US Presidential Election 2016

[lost]

4 minutes ago, pink_triangle said:

Also you could argue how conservative Trump really is. He certainly isnt seen by many republicans as being very conservative and has supported both parties in the past.

Indeed. His winning speech was all about stimulus via infrastructure projects. it could of almost come from John Mcdonnell

[pink_triangle]

5 minutes ago, zahidf said:

well 2. and possibly 3. We have to assume he will do what he promised. Its what the GOP wants to do as well!

The majoirty of republican senators want to build a wall (and pay for it), ban muslims and lock up Hillary Clinton.  Im not convinced you are right.  3 of course is just my prediction.

[kaosmark2]

7 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

but they're not.

Just like 'the left', they don't have a plan either, but they're not screaming that no one has a plan or that any suggested plan is the wrong plan, and so revealing their own inadequacies.

They might have disagreements about what they'd like out of brexit, but they're pragmatic enough to accept the UK voted out and the deal they might want isn't in just-their control - and so will go along with what it brings.

I'm taking about the resignations, the internal criticisms of liz truss, the lack of support for may. The reaction to the courts ' judgement over a50 has been incredibly divided. A strong opposition could have used that. 

[zahidf]

1 minute ago, pink_triangle said:

The majoirty of republican senators want to build a wall (and pay for it), ban muslims and lock up Hillary Clinton.  Im not convinced you are right.  3 of course is just my prediction.

see above. There are a lot of common ground with the GOP and Trump. And of course, he will threathen those who oppose him like he did in the campaign.

 

Altough much like with leave voters, i guess i have to pretend Trump voters arent racist morons as well?

[pink_triangle]

2 minutes ago, zahidf said:

see above. There are a lot of common ground with the GOP and Trump. And of course, he will threathen those who oppose him like he did in the campaign.

 

If there was so much common ground why did hardly any of the GOP politicians endorse him initially and even many didnt support him once he had been nominated as the candidate. I cant remember a candidate with less common ground with his colleagues

[eFestivals]

8 minutes ago, zahidf said:

On trade and economics maybe. Not om climate change, health care, minority rights or abortion

Even on those the Republicans aren't one view.

Where Trump is most likely to have an effect is via his nomination for supreme court judges, which then might impact into what individual states might do on stuff like abortion.

 

8 minutes ago, zahidf said:

also, only he has the Nuke codes

and that's more worrying than Bush having Cheny as his sidekick because....?

Just because some things might not be the same as they were doesn't get to mean everything becomes the polar opposite.

In 4 years time will you revisit your post here and admit that you were a screaming unthinking banshee at this time?

 

[zahidf]

Just now, pink_triangle said:

If there was so much common ground why did hardly any of the GOP politicians endorse him initially and even many didnt support him once he had been nominated as the candidate. I cant remember a candidate with less common ground with his colleagues

because they didnt think he would win. Now he has, they will jump back on the Trump train.

 

This is the international rise and mainstreamining of the far right. We should all be very scared.

[russycarps]

12 minutes ago, zahidf said:

 

also, only he has the Nuke codes

come off it....why would donald trump have any interest in a nuclear war?

he's a bully and a nasty shit, but this is absurd.

 

[zahidf]

Just now, eFestivals said:

Even on those the Republicans aren't one view.

Where Trump is most likely to have an effect is via his nomination for supreme court judges, which then might impact into what individual states might do on stuff like abortion.

 

and that's more worrying than Bush having Cheny as his sidekick because....?

Just because some things might not be the same as they were doesn't get to mean everything becomes the polar opposite.

In 4 years time will you revisit your post here and admit that you were a screaming unthinking banshee at this time?

 

I hope i will be around to do so!

The guy is irrational and crazy. Despite hating Bush, he wasnt nuts!

[zahidf]

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/nov/09/donald-trump-us-president-nightmare?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

People will say that all that was just talk. But they said that throughout the campaign, insisting that Trump would “pivot” to a more moderate stance, that he would become more “presidential”. He never did. And surely he will see this victory as proof that he was always right, that his instincts are perfect and never to be challenged. There is no reason for him to moderate at all. The office of Thomas Jefferson, Abraham Lincoln, Franklin Roosevelt and John F Kennedy is now his playpen. He can do what he likes.

