Metallica....in the Mosh, will there be a mosh, not in the mosh?

[Chimps in Balaclavas]

Chase n status on the West Holts 2011 was verging dangerous, loads of.fights caused by jumped up little prices passed on.there two Strongbows

Hehe are you typing this on your phone?

[rexclark]

Hehe are you typing this on your phone?

Think he might be but trying to type using his feet.

[Wooderson]

It really is a case of banging head against wall syndrome here. It's not really the moshing that bothers me, it's the "we're having a mosh pit here because WE want one, if you don't like it then YOU have to move, I don't care that you had a good spot and were having the time of your life and I've now ruined that" attitude that I can't stand. And the whole "if you stand next to a pit then it's your own fault if you get hit and don't like it" argument doesn't stand. Mosh pits don't start until after the band start playing and in random places. Therefore you could think you're standing in a perfectly fine spot thinking you're away from moshers, then all of a sudden five songs in one opens up and you are now on the edge of one. You didn't choose to stand next to one, you were forced, and that is what pisses people off. You can't tell where a pit will open up until the band start playing, therefore people are always forced to stand next to a pit, and not choose to.

Really well put mate.

[Chimps in Balaclavas]

Think he might be but trying to type using his feet.

[Swine_Glasto2014]

Haha fok sake yes I am!!!!

Predictive is w*nk

[alexwetherell]

It's just something different for Glastonbury isn't it. Just wish people would stop moaning and enjoy it. Next year it'll be Coldplay again

[Gnomicide]

It's a strange one, that's for sure.

I've been going to metal gigs since 1981, I can't remember when mosh pits first started appearing, people just used to jump up and down, that led to crowd surges and people being bumped into, maybe it developed from there.

I've joined the odd one for a quick 30 seconds or so but generally can't be arsed. I don't attend many metal gigs these days but when I do, the jumping up and down bit still goes on and there is occasionally a small pit. These tend to form away from the front, if you look at any Download footage, they are normally a fair bit back.

Anyway, they don't annoy me but I fully understand why they annoy others. But then just jumping about a little annoys some people and people at the front of gigs who get annoyed by the slightest knock, really annoy me.

All in all, I think it's safe to agree that people are annoyed.

Annoying isn't it?

Back on track, I think there may be a few small pits at Glastonbury but they will peter out after a couple of songs and the rest of the gig will be less raucous than Blur.

[Swine_Glasto2014]

It's going to be a amazing show, I can't wait.

[cornish hick]

It really is a case of banging head against wall syndrome here. It's not really the moshing that bothers me, it's the "we're having a mosh pit here because WE want one, if you don't like it then YOU have to move, I don't care that you had a good spot and were having the time of your life and I've now ruined that" attitude that I can't stand. And the whole "if you stand next to a pit then it's your own fault if you get hit and don't like it" argument doesn't stand. Mosh pits don't start until after the band start playing and in random places. Therefore you could think you're standing in a perfectly fine spot thinking you're away from moshers, then all of a sudden five songs in one opens up and you are now on the edge of one. You didn't choose to stand next to one, you were forced, and that is what pisses people off. You can't tell where a pit will open up until the band start playing, therefore people are always forced to stand next to a pit, and not choose to.

Well said

[jeffie]

It really is a case of banging head against wall syndrome here. It's not really the moshing that bothers me, it's the "we're having a mosh pit here because WE want one, if you don't like it then YOU have to move, I don't care that you had a good spot and were having the time of your life and I've now ruined that" attitude that I can't stand. And the whole "if you stand next to a pit then it's your own fault if you get hit and don't like it" argument doesn't stand. Mosh pits don't start until after the band start playing and in random places. Therefore you could think you're standing in a perfectly fine spot thinking you're away from moshers, then all of a sudden five songs in one opens up and you are now on the edge of one. You didn't choose to stand next to one, you were forced, and that is what pisses people off. You can't tell where a pit will open up until the band start playing, therefore people are always forced to stand next to a pit, and not choose to.

This, and as someone said, if anyone does get hurt then that kills metal at Glastonbury.

[jeffie]

And Mr Penguin, you are a tit!

[LondonTom]

All in all, I think it's safe to agree that people are annoyed.

Most sensible thing posted in this thread!

I am annoyed that people are annoyed now!

[Yesiamaduck]

Most sensible thing posted in this thread!

I am annoyed that people are annoyed now!

[Wooderson]

And people wonder why UKIP was so succesful?

