Headliners 2015

[eastynh]

There's nothing wrong with wanting to better yourself or your kids futures.

But wouldn't you prefer that you had a fair and even chance of doing so alongside all other individuals, rather than the rich having contrived a system that makes your chances of succeeding in your aims highly unlikely (more unlikely than it would otherwise be)?

Wouldn't you prefer that the chances were even? It's not about penalising the wealthy, it's about equality of opportunity.

Or, instead, are you aiming to get into the position of the rich to act as much of a c**t as they currently do?

If we lived in a perfect utopian state, we should all get the same opportunities. But unfortunately human nature is not inclined in the same way. It took me a long time to realise this. No one else is going to help me so I am going to have to do it myself. If anyone has any ideas how we can change the system then I am all ears.

Engels came up with his ideas for the communist manifesto while living in Manchester after seeing the squalor that the inhabitants were living in. It was alright him coming up with his philosophy for how we should all live fairly while he was taking advantage of his privileged position and knocking off the peasant girls . In reality Communism was doomed to failure even if in theory it seems a fantastic idea.

I grew up in an environment where being clever or wanting to progress would lead to ridicule and bullying. It is an area where the drug dealers swan around in flash cars and they pull the nicest birds as having a 10 year plan for going through higher education while being penniless while you do it is not an attractive proposition for any lady. I have no idea how you change the mentality of people like that, I wish I did but I do not. So it becomes every man for themselves.

To answer your question about whether I will get rich and behave like a c**t, the answer is no as I will never be what would be regarded as rich. I may end up pretty highly educated but because I left school with no qualifications and because of the length of time it has taken me to catch up, I will be too old to fully take advantage of my position. But if I can hopefully afford to put my children through uni and am able to get through to my children the importance of education and the advantages it brings, then I will have given my children an opportunity that others of my ilk will never experience.

[5co77ie]

Blunt was an NCO in the Lifeguards and working service under NATO - that's doesn't pay very much, the Mrs' father was a commissioned officer working for NATO I didn't think it was very well paid - unless he's got a lot of money stashed I don't know about.

He also went to University of Bristol - is that posh?

I think selling 20 million albums and 17 million singles probably made him more money

Edited to add: mind you he's related this guy:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Blount,_4th_Baron_Mountjoy

so hardly needed a job!

Edited January 20, 2015 by 5co77ie

[Icewulf]

She ticks all the boxes for a very good sub for the pyramid stage. She probably deserves her chance too.

Yeah. Didn't she pull out in 2005?

And I remember her joining Scissor Sisters on stage when they headlined too.

Would make sense for her to play.

Edited January 20, 2015 by Icewulf

[eastynh]

he's buying into the idea that he CAN get out of the shithole via his own hard work alone - when nothing of that is guaranteed because we are nothing like a meritocracy.

It's not hard work that counts most for success as things stand, but money and privilege. Which is the bleeding point that Bryant was making.

There's wanting to better yourself thru your own hard work, and then there's money lined up to stop you.

It is this doomed to failure before you begin attitude that stops people even trying to better themselves. If you believe you have no chance before you start then what chance do you really have?

Thats why people end up selling drugs, robbing banks and taking the easy way out. I have seen too many people give up. Bollocks to that.

[eastynh]

have you read the article yet?

Yes, I see nothing wrong in it really. He was foolish to name James Blunt, But Blunt has way over reacted and has missed the point. It is a shame that Blunt does not have the sense of humour that Ed Sheeran seems to possess. Ed has been ridiculed form all quarters this year and has come out of it with his dignity and enhanced his reputation with a few funny one liners. James Blunt seems quite a quick minded individual, he should have come up with a witty riposte. Not lose him temper like that and totally miss the point.

[eFestivals]

If we lived in a perfect utopian state, we should all get the same opportunities. But unfortunately human nature is not inclined in the same way.

Bullshit to that. The structure we have to society is a human construct, not the natural order of things; there is no 'natural order of things'.

That aside, even if accepting that it is a natural order, why should we just let it be if we can better-structure it with rules? In fact, we already better-structure it with rules, it's just the rules are not as good as they could be.

It took me a long time to realise this.

you mean it took you a long time to reach the incorrect conclusion.

No one else is going to help me so I am going to have to do it myself.

That may be correect.

If it is, while none might help you, do you think it's right that some should be actively trying to stop you? Because that's what is going on. And it DOESN'T HAVE TO!!!

If anyone has any ideas how we can change the system then I am all ears.

Tax the rich. Abolish inheritances.

Those would be a good start.

The rich take over twice as much of this country's wealth now than they did do 35 years ago, while doing nothing extra to do so. This recent change proves that what is going on is not 'natural', and that there's better systems.

