What women (don't) want.

[bunique]

I disagree with you midnight - that level of transformation can be achieved in 12 weeks. It may not be sustainable but I don't think it's fake!

[bunique]

And the trend is very much for that kind of fitness - CrossFit, Insanity, P90X are all incredibly popular are adopt the same principles as those in the article. Google "insanity before and after" and you'll see what people achieve in 60 days. And it's both men and women - my husband goes to a "Guerilla training" class (think circuits but with the kind of exercises that article describes) and it's attended by more women than men - some go every day. I still await his 6 pack though

[feral chile]

This is relevant to this thread, if you read right to the end. It's an example of how focusing solely on gender divisions can be destructive, if you lose sight of the overall aim.

I mentioned this in the other thread, I think. I had a male friend who was bisexual, and I asked him why he didn't get involved with any gay activism.

His reply was that his sexuality wasn't what defined him, that he was much more than that, and that he had more in common with a straight psychology student (which he was) than a gay Tory (which he wasn't).

I think the same can apply to gender. There are all sorts of inequalities and social pressures that affect both sexes, affect different types of people within a particular gender, and affect people outside the Western Hemisphere.

There's always a danger that the people affected most by inequality are without a voice altogether. Because they can't speak out, and they're invisible to the rest of us.

http://www.gaystarnews.com/article/survivors-1980s-aids-crisis-reveal-what-happened-them020215

[kaosmark2]

Even if they discipline themselves into total bores (Imagine sharing your life with someone who lives on spinach and protein shakes and spends several hours at the gym every day. Is there really an amount of manly muscle or degree of female slenderness that can compensate for decades of this?)

That's another factor. People who workout loads have nothing interesting to talk about because their life is in the gym.

[feral chile]

That's another factor. People who workout loads have nothing interesting to talk about because their life is in the gym.

I don't think it's just that - as a yo-yo dieter, I find I get obsessed with food to the exclusion of all else. And in a counter-life sort of way.

It just feels repressive in a deeper sense than just controlling my calorie intake.

[kaosmark2]

I don't think it's just that - as a yo-yo dieter, I find I get obsessed with food to the exclusion of all else. And in a counter-life sort of way.

It just feels repressive in a deeper sense than just controlling my calorie intake.

Food is awesome to be fair.

[jump]

That's another factor. People who workout loads have nothing interesting to talk about because their life is in the gym.

A typical gym session is 30 mins to hour so there's plenty of time to do other shit during the day too, whilst you get people who are obsessive with the gym you will also find people just as obsessive with footie, games, soaps etc and it’s more to do with the person being a bore than the intrest.

[kaosmark2]

A typical gym session is 30 mins to hour so there's plenty of time to do other shit during the day too, whilst you get people who are obsessive with the gym you will also find people just as obsessive with footie, games, soaps etc and it’s more to do with the person being a bore than the intrest.

I'm more speaking from experience of friends who suddenly decide to get fit, go 3 times a day, and then cancel plans because they've "got to get another gym session in", and when you do meet them they don't talk about anything else.

But yeah, basically anyone who doesn't change what they talk about to ensure it's an overlapping interest is a bore.

[feral chile]

A typical gym session is 30 mins to hour so there's plenty of time to do other shit during the day too, whilst you get people who are obsessive with the gym you will also find people just as obsessive with footie, games, soaps etc and it’s more to do with the person being a bore than the intrest.

I certainly think it's to do with obsessive behaviour or an addiction, for some people.

[feral chile]

Food is awesome to be fair.

yeah I think so as well.

Which is why it's difficult for me to ignore any of it

[jump]

I'm more speaking from experience of friends who suddenly decide to get fit, go 3 times a day, and then cancel plans because they've "got to get another gym session in", and when you do meet them they don't talk about anything else.

But yeah, basically anyone who doesn't change what they talk about to ensure it's an overlapping interest is a bore.

Yeah, when most people start they will talk about for the first few months untill it becomes the norm for them and then mix in other shit in their lives or just give up, probably due to the excitement of it all.