[Wooderson]

- Let us do what we want and shut up

- If you don't like then simply leave

- This is the way it's going to be cuz we said so

- It's YOUR problem, not ours

[kingjamma]

So when I'm stood there in my Metallica t-shirt, everyone should expect me to start moshing? What you aren't realising is my post is from experience. Experience from god knows how many metal shows, as I am a metal fan, and trust me I am a die hard Metallica fan (you can see me in the Through The Never Movie which was filmed in Canada). I know pits will open as they always do, I'm not that naive, but that doesn't mean you won't affect people and piss them off. You can't tell where a pit will form, you can have a good idea, but you won't know for definite. I have been right at the front and pits have formed, I have been right at the front and they haven't. I've been half way back and they have formed, and vice versa. My points about people not wanting to be part of the pit isn't Glastonbury specific, it is from the experiences in crowds that are exclusively metal fans and pits have opened up and people get caught up who had no interest in being near one, so much so they actually decided to stand a bit further back to try and avoid it full stop.

Like I keep saying, it's not the moshing I have a problem with, it's the self entitled view people have with it. If that's how you enjoy the show, fair enough, but a very good proportion of the people in the area you opening the pit will get annoyed as now an already crowded space has become worse for them as you created an empty space for yourself that people can no longer stand in. And that isn't aimed at a Glastonbury audience, but audiences everywhere. You are basically saying, "I want to mosh, so I will mosh", which is my gripe. But I'm also not saying people should stop you either and just start punching people who want to mosh, but don't think just cause it's a metal band it should be expected that you can open a pit. Everyone just needs to be aware of the people around them and how their actions may affect others, which quite often is lost when people start a pit. And I know it happens at other genres gigs, and the same rules apply there. I have seen many, many times at METAL gigs where some people have opened up a pit and some people have gotten very pissed off at the fact that they got a bit physical. The people that got pissed off and physical are quite often you're stereotypical heavy metal biker dude, so I'm pretty sure they understand metal crowds. You even said yourself, people will start stretching out to form the pit, and that's what will get peoples back up as they have now been pushed out of their space and squashed up, and then when someone accidentally flies into them they then get even more pissed off as they are already agitated from the pit being opened.

I don't have twisted, paranoid views of what a mosh pit actually is, I know exactly what they are cause as I have said earlier in this thread, I used to mosh all the time when I was younger (circle pits were my favourite). I know when in one, there are rules and you all look out for each other. But I also know you don't realise how many people you are pissing off around you just by opening that pit, and that is the big problem. Back then I didn't realise how much I was potentially affecting others as, like you, I used to think it was the done thing and people should expect it and not complain. I now realise how selfish that was of me and that you affect a lot of other peoples enjoyment, and that is why I'm not a massive fan of it now.

Basically, you are trying to justify why you are entitled to mosh when and where you want, and that isn't right, both at Glastonbury or anywhere else. You're not entitled to nothing, no one is, except to have a good time enjoying the show with no worries of anything else. If that means you need to mosh to enjoy, then that's ok, but don't do it at the cost of other people's enjoyment. You are also being very stereotypical of metal fans in saying that pretty much all will want to mosh as that's how metal fans act.

So yeah, I am a metal fan and a MASSIVE Metallica fan who has been waiting for this moment since I first went to Glastonbury and won't be moshing, which to you probably makes me boring. But I will be there, banging my head, pumping my fist in the air and screaming every word so much that I probably won't be able to talk the next day like after every other Metallica gig I've been to.

I tell you what though, crowdsurfers are a lot worse than moshers.

[russycarps]

fucking hell penguin, I reckon you've typed more words in your 370 posts than I have in my 10,000!

[Wooderson]

fucking hell penguin, I reckon you've typed more words in your 370 posts than I have in my 10,000!

Has any seen Nick Griffin since he lost his seat?

[kingjamma]

Firstly I did not say all metal fans want to mosh, I said that at a metal gig if your down the front its generally expected it will happen so people will be a lot less prone to being annoyed or scared by it happening, whereas at glastonbury people do need to be a bit more careful

secondly you said `If that means you need to mosh to enjoy, then that's ok, but don't do it at the cost of other people's enjoyment.`

well....we wont do it at the cost of other peoples enjoyment.... thats the point! I think any pits at glastonbury will be minor league compared to most for that reason, we know the situation we will be looking out more for the people around us then even usual, see the problem is im all for the common ground im happy to be part of pits that may have to be a bit less aggressive and more carefully set out then normal so as to not affect those around but in doing so I expect the respect of being allowed to express myself in such a way by those around me. It works both ways your going on about cracking down on peoples fun......well what about the fun of those who like a good pit? do we not count? do we not have the right to express ourselves to the music we love as long as we`re respectful and look out for those around us?

and I resent you trying to make out im calling you boring for not moshing I said no such thing, each to his own I have friends who are also fans of this music who dont like going in the pit, live and let live. ive no problem with those who dont want to jump in thats their choice is it not?

