Football 16-17

[zahidf]

25 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

do you think the other players don't know who (some of) the gay ones are?

Depends how far in the closet they are. 

[eFestivals]

8 minutes ago, zahidf said:

Depends how far in the closet they are. 

I'm sure some go to great efforts to stay in the closet, but I also know that some don't and are known to other players, managers - and the media too - as gay.

Seemingly, within the walls of the game it's no less acceptable than it is within the country. It's just the bit in the middle, the fans, where the block is.

Whether the media are playing nicely or football has the by them balls I'm not entirely sure, tho I heard of a story about a decade ago where a paper was supposedly about to out a player, which supposedly had Wenger (as a senior respected, not the player's manager) phone up that paper and explain to them how they'd need a new back section if they went ahead, and they backed down. Whether that's true or not tho I've no idea.

I wouldn't want a paper to out a player, but I sort of wonder if that might actually be the best solution, to get past the bit where things are stuck.

Edited November 23, 2016 by eFestivals

[kaosmark2]

2 hours ago, eFestivals said:

I know of one (very well known, played for England) player who wanted to come out but who was talked out of it by his club, who told him they wouldn't support him if he did. That was less than a decade ago, and while I wouldn't be surprised if clubs still tell players not to do it, I think I would be surprised if they're still threatening to cut players loose if they did.

If I remember rightly, you've named that club in the past.

(I don't expect you to if I'm wrong though, not trying to pressure here).

[eFestivals]

48 minutes ago, kaosmark2 said:

If I remember rightly, you've named that club in the past.

(I don't expect you to if I'm wrong though, not trying to pressure here).

i've certainly said it in a way the club would be clear, even if I didn't explicitly name them (I can't remember exactly what I wrote).

I'm not sure if I ever mentioned England previously tho, so it's probably best left with nothing more said else things start to get obvious.

[grumpyhack]

FIFA now getting stroppy because some the fans in Cardiff were wearing and displaying poppies at the match.  How out of touch can you get?

[eFestivals]

7 hours ago, grumpyhack said:

FIFA now getting stroppy because some the fans in Cardiff were wearing and displaying poppies at the match.  How out of touch can you get?

It's a political. FIFA rightly bans the political.

All the same I'm surprised they're pursuing this.

[zahidf]

1 minute ago, eFestivals said:

It's a political. FIFA rightly bans the political.

All the same I'm surprised they're pursuing this.

Players maybe. Saying that the club has to stop fans from wearing them is tone deaf

[eFestivals]

24 minutes ago, zahidf said:

Players maybe. Saying that the club has to stop fans from wearing them is tone deaf

It's FIFA being 100% consistent. The political is not to be part of football, at least within what FIFA are directly regulating (as is the case with WC qualies)

While with an introspective view it's a commemoration of the war dead, for someone on the other side of a war it's honouring the people who killed their countrymen. If you can't see the scope for political offence within that, you need some better political education.

(I made a error with a post a few weeks back, where I suggested stuff like this could be done if it was off the field of play. I should have thought it thru better).

FIFA have yet to take any action towards England/Scotland, so it'll be interesting to see what approach they take. Consistency should see an even-handed approach, tho there's perhaps room for a greater forgiveness because it's difficult to see how it could ever be regarded as a provocation towards 'the other side' when both teams and supporters were commemorating the same thing for identical reasons.

The Irish recently had their wrists slapped by FIFA for a 1916 Easter Rising thing on their shirts. I think it was for a match against Serbia where I doubt any Serbian gave much of a fuck, tho if they'd been playing England in that match it starts to take on some very different aspects.

If FIFA start to allow it, they end up either allowing deliberate provokations, or they have to start ruling which of such things might be regarded as 'good' or 'bad' - and both end up having bigger issues than if they take a straightforwards view that none of it is allowable.

I think the Dutch once got away with their fans singing for their bicycles back from the Germans and the Germans took it on the chin, but really that sort of thing is going too far (if amusing). If we never put the past behind us we're into new escalations.

[big__phil]

Well Arsenal somehow got a point out of last night. A poor performance all in all, and you have to question the team selection to a certain degree (although I can't imagine the players were told to stand off their midfielders that much in the first half, so they also need to take some of the blame).

That's three games in a row now where we haven't played well, and still managed a draw. It'll start costing us soon enough, so we need to find the combinations where things start clicking again. Did you watch it @mjsell?

Anyone watch the City game? How was that?

[mjsell]

1 hour ago, big__phil said:

Well Arsenal somehow got a point out of last night. A poor performance all in all, and you have to question the team selection to a certain degree (although I can't imagine the players were told to stand off their midfielders that much in the first half, so they also need to take some of the blame).

That's three games in a row now where we haven't played well, and still managed a draw. It'll start costing us soon enough, so we need to find the combinations where things start clicking again. Did you watch it @mjsell?