The thing is though if they are going to the gym 3 times a day then they are doing it wong, whatever the specifc muscles that are being worked out need to be rested for a week to ensure they can build mass unless it's cardio/circuit training to improve overall fitness.

[fred quimby]

The thing is though if they are going to the gym 3 times a day then they are doing it wong, whatever the specifc muscles that are being worked out need to be rested for a week to ensure they can build mass unless it's cardio/circuit training to improve overall fitness.

Or they fancy someone there

[russycarps]

That's another factor. People who workout loads have nothing interesting to talk about because their life is in the gym.

I see this sort of thing written a lot. I dont think people should be criticised for getting healthy surely?

Edited February 3, 2015 by russycarps

[jump]

Or they fancy someone there

Well I did only write that bit since we are talking about how it's annoying people talk about the gym but I do see that alot, it's funny seeing people try to work out when the other person's gym session will and wont be.

[zero000]

I see this sort of thing written a lot. I dont think people should be criticised for getting healthy surely?

I think you're confusing health and looking aesthetically pleasing. There's plenty of lug heads at the gym, who never step near a treadmill.

[jump]

I see this sort of thing written a lot. I dont think people should be criticised for getting healthy surely?

Well Bono does a lot of good work but I still want him to fuck off, they aren't really being criticised for getting healthy but being obnoxious about it.

[bunique]

I think you're confusing health and looking aesthetically pleasing. There's plenty of lug heads at the gym, who never step near a treadmill.

And plenty of people who spend hours on the treadmill doing nothing to improve their fitness

I think fitness in general is not very well understood (and I say that as a fatty but I do at least have a fair understanding of what I *should* be doing!)

[kaosmark2]

I don't judge people for going to the gym, I judge people for being twats.

[russycarps]

I'm not sure, it seems to me that muscular men are judged just as much as pretty page-3 type girls. Automatically labelled as obnoxious, arrogant etc.

Is it envy? I think there is a lot of that to it. Just as there is envy in girls being bitchy about page 3 girls - slags, bimbos etc.

ps I am not some arnold schwarzenegger (how the fuck do you spell that!) type!

[feral chile]

I don't think it's envy so much as bias. Pretty girls looking overtly sexy are seen as also being brainless.

I noticed in the other thread, a few of us assumed that Page 3 girls would otherwise be doing menial jobs. And it wasn't challenged. Just as when I implied the same about footballers.

It's as if we think that someone who conforms to this particular stereotype can't also be intelligent.

Edited February 3, 2015 by feral chile

[jump]

I'm not sure, it seems to me that muscular men are judged just as much as pretty page-3 type girls. Automatically labelled as obnoxious, arrogant etc.

Is it envy? I think there is a lot of that to it. Just as there is envy in girls being bitchy about page 3 girls - slags, bimbos etc.

ps I am not some arnold schwarzenegger (how the fuck do you spell that!) type!

Yeah, I have actually been called "Schwarzenegger" by randoms before because I'm big guy and people do expect me to be either roid rage guy or a bro meat head type so I have to be overly nice to compensate for it.

[russycarps]

I don't think it's envy so much as bias. Pretty girls looking overtly sexy are seen as also being brainless.

I noticed in the other thread, a few of us assumed that Page 3 girls would otherwise be doing menial jobs. And it wasn't challenged. Just as when I implied the same about footballers.

It's as if we think that someone who conforms to this particular stereotype can't also be intelligent.

Well isnt that just trying to make ourselves feel better about ourselves, which is pretty similar to envy?

"look at her, she may be prettier than me but at least I'm cleverer than her"

"look at him, he may be more muscular than me, but at least I'm a nicer person"

[feral chile]

Well isnt that just trying to make ourselves feel better about ourselves, which is pretty similar to envy?

"look at her, she may be prettier than me but at least I'm cleverer than her"

"look at him, he may be more muscular than me, but at least I'm a nicer person"

it's more patronising than that.

[russycarps]

it's more patronising than that.

yes I suppose the man/woman examples are different.

[feral chile]

For women, you can doll yourself up, or not, so it's not so much intrinsic beauty that's being judged.