I grew up in an environment where being clever or wanting to progress would lead to ridicule and bullying. It is an area where the drug dealers swan around in flash cars and they pull the nicest birds as having a 10 year plan for going through higher education while being penniless while you do it is not an attractive proposition for any lady. I have no idea how you change the mentality of people like that, I wish I did but I do not. So it becomes every man for themselves.

have you ever stopped to think that there3 may be your own issues with your own mentality? They're shining thru at me from your words there.

To answer your question about whether I will get rich and behave like a c**t, the answer is no as I will never be what would be regarded as rich.

so what you're saying is, if you did get rich you would be that c**t?

Your words above seem to say so. You think what goes on it the only thing which can go on.

[tommyds]

If we lived in a perfect utopian state, we should all get the same opportunities. But unfortunately human nature is not inclined in the same way. It took me a long time to realise this. No one else is going to help me so I am going to have to do it myself. If anyone has any ideas how we can change the system then I am all ears.

It's about time we embraced communism... now bear with me...

We've reached a point in society where capitalism is demonstrably holding us back.

When we automated the car industry, the first thing we did was tell all the guys on the production line "sorry, you're out of job". Consequently, we shy away from automating industry in its entirety because it would mean the loss of massive numbers of jobs. A wholehearted capitalist view would say automate it anyway but the reality, that we need less people and the unemployed should just be allowed to die off, is too horrific. This is because we labour under the misapprehension that everyone needs to work 40 hours a week to prove their value to society.

Why don't we automate everything we can and then set the working week at a level that means everyone is still in work?

So the solution is communism, but with more robots.

[eFestivals]

Blunt was an NCO in the Lifeguards and working service under NATO

since when have army Captains that have been to Sandhurst been non-commissioned officers?

a commissioned officer working for NATO I didn't think it was very well paid

and you're thinking wrong.

(NATO has fuck all to do with anything; it's the British Army who is their employer).

He also went to University of Bristol - is that posh?

yup. One of the top 'Russell Group' uni's

[eastynh]

Bullshit to that. The structure we have to society is a human construct, not the natural order of things; there is no 'natural order of things'.

That aside, even if accepting that it is a natural order, why should we just let it be if we can better-structure it with rules? In fact, we already better-structure it with rules, it's just the rules are not as good as they could be.

you mean it took you a long time to reach the incorrect conclusion.

That may be correect.

If it is, while none might help you, do you think it's right that some should be actively trying to stop you? Because that's what is going on. And it DOESN'T HAVE TO!!!

Tax the rich. Abolish inheritances.

Those would be a good start.

The rich take over twice as much of this country's wealth now than they did do 35 years ago, while doing nothing extra to do so. This recent change proves that what is going on is not 'natural', and that there's better systems.

have you ever stopped to think that there3 may be your own issues with your own mentality? They're shining thru at me from your words there.

so what you're saying is, if you did get rich you would be that c**t?

Your words above seem to say so. You think what goes on it the only thing which can go on.

I will send you a pm, I do not think it is fair to clog up the thread with our political leanings and opinions. I do not think politically my opinions are that far away from yours really.

[FuzzyDunlop]

I keep seeing James Blunt's name and "Headliners 2015" - it is slightly disturbing

Edited January 20, 2015 by FuzzyDunlop

[LondonTom]

The whole "is she a headliner" debate is so boring. She is, if you don't agree then don't go and see her when she does.

Its not, its a genuine argument based on the fact she hasn't headlined one of the big fests in the UK yet. (Unlike say Arcade Frie/Kasabian).

I thought this forum was progressive and leading the calls for more female headliners, so why are we now slagging off a woman's appearance just because we don't like her music?

I think its mainly that she makes shit music, just like Kasabian got slagged off last year.

If you still still give a shit about class, and dislike a band or person because they are part of a certain class. You don't belong in todays society, and you're living as if that really effects you anymore.

You are right there is certainly no class divide at all anymore, everyone has equal opportunies from the moment they are born entirely. Today's society is just and fair to all!

I don't care if someones richer than me, i don't care if someones poorer than me. I also don't judge people on what type of education they've had either,

Of course, thats easier to say if you are already relatively well off...

[Amy Lawn]

My pal went to Bristol University (subsequently lost his accent, a bit further down the line became a total w*nker), did that shit student job where you phone up the rich ex-students and beg for money. Found James Blunt on the records, gave it a go for the #bants, his mum picked up the phone, so he says something to the effect of "Hiya, Missus Blunt, can we have your Jimmy's number please!?", she shouts at him for a bit and hangs up the phone.

