Football 16-17

[The Nal]

20 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

(that might seem like a joke post, but it's actually true!)

Its not.

[eFestivals]

Just now, The Nal said:

Its not.

you didn't even watch the match! (I remember).

If Pogba had played decently rather than looked like a League Two player - which he did - who know what might have been different?

Fact is that fergie wouldn't give him games - cos he looked like a league two player when he did - so Pogba buggered off.

[pink_triangle]

Man Utd played some good football under Fergie, I think only the most anti united football fan will admit that.

When you consider that the football spurs are currently playing is hyped to the moon by our media. Ferries united teams generally hit those levels consistently.

[The Nal]

2 hours ago, big__phil said:

Yeah, a good result for Arsenal and Liverpool last night. We REALLY could do with the win on Sunday, but I can't see us getting the result. Maybe a draw, but you never know I guess.

Weekend fixtures:

Southampton 15:00 Hull

Stoke 15:00 West Ham

Sunderland 15:00 Bournemouth

West Brom 15:00 Leicester

Crystal Palace 17:30 Burnley

Sunday 30 April

Man Utd 12:00 Swansea

Everton 14:05 Chelsea

Middlesbrough 14:05 Man City

Spurs 16:30 Arsenal

Monday 01 May

Watford 20:00 Liverpool

Away games for three of the four teams chasing Champs League. Although Utd have a pretty easy looking game this weekend, they then have to go down to The Emirates, Shite Hart Lane and St Mary's, before Palace at home on the last game of the season. That's not an easy run, especially with Europa League games mid week as well. Arsenal have a tricky old run as well, whereas Liverpool's doesn't look too bad (although these are often the games they struggle with).

Squeaky bum time.

Indeed. Huge games on Sunday. Will be very interesting to see what happens if Chelsea don't win and Spurs playing right after. Arsenal need a result too.

9 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

- cos he looked like a league two player when he did - so Pogba buggered off.

Agree with that but Fergie wasn't happy that he left.

Last thing about the transition at Utd this season. We've seen fuck all of Woodward this year. A mouth piece for the last few seasons. Hes obviously been told to shut the fuck up. By someone. 

Edited April 28, 2017 by The Nal

[eFestivals]

13 minutes ago, pink_triangle said:

Man Utd played some good football under Fergie, I think only the most anti united football fan will admit that.

They did. But 'some' rather than 'the majority'. 

As a team (and over his whole time, stuff like skippy caused exceptions at points) his teams were much more about putting in the hard work to get the result than they were about displays of skill. I'm sure plenty of those players could have displayed more skill but that's not how he wanted them to play and how he had them play was mighty effective - just not very pretty most of the time.

The phrase 'winning ugly' was invented for Utd.

[eFestivals]

20 minutes ago, The Nal said:

Agree with that but Fergie wasn't happy that he left.

yeah, I know ... but given that fergie didn't actually want to play him (which would have kept him), I suspect fergie's unhappiness was waaaay more to do with taking offence at a player quitting when a new contract was on offer as it was any belief in Pogba being the future-exceptional player many consider him to be now.

[ThomThomDrum]

1 hour ago, The Nal said:

 Mourinho is achieving exactly the realistic expectations the club expected at the start of the season. This season was always about steadying the ship. 

Lets not forget now that many were seeing them winning/challenging for the league this season after Moany came in and also after all that money he spunked about the place. 3/1 where the odds at one time (2nd favs behind Citeh). A handful of folk on here too where talking them up as such.

At the start of the season I witnessed a giddiness from Utd fans about their prospects this season (maybe they were not all being "realistic" as you put it), but where Utd and Moany are now is a long way of where those giddy expections suggested Utd would be at this point of the season

Edited April 28, 2017 by ThomThomDrum

[The Nal]

14 minutes ago, ThomThomDrum said:

Lets not forget now that many were seeing them winning/challenging for the league this season after Moany came in and also after all that money he spunked about the place. 3/1 where the odds at one time (2nd favs behind Citeh). A handful of folk on here too where talking them up as such.

