Football 16-17

[CRW5252]

10 hours ago, eFestivals said:

you see constant top 4 as a dip, when you'd have to be blind to not have noticed other teams come past Arsenal - rather than Arsenal dipping - due to owners who've been able to pump clubs with cash (and Spurs, who've got lucky via having a couple of excellent players).

And Utd have gone from being one of the best in the world to not even being in the top 20, too - and have *actually* fallen, too. 

If you have the answer with binning Wenger, you'll also have the answer of who will do better than him, and if it's so certain that there's better than him, you'll have a list of replacements too.

So let's see the list, and then if/when Wenger goes we can see whether you've really known your stuff.

First, Spurs haven't been lucky. What a ridiculous thing to say. 

Yes, Utd have fallen and since they have they have made changes to try to get back to where they were. Arsenal haven't. That is the difference. You are blind if you don't understand the frustration us Arsenal fans have. All the clubs around us have ambitions to win the league and make changes to attempt to do that. We make no changes and still Wenger/the board think it's going to change results.

Allegri, Tuchel, Low, Sampaoli, Simone, Koeman are all potential replacements.

10 hours ago, eFestivals said:

Your expectations aren't off the scale nuts, oh no.

 

You clearly didn't look at the context of that post. I was replying to a guy who asked what made us one of the best clubs in the world back in 2005. 

10 hours ago, eFestivals said:

Wenger did well at Arsenal so far so it's a fair bet to say he'll do well in the future...?

 

No he hasn't. The last few years have been shocking. 2 FA cups in 12 years. 

[CRW5252]

1 hour ago, TheGayTent said:

Alli is a walking red card 

A walking red card that bags a goal every other game from midfield

[eFestivals]

15 minutes ago, CRW5252 said:

A walking red card that bags a goal every other game from midfield

which is pretty lucky for a club to have a midfielder at that level.

Money didn't get one like that for Utd.

 

Edited April 12, 2017 by eFestivals

[CRW5252]

4 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

which is pretty lucky for a club to have a midfielder at that level.

Money didn't get one like that for Utd.

 

Their scouts picked him out and saw potential in him. By your logic, Wenger was lucky that Henry, Viera, Pires etc... ended up being so good. (I don't think this is the case but just showing you that what you are saying is ridiculous)

[pink_triangle]

54 minutes ago, CRW5252 said:

. All the clubs around us have ambitions to win the league and make changes to attempt to do that. We make no changes and still Wenger/the board think it's going to change results.

 

In which countries are the team with the 4th biggest wage budget competing regularly for league titles? Teams with the 4th biggest budget friendly finish 5th and below far more regularly than they finish 1st.

[pink_triangle]

32 minutes ago, CRW5252 said:

Their scouts picked him out and saw potential in him. By your logic, Wenger was lucky that Henry, Viera, Pires etc... ended up being so good. (I don't think this is the case but just showing you that what you are saying is ridiculous)

Unfortunately for Wenger I think there are more clubs competing for the Viera/pires of this time. There is also a big problem with the top 3 or 4 sides in world football hoarding players.

[Hugh Jass]

I've just won £550 thanks to Bet365 and their inplay offer. 50 notes @11/1 on the first goal in the Leicester match being a penalty.

That's Glastonbury paid for.

[pink_triangle]

12 minutes ago, Hugh Jass said:

I've just won £550 thanks to Bet365 and their inplay offer. 50 notes @11/1 on the first goal in the Leicester match being a penalty.

That's Glastonbury paid for.

I used to love that offer until they banned me!

[CRW5252]

1 hour ago, pink_triangle said:

In which countries are the team with the 4th biggest wage budget competing regularly for league titles? Teams with the 4th biggest budget friendly finish 5th and below far more regularly than they finish 1st.

What point are you trying to make? The teams around us like: Chelsea, Liverpool, Man U, Man C, Spurs have all either won the league or mounted a title challenge in recent years. We haven't. Not all of these teams are larger budgets than us. We aren't necessarily looking to regularly compete for titles but to at least have seasons where we do. At the moment, under Wenger, we are stale and their is zero chance of us competing for the title. 

[CRW5252]

27 minutes ago, Hugh Jass said:

I've just won £550 thanks to Bet365 and their inplay offer. 50 notes @11/1 on the first goal in the Leicester match being a penalty.

That's Glastonbury paid for.

£50 is one ballsy bet. It's on pretty long odds as well. Fair play though 

Edited April 12, 2017 by CRW5252

[pink_triangle]

2 minutes ago, CRW5252 said:

What point are you trying to make? The teams around us like: Chelsea, Liverpool, Man U, Man C, Spurs have all either won the league or mounted a title challenge in recent years.

However the only ones who have won the leagues are the ones that have the higher wage budget apart from a huge anomaly last season. 

Some of those other teams have had one off better seasons than Arsenal, although at the same time they have also had significantly worse. My point is that European football is dominated at a domestic level by teams with top 2/3 budgets and Arsenal don't have that. I would expect a team with the 4th biggest budget to be finishing 3rd-6th taking into account good and bad seasons. Arsenals finishes are slightly better than this.