Anyone watch the City game? How was that?

Yeah was at the game last night, wasnt great but equally was a better showing than at OT at the weekend, certainly a few positives but a lot to improve upon.

Don't think team selection was that much of an issue (personally would have had a couple of changes but in general I understood Arsene's decisions), the issue, like you said, was the lack of pressure on the ball. Whenever we did exert a bit of a press in their half we looked at our most dangerous - the 10 minute spell after half time we must have won the ball back more times than the complete rest of the game. But yeah in general it felt like we just had too many players out of form, not at full fitness and not working hard enough.

Mustafi has got to take the blame for their first goal, that was shoddy defending - and he was a bit all over the place all night (great in the air mind) - and it looked like Sanchez was meeting both Carl Jenkinson and the right hand side of a pitch for the first time in his life last night.

It didnt help that I was sitting next to THE worst kind of Arsenal fans, I like to think I'm a fairly positive fan, especially whilst the game is on, and keep any annoyances to post-game discussions. But these guys (and a huge percentage of the Emirates) seem to take pleasure in moaning and complaining no matter what the situation (even when 2-1 up he was saying the most idiotic things) - I don't know how he gets through life (or why he goes to football matches). I love Arsenal and will support them wholeheartedly but fuck me I understand why people would hate some of our fans.

 

[The Nal]

I see Leagueless has retired. In fairness to him, hes provided us with so many great moments over the years.

Edited November 24, 2016 by The Nal

[eFestivals]

I see it's the European greats playing tonight.

 

[big__phil]

1 hour ago, mjsell said:

Don't think team selection was that much of an issue...

Mustafi has got to take the blame for their first goal...

It didnt help that I was sitting next to THE worst kind of Arsenal fans...

 

Agree with most of your first paragraph, but I don't understand why Xhaka and Walcott didn't start. Against a PSG team with their midfield three (Veratti is some player by the way - he could walk into any team in the Prem) we needed someone who could pass accurately between the lines to Ozil. For all of Coquelin and Ramsey's qualities, they aren't going to do that. That lack of forward passing basically takes Ozil out of the game, and forced us wide. Unfortunately Jenkinson looked like a scared little boy at times, and offered  precious little down the right. Down the left Gibbs needed help, which Iwobi (drifting inside) didn't provide. Full back is a very important position for us, and having both the second choices playing blunted our offensive play.

You're right about Mustafi's defending for the first, but the amount of time and space Veratti had to play the pass was ridiculous. So so poor, and if you give anyone enough time to play the pass you're going to get undone sooner or later.

Frankly, if Cavani should have had a hatrick last night, and the only reason we didn't lose is because Ospina must his family under ransom. That 'chip' was mighty funny though.

Shame to hear about the fans, some of them at The Emirates (I don't manage to get down there more than a few times a year now) can be very negative. As you say, it must be pretty grim living your days like that.

Glad you had a good night though, and let's hope we can start playing proper football again soon. And if not, it's December next week!

[grumpyhack]

7 hours ago, eFestivals said:

It's a political. FIFA rightly bans the political.

All the same I'm surprised they're pursuing this.

Agreed on the political.  That's why both teams wore black armbands with no emblems - to avoid the political.  However they are being threatened with punishment because some fans came in wearing poppies.  What were they to do - stop everyone at the turnstile who was wearing a poppy and tell them to take it off?

[eFestivals]

1 minute ago, grumpyhack said:

Agreed on the political.  That's why both teams wore black armbands with no emblems - to avoid the political.  However they are being threatened with punishment because some fans came in wearing poppies.  What were they to do - stop everyone at the turnstile who was wearing a poppy and tell them to take it off?

It wasn't just fans wearing poppies, it was an officially orchestrated thing, with cards on seats for the fans to hold up, that made a poppy.

I think, anyway.

[TheSilence]

Worrying run of games for us to lead us in to New Year. 

Saints, Watford and Leicester away and United, Arsenal, Liverpool at home.

Wouldn't be surprised if we've sloped way down the table come January . 

[Hugh Jass]

5 hours ago, mjsell said:

It didnt help that I was sitting next to THE worst kind of Arsenal fans, I like to think I'm a fairly positive fan, especially whilst the game is on, and keep any annoyances to post-game discussions. But these guys (and a huge percentage of the Emirates) seem to take pleasure in moaning and complaining no matter what the situation (even when 2-1 up he was saying the most idiotic things) - I don't know how he gets through life (or why he goes to football matches). I love Arsenal and will support them wholeheartedly but fuck me I understand why people would hate some of our fans.