At the start of the season I witnessed a giddiness from Utd fans about their prospects this season (maybe they were not all being "realistic" as you put it), but where Utd and Moany are now is a long way of where those giddy expections suggested Utd would be at this point of the season

Yeah and thats because of one bad period really. Since the 1-1- with Everton on December 4th its been title challenging form. Very solid base for next season regardless of what happens over the next 4 weeks. 

Since December 4th

P18
W12
D6
L0
F31
A8
Pts 42 (2.33 Pts/game)

Edited April 28, 2017 by The Nal

[thetime]

17 minutes ago, ThomThomDrum said:

Lets not forget now that many were seeing them winning/challenging for the league this season after Moany came in and also after all that money he spunked about the place. 3/1 where the odds at one time (2nd favs behind Citeh). A handful of folk on here too where talking them up as such.

At the start of the season I witnessed a giddiness from Utd fans about their prospects this season (maybe they were not all being "realistic" as you put it), but where Utd and Moany are now is a long way of where those giddy expections suggested Utd would be at this point of the season

It's all about how you judge success really I would say. At the end of the season Utd could end up with 2 trophies and either a top 4 finish or champions league through europa.

you will have spurs top 4 finish but no trophies, city, arsenal and Liverpool top 4 or no top 4 finish and no trophies. 

So I would say a trophy or 2 and champions league qualification would be a successful season for Jose in his 1st season.

Edited April 28, 2017 by thetime

[mjsell]

29 minutes ago, thetime said:

It's all about how you judge success really I would say. At the end of the season Utd could end up with 2 trophies and either a top 4 finish or champions league through europa.

you will have spurs top 4 finish but no trophies, city, arsenal and Liverpool top 4 or no top 4 finish and no trophies. 

So I would say a trophy or 2 and champions league qualification would be a successful season for Jose in his 1st season.

Oi. We havent lost the FA Cup final yet.

[thetime]

10 minutes ago, mjsell said:

Oi. We havent lost the FA Cup final yet.

Quite strange the 2 clubs most criticised, are the clubs that could end the season with  trophies.

[The Nal]

5 minutes ago, thetime said:

Quite strange the 2 clubs most criticised, are the clubs that could end the season with  trophies.

I'm amazed that City have got such an easy time. 

Klopp doesn't win trophies so no surprise there. 

[eFestivals]

Just now, thetime said:

Quite strange the 2 clubs most criticised, are the clubs that could end the season with  trophies.

they're shooting from different places, with different targets and different resources to reach those targets, tho.

If Liverpool fail to make top four, plenty will be mightily pissed off, but they didn't make a big financial commitment in trying to get there, and in context of their squad and the teams around them it wouldn't be an under-performance. Same couldn't really be said for Utd.

[eFestivals]

2 minutes ago, The Nal said:

I'm amazed that City have got such an easy time. 

yep, me too .... but to be fair to Pep perhaps he's discovered that footie isn't the same everywhere, and it'll be next season before he shows if he's really any good (or merely inherited can't lose teams).

 

2 minutes ago, The Nal said:

Klopp doesn't win trophies so no surprise there. 

 ... he's not worth having in your mind just like no one expected more from Moaniho this season.

There's no way that squad was going to challenge on all fronts this season and he knew it, which is why he played kids.

It'll be a fuck up if he doesn't make top four because of how they were going before xmas, but top four is all he needs to do for it to be considered a very good season in the context of where they were.

[The Nal]

2 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

 ... he's not worth having in your mind just like no one expected more from Moaniho this season.

There's no way that squad was going to challenge on all fronts this season and he knew it, which is why he played kids.

It'll be a fuck up if he doesn't make top four because of how they were going before xmas, but top four is all he needs to do for it to be considered a very good season in the context of where they were.

Possibly but they had a head start - new managers at Chelsea, Utd and City - and were going for the league at one stage. He lost 2 finals last season aswell remember. Needs to start coming up with the good now. Starting with signing a few fucking players in the summer. 

[eFestivals]

1 minute ago, The Nal said:

Possibly but they had a head start - new managers at Chelsea, Utd and City - and were going for the league at one stage. He lost 2 finals last season aswell remember. Needs to start coming up with the good now. Starting with signing a few fucking players in the summer. 

