least these paracits who plagued our club and helped to ruin us are gone.

http://www.thejc.com/sport/sport-news/25328/convicted-fraudster-help-pompey*

[kaosmark2]

Begovic is definitely a talent, I think a lot of good keepers had poor seasons last year, but the comparison was more in terms of young keepers with similar Prem experience. I guess Guzan could go into that, but he's not been playing in the Prem for nearly as long as the other 3. I just reckon Liverpool didn't have many options so Sunderland ramped the price up a bit.

The deals and transfers at your place were insane, I just don't understand how they could be in place like that. How much of the lingering troubles remain? Obviously a lot of high-wage players have now gone, and I guess a fair whack of the owed transfer fees?