 

I don't think it's just Arsenal fans, I've come to the conclusion that a large portion of modern football fans are utter twats. I hear it at the Hawthorns all the time, people turn up and take great pleasure at getting on the players' backs at the first possible opportunity. First misplaced pass it starts "fucking hell McLean, yam shit!" and usually involves having a pop at Pulis regardless of how we are actually doing. You can even tell who has prepared their comments before coming as they'll start slating players who aren't even playing. Some fans aren't happy unless they are moaning. I blame the 24hourskysportsnewsinstantsuccessnow! culture that has risen, fans demand success and feel entitled.

I have mates who support United, Villa, Spurs, Blackburn, Forest and Peterborough and they all say the same things about their fans.

[TheSilence]

3 minutes ago, Hugh Jass said:

I don't think it's just Arsenal fans, I've come to the conclusion that a large portion of modern football fans are utter twats. I hear it at the Hawthorns all the time, people turn up and take great pleasure at getting on the players' backs at the first possible opportunity. First misplaced pass it starts "fucking hell McLean, yam shit!" and usually involves having a pop at Pulis regardless of how we are actually doing. You can even tell who has prepared their comments before coming as they'll start slating players who aren't even playing. Some fans aren't happy unless they are moaning. I blame the 24hourskysportsnewsinstantsuccessnow! culture that has risen, fans demand success and feel entitled.

I have mates who support United, Villa, Spurs, Blackburn, Forest and Peterborough and they all say the same things about their fans.

Yep. Can say its the same at Goodison too. People have screamed "Fuck off Barkley" before hes even had a touch of the ball. I don't half feel sorry for him. Lukaku gets an awful lot of stick too, which is ridiculous considering he is by far our best player. 

[kaosmark2]

2 hours ago, Hugh Jass said:

I don't think it's just Arsenal fans, I've come to the conclusion that a large portion of modern football fans are utter twats. I hear it at the Hawthorns all the time, people turn up and take great pleasure at getting on the players' backs at the first possible opportunity. First misplaced pass it starts "fucking hell McLean, yam shit!" and usually involves having a pop at Pulis regardless of how we are actually doing. You can even tell who has prepared their comments before coming as they'll start slating players who aren't even playing. Some fans aren't happy unless they are moaning. I blame the 24hourskysportsnewsinstantsuccessnow! culture that has risen, fans demand success and feel entitled.

I have mates who support United, Villa, Spurs, Blackburn, Forest and Peterborough and they all say the same things about their fans.

It's definitely all fans. I've been in home crowds for over a dozen teams in this country and in virtually all of them someone has had a go at their own team regardless of score/situation. Seemed worse in the Prem to me than other leagues but not by a huge margin.

The demand for instant success really irks me. No team//fan/player/manager/etc. has any right to success. There are ingredients that help get it (mainly money), but expecting anything seems ridiculous.

[big__phil]

Thoughts on the weekend's Prem fixtures? Obviously Chelsea v Spurs will get a lot of attention, but Swansea v Palace looks huge. A win for Swansea will take them two points from safety, but if they lose things will look very bleak, especially if Hull win at home against West Brom.

On a personal note, my Fantasy Football team is in utter disarray after a dismal 29 point weekend last time. How's everyone else doing, and what are your teams called? You can find Obi Wan Kenobi Nil in 21st, and dropping like a stone.

[TheGayTent]

3 minutes ago, big__phil said:

Thoughts on the weekend's Prem fixtures? 

Looks like easy wins for Leicester, Liverpool, and West Ham for me. 

[TheGayTent]

4 minutes ago, big__phil said:

On a personal note, my Fantasy Football team is in utter disarray after a dismal 29 point weekend last time. How's everyone else doing, and what are your teams called? You can find Obi Wan Kenobi Nil in 21st, and dropping like a stone.

People still play after August??

[big__phil]

8 minutes ago, TheGayTent said:

Looks like easy wins for Leicester, Liverpool, and West Ham for me. 

Nice. Agree with the first two, although the slight hope for Sunderland is if they can somehow get quick ball to Defoe who's still banging them for fun, despite playing with a load of Sunday League players. 3 in 3 is good in any team, and Moyes might have stumbled on something with Defoe and Anichebe playing as a pair. Is he brave enough to do it at Anfield?

Edited November 25, 2016 by big__phil

[Gucci Piggy]

13 minutes ago, big__phil said:

On a personal note, my Fantasy Football team is in utter disarray after a dismal 29 point weekend last time. How's everyone else doing, and what are your teams called? You can find Obi Wan Kenobi Nil in 21st, and dropping like a stone.

Didn't have an amazing week but I'm third in the eFests league (Arouna Droné). Finally brought in a Chelsea defender and Continho last night so let's watch their form completely die off now

[mjsell]

5 hours ago, TheGayTent said:

People still play after August??

I've probably said it before in here but if you haven't tried it already draft fantasy football with head to head matches each week with mates is 100 times better and keeps you going for the whole season. Makes most PL games have something riding on them as well.