Yep, there's reasons to think he should be doing better ... but that thin squad! Ouch! That's made it very tough (tho it might have worked out a bit better in other circumstances).

I'm wondering if the new stand played a part in not spending any money in the summer. If it did, I guess he'll have probably known the score when he took over. I've not heard him complain about not having money to spend either, tho I might have missed it.

 

[thetime]

3 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

Yep, there's reasons to think he should be doing better ... but that thin squad! Ouch! That's made it very tough (tho it might have worked out a bit better in other circumstances).

I'm wondering if the new stand played a part in not spending any money in the summer. If it did, I guess he'll have probably known the score when he took over. I've not heard him complain about not having money to spend either, tho I might have missed it.

 

No Europe though, lots of free weeks. How many will he need to sign squad wise to compete? 7 or 8 quality signings?

[eFestivals]

36 minutes ago, thetime said:

No Europe though, lots of free weeks. How many will he need to sign squad wise to compete? 7 or 8 quality signings?

at least - tho whether the aim would be to really try and compete, who knows?

Me, I reckon it would be foolish to try and run before you can walk, and that 7 or 8 quality players are probably needed to remain in the top 4 and make a reasonable domestic cup challenge, before Europe comes into it. 

[The Nal]

Fosu-Mensah injured now. Out for the season. 

Mourinho struggling to get 14 outfield players for a squad at the weekend. 

[eFestivals]

20 minutes ago, The Nal said:

Fosu-Mensah injured now. Out for the season. 

Mourinho struggling to get 14 outfield players for a squad at the weekend. 

it's not only liverpool's season that can be fucked up by injuries.

[WS_Jack_III]

Long overdue that for Sunderland. Not just saying it because I'm a  Newcastle fan, they've been hanging on for years. Didn't have 6 points from us this season.

 

What do others think?

[lost]

18 minutes ago, WS_Jack_III said:

Long overdue that for Sunderland. Not just saying it because I'm a  Newcastle fan, they've been hanging on for years. Didn't have 6 points from us this season.

 

What do others think?

Net debts gone from £140m to £120m this year I believe so they have made savings. Its probably whats put them down though.

I don't know enough about the parachute payments to know if it gives them enough financial stability to build on and get back up, i would say probably not. Its obviously great from a personal competition view when one of the bigger clubs goes down as it makes things a bit easier, but equally the league can get a bit boring outside the top 6 and so it probably needs more of those 40k + teams back in there.. A Newcastle, Leeds, Villa or Sunderland.

[WS_Jack_III]

4 minutes ago, lost said:

Net debts gone from £140m to £120m this year I believe so they have made savings. Its probably whats put them down though.

I don't know enough about the parachute payments to know if it gives them enough financial stability to build on and get back up, i would say probably not. Its obviously great from a personal competition view when one of the bigger clubs goes down as it makes things a bit easier, but equally the league can get a bit boring outside the top 6 and so it probably needs more of those 40k + teams back in there.. A Newcastle, Leeds, Villa or Sunderland.

It seems most people don't know about PP. I believe the 40m Newcastle would have received is now being divided up between the rest of the Champ teams because they have gone straight back up.

 

I don't quite know how it works though, i think you get 80m plus spread across 3 season.

[kaosmark2]

Big thing about coping with relegation is the wage bill. Sunderland have an aging squad, so if they've got people on 60k contracts with 1-2 years left they're fucked. If a fair whack are expiring this season or they can shift a lot of players on they may be able to rebuild.

You get a proportion of the Prem's current TV rights each year, 55% in the first year. It was prob £40-£35-£10m for Newc/Villa but I'm not that sure. And yeah, the money Newcastle would have got next 2 seasons will be spread between the other teams, although I don't know if it increases the PP for relegated clubs, or if it's spread more widely.

Also, if a club had only been in the Prem one season, they'll only get 2 years of PP, so Middlesborough will feel a bit hard done by on that front.

[pink_triangle]

I would be happy if they just got rid of the parachute payments.