[CRW5252]

3 minutes ago, pink_triangle said:

However the only ones who have won the leagues are the ones that have the higher wage budget apart from a huge anomaly last season. 

Some of those other teams have had one off better seasons than Arsenal, although at the same time they have also had significantly worse. My point is that European football is dominated at a domestic level by teams with top 2/3 budgets and Arsenal don't have that. I would expect a team with the 4th biggest budget to be finishing 3rd-6th taking into account good and bad seasons. Arsenals finishes are slightly better than this.

I think what you are saying is fair. At the end of the day your argument sounds more like you think we should be protesting against the board (or Wenger if you think he not spending the money that is available to him). This is also being done 

[pink_triangle]

1 minute ago, CRW5252 said:

I think what you are saying is fair. At the end of the day your argument sounds more like you think we should be protesting against the board (or Wenger if you think he not spending the money that is available to him). This is also being done 

My point is Arsenal are (generally) restricted to looking at players that Chelsea and the 2 Manchester clubs have passed on which obviously puts them at a disadvantage relative to those clubs.

My prediction is that Wengers successor will still have less money than those 3 clubs. I also believe in that climate he is far more likely to finish 6th than 1st.

[CRW5252]

1 minute ago, pink_triangle said:

My point is Arsenal are (generally) restricted to looking at players that Chelsea and the 2 Manchester clubs have passed on which obviously puts them at a disadvantage relative to those clubs.

My prediction is that Wengers successor will still have less money than those 3 clubs. I also believe in that climate he is far more likely to finish 6th than 1st.

That may well be true but we are stale under Wenger and I (and many other arsenal fans) are willing to take that risk. 

[Wooderson]

25 minutes ago, CRW5252 said:

What point are you trying to make? The teams around us like: Chelsea, Liverpool, Man U, Man C, Spurs have all either won the league or mounted a title challenge in recent years. We haven't. Not all of these teams are larger budgets than us. We aren't necessarily looking to regularly compete for titles but to at least have seasons where we do. At the moment, under Wenger, we are stale and their is zero chance of us competing for the title. 

Arsenal had a super chance last year.

[CRW5252]

1 minute ago, Wooderson said:

Arsenal had a super chance last year.

We did, but like always we weren't competing for the title by the end of last season

[pink_triangle]

That's a pretty good result for Leicester.

[CRW5252]

1 minute ago, pink_triangle said:

That's a pretty good result for Leicester.

If Leicester get the first goal next week they have a great chance 

[Wooderson]

Madrid police took it easy. Surprising.

[pink_triangle]

16 minutes ago, CRW5252 said:

If Leicester get the first goal next week they have a great chance 

The second legs are looking well poised, although I can't see juventus imploding like psg.

[mjsell]

Good result for Leicester, especially considering there were spells of the game they were playing against 12. 

30 minutes ago, pink_triangle said:

I would expect a team with the 4th biggest budget to be finishing 3rd-6th taking into account good and bad seasons. Arsenals finishes are slightly better than this.

This Arsenal debate has a few similarities to those regarding fans of mid-table/lower half teams accepting relegation in return for an FA Cup win. 

I am someone that hugely respects Arsene as manager, I think he has been unrivalled in what he has achieved since he has been managing in the prem. But funnily enough it is his consistency at achieving this average (or slightly above) you mention year in year out which has eventually caught up with him. Fans are bored. And I get the whole 'grass is not always greener' argument, as well as those fans at clubs that would give a limb to be in arsenals position. But no matter what team you support, repetition of results gets boring. Whether you consistently finish 16th in the prem every year, or 12th in league 2, if it repeats for long enough fans will get bored.

Arsenal have now had the same season repeated for a good few years. I know we finished second last year but that wasn't because of us, more down to Spurs collapsing, we were never in a title race from March onwards. 

I hope that Wenger gets the respect he deserves, but understand the feelings of some fans (not the dickheads that go over the top), especially when you consider these fans do not feel change would be forthcoming without their intervention.

[pink_triangle]

1 minute ago, mjsell said:

 But no matter what team you support, repetition of results gets boring. Whether you consistently finish 16th in the prem every year, or 12th in league 2, if it repeats for long enough fans will get bored.

 

Unless you win the league every season of course! Maybe I'm wrong but I get the impression fans of the likes of Stoke, wba and palace would quite happily finish mid table forever.

[TheGayTent]

4 hours ago, CRW5252 said:

A walking red card that bags a goal every other game from midfield

Every other game he's eligible for?

[Hugh Jass]

1 hour ago, CRW5252 said:

£50 is one ballsy bet. It's on pretty long odds as well. Fair play though 

It's part of an offer where you bet £50 and get a free £50 bet. If you lay it off right the most you ever lose is a couple of quid if it doesn’t win.

[TheGayTent]

23 minutes ago, pink_triangle said:

Unless you win the league every season of course! Maybe I'm wrong but I get the impression fans of the likes of Stoke, wba and palace would quite happily finish mid table forever.

A relegation scrap is far more exciting than mid table mediocrity