As far as crowd surfers go I dont get why people do it for such large gigs anyway....I mean if you do manage to get people to help you up there then your going to get a 5 second rush as your on top then when security pull you down and send you right around the back of the crowd your going to have lost your spot in the crowd and may as well have not waited around to be there in the first place..

I just find that with pits, even though you could have the best intentions of looking out for the people on the edges of the pit, those good intentions can easily end up getting lost by a good majority of those taking part in the pit as they are more concentrated on the moshing. Not all obviously, but some will. The thing with pits as well is, although they are 'organised', they are very 'unorganised' if that makes sense, and can sometimes get a bit out of hand. Plus the thing I hate the most, and it's the most common thing that happens, is when two or three guys start trying to open up a pit randomly out of nowhere and start pushing people to make that open space. That's the thing that pisses a lot of people off and makes them quite hostile as that is when it becomes inconsiderate, cause when the crowd doesn't react how they wanted in opening up the space, they quite often start getting a bit arsey a start shoving people harder to make that space open up. I'm not saying this is what happens all the time, but it is very common and is the type of thing I have seen the most.

There are pits that are quite small and don't really affect people, quite often looking like a group of mates having a bit of fun. They're fine as everyone is getting on. I personally reckon that most people who get annoyed at moshing aren't necessarily annoyed at the actual moshing, but the procedure in which the pit was created and self entitled view is what has got them pissed off, and in turn say they are pissed off at moshing. I would probably find myself in this category, although I wouldn't say I get pissed off at moshing, I am more about the creation and self entitled view a lot have. Obviously some will get pissed off even if it was created considerately and will act like a dick, but that's not ok either.

And with the crowdsurfers, the people on the front barrier get a very rough deal as they have the bouncers near enough resting on them and the surfers weight as well. Not to mention everyone's head your foot hit on the way, landing on the back of people's necks and causing pain, and the occasional drop when you land on top of someone and squash them. Really not cool.

[A Guy Called Matt]

Jeez - can't be arsed to read all this....

How will anyone do any moshing when it takes 500 words to just say 'no'.

I shall mostly be smiling and happy whereever I happen to be on the Saturday.

[A Guy Called Matt]

[Ruwise]

Most of this could be summarised by just saying be considerate to those around you. Everybody has paid the same and deserves to enjoy their experience. The same can be said of chair dwellers, people who chat loudly during quiet songs, people who are a foot taller who insist on standing in front of someone 10 seconds before a band starts and people who stick phones up in the air for half a gig. I'm very short but my husband gets quite claustrophobic in crowds so we try and arrive in good time and pick a good spot where I can see something but it isn't too crowded. The amount of times people just barge past me just before or even after the band has started to play leaving me with no view is phenomenal. It is even worse when they do this and then just chat through the act.

Whatever you do be considerate. Check people around you are ok with your behaviour. Most people don't like to speak up because they are worried it will cause trouble particularly if people are doing something like moshing because it is quite boisterous. Maybe chat to people around you before the gig to gauge whether they are likely to want to do the same things as you.

[jeffie]

Edited May 29, 2014 by jeffie

[The Nal]

well....we wont do it at the cost of other peoples enjoyment.... thats the point!

Exactly the point. Theres no way that a pit of any size won't impact other people. So, you will do it at the cost of other peoples enjoyment. Its unavoidable.

.well what about the fun of those who like a good pit? do we not count? do we not have the right to express ourselves to the music we love as long as we`re respectful and look out for those around us?

This is gold. No. You don't have the right to bash into people.

Also, the concept of pits and moshing is cringingly outdated and stereotypical. It was even as far back as the 80s hardcore scene. Its the equivalent of going to the joke shop and buying a long wig, hippy glasses and Jim Morrison trousers and waving peace signs at everyone. I'm embarrassed for you.

Do you not want to watch the fucking band?

[kingjamma]

Do you not want to watch the fucking band?

Whenever I look back on when I used to mosh all the time this is the thing that crops up the most in my mind. I would end up concentrating more on the moshing that I wouldn't necessarily remember the bands performance as much, but more the pit I was in. Quite bad when I think about it as I had paid to watch the band, not bash about like a loon.