General Election 2015

[eFestivals]

I wasn't denying Scotland being a country - done some checking and it is a country - just not a sovereign state.

So Texas and California are countries too? Normandy? Mercia? Wessex?

Each of those is 100% equal to Scotland in historical status and current status. Few Scots would regard them as countries.

[LJS]

Lots of Scots do though, despite Salmond they voted to not be a country.

I think you'll find many many no voters would still consider Scotland to be a country.

[Comfy Bean]

FFS. You're saying here it's a bad thing that Osborne hasn't cut harder.

That nothing like what I said. I said " Where did Dave and Osbourne predict we would be on this by 2015 ? "

It was a question. I don`t know the answer. Does anyone ? Maybe they didn`t make a prediction, I don`t know hence the reason I asked.

The point I was trying to make is that the plan doesn`t appear to be working and many many people have and are suffering. NS is offering an alternative.

That is what I`m saying ( or trying to )

Are you backing Osbournes plan then ? As I said, I`m backing an alternative approach.

I

[eFestivals]

That nothing like what I said. I said " Where did Dave and Osbourne predict we would be on this by 2015 ? "

It was a question. I don`t know the answer. Does anyone ? Maybe they didn`t make a prediction, I don`t know hence the reason I asked.

The point I was trying to make is that the plan doesn`t appear to be working and many many people have and are suffering. NS is offering an alternative.

That is what I`m saying ( or trying to )

Are you backing Osbournes plan then ? As I said, I`m backing an alternative approach.

I

If Dave and Gideon have "failed" because they didn't cut the deficit as they said, then you think they should have cuit harder.

It can't be any other way, unless it's a success that they didn't cut harder (tho Nicola, who you quoted, said they're "failed").

Edited March 9, 2015 by eFestivals

[eFestivals]

Are you backing Osbournes plan then ? As I said, I`m backing an alternative approach.

I'm not backing the UK being robbed by the bankers, which you are, the SNP are, and the tories are.

Edited March 9, 2015 by eFestivals

[Comfy Bean]

I wasn't denying Scotland being a country - done some checking and it is a country - just not a sovereign state. But my point was, so what. Why should a country's choice matter anymore than a region's (the fact you have a footy team is sadly not quite enough)? At what point do you stop? Region? county? The fact is you don't even go that far, your arbitrary classification of country, is just that - it only matters what your sovereign country votes for.

Good I`m glad we cleared that up.

My bit about the footy was a joke. An admittedly rubbish joke at that

[Comfy Bean]

I'm not backing the UK being robbed by the bankers, which you are, the SNP are, and the tories are.

I`m confused about the bankers. I seem to remember you endlessly quoting them on another thread

I am not backing the UK being robbed by the bankers. That`s just being silly. We are where we are and I`m not sure NS is to blame for that. Perhaps it was that Salmond eh ?

Labour have signed up to back the Tory austerity plans. I prefer NS `s " vision ". It would be boring if we all agreed all the time

The " vision " NS is talking about IS " another way " .

[Comfy Bean]

If Dave and Gideon have "failed" because they didn't cut the deficit as they said, then you think they should have cuit harder.

It can't be any other way, unless it's a success that they didn't cut harder (tho Nicola, who you quoted, said they're "failed").

It can be "any other way " see my previous post.

[gary1979666]

So Texas and California are countries too? Normandy? Mercia? Wessex?

Each of those is 100% equal to Scotland in historical status and current status. Few Scots would regard them as countries.

It's definitely a country - but what does it actually mean? It's just another word to divide up the globe arbitrarily. It's definitely not a sovereign state, which is the classification that actually matters. Country is just as general a term as region, county, district, state, etc. The issue is why does this category hold higher power over the the others, like Comfy is claiming.

[Comfy Bean]

It's definitely a country - but what does it actually mean? It's just another word to divide up the globe arbitrarily. It's definitely not a sovereign state, which is the classification that actually matters. Country is just as general a term as region, county, district, state, etc. The issue is why does this category hold higher power over the the others, like Comfy is claiming.

I thought we were done with this. I`m " claiming " that Scotland is a Country. In my view it is. I respect anyones right to not recognise Scotland as a country. I also " claimed " that Merseyside is not a Country and that Wales is.

[kaosmark2]

I think you'll find many many no voters would still consider Scotland to be a country.

Doesn't change the irrelevance of "the government Scotland votes for" comments. If Scotland wanted to be sovereign and that to matter, there would have been a different result 6 months ago.

There is no good reason to distinguish Scotland from any other grouping of 59 seats in the UK.

[Comfy Bean]

Doesn't change the irrelevance of "the government Scotland votes for" comments. If Scotland wanted to be sovereign and that to matter, there would have been a different result 6 months ago.

There is no good reason to distinguish Scotland from any other grouping of 59 seats in the UK.

Perhaps you could point this out to Jim Murphy.

Edited March 9, 2015 by comfortablynumb1910

[Comfy Bean]

and to the Tories.......

[eFestivals]

I`m confused about the bankers. I seem to remember you endlessly quoting them on another thread

I am not backing the UK being robbed by the bankers. That`s just being silly. We are where we are and I`m not sure NS is to blame for that. Perhaps it was that Salmond eh ?

Labour have signed up to back the Tory austerity plans. I prefer NS `s " vision ". It would be boring if we all agreed all the time

The " vision " NS is talking about IS " another way " .

The bankers are getting about 10% of all the taxes we pay, for doing nothing at all.