Unless that was actually Darren Brown... it was definitely one or the other.

[eFestivals]

It is this doomed to failure before you begin attitude that stops people even trying to better themselves. If you believe you have no chance before you start then what chance do you really have?

Thats why people end up selling drugs, robbing banks and taking the easy way out. I have seen too many people give up. Bollocks to that.

People sell drugs, etc, because it's a better opportunity than society is offering them. They're bettering themselves no differently to you - tho via a different method. (But that's a different issue entirely - the lack of opportunities).

Who is saying "doomed to failure"? Not me. I'm simply pointing out the *FACT* that your chances of success do not depend on your own efforts alone, and your chances of success are currently decreasing each and every day despite the efforts you say you're making.

Wouldn't you rather have a fair and reasonable chance of success, so that you're efforts actually count in full?

Or would you rather be wasting much of your efforts, because your own efforts on your own merits do not count for as much as money?

[Slugworth]

This thread used to be good.

[Rose-Colored Boy]

Its not, its a genuine argument based on the fact she hasn't headlined one of the big fests in the UK yet. (Unlike say Arcade Frie/Kasabian).

Mmm. Everyone has to have a 'first major headline slot' somewhere of course. Sometimes Glasto being someone's first 'go' at a headline slot is well recieved (Beyoncé) and sometimes it doesn't work (Arctic Monkeys). It's a risk but in the absence of an obvious third headliner for this year other than Flo I can very much see them taking it. And she has of course done the 'groundwork' in headlining at Bestival and Latitude (which I don't think AM had??)

[russycarps]

Can I ask you mate, do you know what it is really like to be poor?

Well I dont want to get into a "I was poorer than you" debate, but put it this way, I lived for many years in barrow in furness. There's one road in, and one road out. And in those days it was very very difficult to get on that road out.

[eFestivals]

Well I dont want to get into a "I was poorer than you" debate, but put it this way, I lived for many years in barrow in furness. There's one road in, and one road out. And in those days it was very very difficult to get on that road out.

I bet you bought one of those houses for a quid and sold it for thousands.

[Frankly Mr Shankly]

Mmm. Everyone has to have a 'first major headline slot' somewhere of course. Sometimes Glasto being someone's first 'go' at a headline slot is well recieved (Beyoncé) and sometimes it doesn't work (Arctic Monkeys). It's a risk but in the absence of an obvious third headliner for this year other than Flo I can very much see them taking it. And she has of course done the 'groundwork' in headlining at Bestival and Latitude (which I don't think AM had??)

Bestival is a major festival now, it has a maximum capacity of 79,000 & an average punter capacity of 50,000.

In 2012 (the year she headlined) it also won an award for being the 'best major festival'.

I can't stand the woman personally, but it's hard to argue that she isn't big enough at this point to be headlining major festivals in the UK, especially by the time she drops another album.

[Rose-Colored Boy]

Bestival is a major festival now, it has a maximum capacity of 79,000 & an average punter capacity of 50,000.

In 2012 (the year she headlined) it also won an award for being the 'best major festival'.

I can't stand the woman personally, but it's hard to argue that she isn't big enough at this point to be headlining major festivals in the UK, especially by the time she drops another album.

Its not in the same tier as Glasto/Reading/V/T in terms of profile which is how I classify them but fair points.

[The Nal]

Well I dont want to get into a "I was poorer than you" debate, but put it this way, I lived for many years in barrow in furness. There's one road in, and one road out. And in those days it was very very difficult to get on that road out.

We were so poor growing up, one evening to start the fire we had to kill our grandmother and use her bones as flint and her saggy arse cheeks as dinner.

[Gene Parmesan]

What stage where we at at this point with the 3 main headliners last year? Arcade Fire confirmed, Kasabian all but in name confirmed and lengthy debates about Metallica credentials as headliners? Or where Kasabian and Metallica swapped about? Or was there still some doubt as to who the other two headliners would be?

Cant quite remember.

[Rose-Colored Boy]

IIRC Neil's Metallica info came out of the blue and was much later than mid-January.

[Frankly Mr Shankly]

Its not in the same tier as Glasto/Reading/V/T in terms of profile which is how I classify them but fair points.

Fair point. But you haven't included Download in that list either & as far as I'm aware that has the second biggest single site capacity of any festival in the UK.

[Rose-Colored Boy]

Fair point. But you haven't included Download in that list either & as far as I'm aware that has the second biggest single site capacity of any festival in the UK.

Sorry, that's because it didn't come to mind during a debate about F&TM :') Obvs it is though.

[Perks]

This thread used to be good.

No, it really wasn't..did you see some of the names that were being talked about on here...