That's 10% less of services for the poor, 10% less for healthcare, 10% less for education, 10% less in council grants, and 10% less in Scotland's 'block grant'. Etc, etc, etc.

Just think what every govt dept - or Scottish govt dept - could do with 10% extra money, today, tomorrow, forever!

The sooner we stop giving them that free money, the sooner WE benefit from OUR work.

And paying them back or not, we simply cannot afford to live beyond our means. Even Sturgeon is advocating 'austerity'. You know, cuts each and every year. She's just put a nice dressing on it, in the hope you don't notice that you're making your kids pick up your bills.

But we are were we are, so it can't all be paid back tomorrow - and no party is particularly talking about paying it back; the only talk is about how big we allow it to get before we finally accept we can't live beyond our means.

But at the very least, we need to stop gifting them money, as soon as possible. Our money is better spent on us than given away.

Salmond and Sturgeon have both consistently shown themselves to be aligned with the bankers interests, nuLabour's lax regulation wasn't lax enough for Alex, he wanted it even laxer, laxer than the tories. And Nicola is keen to let the bankers run away with even more of our cash, as she's made very clear - while still committing to make all of the same cuts in the end.

[eFestivals]

The issue is why does this category hold higher power over the the others, like Comfy is claiming.

because they dance to the nationalist tune as all nationalists do, without stopping to realise it's only a penny whistle.

[eFestivals]

I thought we were done with this. I`m " claiming " that Scotland is a Country. In my view it is. I respect anyones right to not recognise Scotland as a country. I also " claimed " that Merseyside is not a Country and that Wales is.

Wales has never been a "country", by any definition that you might choose.

[eFestivals]

Perhaps you could point this out to Jim Murphy.

can you hear a whooshing sound....?

[eFestivals]

and to the Tories.......

Yep. And they're doing that because it's effective in winning them votes, in case it's passing you by.

I pointed that out months ago. It's the factor which gives the tories the greatest chance of winning any first election, and which will 100% guarantee them a majority in any soon-after 2nd election (if there is one).

It's obviously passed you by that in the same way as many Scots sneeringly label all English as tories and (politically) reject them, the same can happen back at you.

And it really does get to mean that "vote SNP get tory" is all your own doing when you could otherwise ensure a Labour victory.

[Comfy Bean]

And it really does get to mean that "vote SNP get tory" is all your own doing when you could otherwise ensure a Labour victory.

When you say " your ", do you mean Scotland ?

[eFestivals]

When you say " your ", do you mean Scotland ?

it could apply just as equally to you as an individual, as you've said you intend to vote anti-Labour but want a Labour govt.

And if taken as 'Scotland', I was meaning via the seats returned by the voters of Scotland.

[Comfy Bean]

I pointed that out months ago. It's the factor which gives the tories the greatest chance of winning any first election, and which will 100% guarantee them a majority in any soon-after 2nd election (if there is one).

It's obviously passed you by that in the same way as many Scots sneeringly label all English as tories and (politically) reject them, the same can happen back at you.

.

Another view could be that the factor which gives the Tories their " greatest chance of winning " will come from people actually voting for the Tories

Would you mind posting up the bit where me ( or anyone else for that matter ) sneeringly labelled all English as Tories. I suspect your making bits up again.

[Comfy Bean]

it could apply just as equally to you as an individual, as you've said you intend to vote anti-Labour but want a Labour govt.

And if taken as 'Scotland', I was meaning via the seats returned by the voters of Scotland.

Have I ?

I thought we were agreeing that " There is no good reason to distinguish Scotland from any other grouping of 59 seats in the UK "

[eFestivals]

Another view could be that the factor which gives the Tories their " greatest chance of winning " will come from people actually voting for the Tories

people vote for one party or against one or more other parties. I think you've got a bit of an idea of these sorts of things.

And in the case of where this'll work for the tories, is to the people who didn't intend to vote tory but for who the SNP are more abhorent than the tories.

You might not like the existence of people like that, but those types exist in big enough numbers to make the campaign the tories are running worthwhile.

And, like it or not, that sort of anti-SNP position is 100% logical, given they're a party whose sole reason for existence is the break-up of the existing state. How can a party wanting the break-up of the UK work in the UK's interest within govt?

While I wouldn't go as far as voting tory myself, that last question concerns me, and I can only see one adequate way for Labour to deal with it ... else Labour are likely to find themselves about the same 'hated' in England as they are now in Scotland - and then all chances of a Labour govt will have disappeared, to have only tories left - as a result of SNP games and how much of a unthinking sucker you are for them.

Would you mind posting up the bit where me ( or anyone else for that matter ) sneeringly labelled all English as Tories. I suspect your making bits up again.

I could find endeless cases where you have comfy, tho where you've perhaps meant 'most' rather than 'all' within the gerneralisation you've used (much the same as you pulled me up on a few posts above).

But, I didn't say "you". I said "many Scots".

Have you never met any of those types? I've met thousands of them online.

[eFestivals]

Have I ?

I thought we were agreeing that " There is no good reason to distinguish Scotland from any other grouping of 59 seats in the UK "

so you don't intend to vote for "a Scottish party" but instead "a UK party"?

I'm pretty sure I've seen you clearly state you'll be voting SNP.

[Comfy Bean]

I could find endeless cases where you have comfy, tho where you've perhaps meant 'most' rather than 'all' within the gerneralisation you've used (much the same as you pulled me up on a few posts above).

One will do mate. Just one.