Edited November 9, 2016 by zahidf

[lost]

Bush was religious and believes he's going to a better place when he dies. Something I noticed about Trump he didn't end his victory speech with God bless America. I've got it in my head that normally happens?

[eFestivals]

7 minutes ago, zahidf said:

Altough much like with leave voters, i guess i have to pretend Trump voters arent racist morons as well?

Let's go with your opinion that all brexit voters are racists for a moment.

That gets to mean that this country had 52% racists before the vote and has 52% racists afterwards.

What can't you recognise about nothing having changed that makes you spout stuff now that you didn't before 23rd June?

Meanwhile, I pointed out a long time ago that Trump's popularity iss about how much Clinton is hated.

[eFestivals]

4 minutes ago, zahidf said:

This is the international rise and mainstreamining of the far right. We should all be very scared.

I don't disagree with the general idea of of the first bit.

I don't even disagree with the idea that we need to be wary.

But I do disagree with the idea that we should be scared now when as yet there's nothing to be scared of ... cos if morons like you keep on crying wolf, guess what happens when there's really something to be scared about...?

It's the screamers like you who've got us here in the first place. How much more do you want to contribute to your worst fears coming true...?

 

[zahidf]

Just now, eFestivals said:

I don't disagree with the general idea of of the first bit.

I don't even disagree with the idea that we need to be wary.

But I do disagree with the idea that we should be scared now when as yet there's nothing to be scared of ... cos if morons like you keep on crying wolf, guess what happens when there's really something to be scared about...?

It's the screamers like you who've got us here in the first place. How much more do you want to contribute to your worst fears coming true...?

 

Oh come one. We should be scared when they start rounding people up? (Like Trump's deportation plans?) The words of LEAVERS like Farage and Trump are enough to terrify people. People have been saying Trump will pivot for months. He hasnt and he wont.

[eFestivals]

2 minutes ago, zahidf said:

Oh come one. We should be scared when they start rounding people up? (Like Trump's deportation plans?) The words of LEAVERS like Farage and Trump are enough to terrify people. People have been saying Trump will pivot for months. He hasnt and he wont.

Trump's plans to deport illegals? This country has been deporting illegals since the year dot. It doesn't make this country governed by Hitler. It's normal to 'round up' lawbreakers.

Get back to me if you're talking about something else and when it actually happens. 

But if it does happen, everyone will have stopped listening to those like you long before, so you're merely ensuring that you'll be powerless to stop it.

[zahidf]

2 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

Trump's plans to deport illegals? This country has been deporting illegals since the year dot. It doesn't make this country governed by Hitler. It's normal to 'round up' lawbreakers.

Get back to me if you're talking about something else and when it actually happens. 

But if it does happen, everyone will have stopped listening to those like you long before, so you're merely ensuring that you'll be powerless to stop it.

the guardian article up above points it out better than i can

[alien]

The thing that really matters on a macro level is Trump's stance on climate change. The scariest thing about Trump's election is what isn't going to happen in that regard.

[fred quimby]

9 minutes ago, alien said:

The thing that really matters on a macro level is Trump's stance on climate change. The scariest thing about Trump's election is what isn't going to happen in that regard.

Hoping Obama and China have set some wheels in motion that he will buy into

[fred quimby]

oh and

Lock her up

Lock her up

[feral chile]

22 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

Let's go with your opinion that all brexit voters are racists for a moment.

That gets to mean that this country had 52% racists before the vote and has 52% racists afterwards.

What can't you recognise about nothing having changed that makes you spout stuff now that you didn't before 23rd June?

Meanwhile, I pointed out a long time ago that Trump's popularity iss about how much Clinton is hated.

Assuming that all 52% are racist - difference between institutional/cultural racism and a racist majority.

Say 52% supported the repeal of the Equality Act, for instance. At the moment, the UK has laws to regulate against the 52%. Is that antidemocratic?

I'd say democracy is more than the tyranny of the majority. democracy is about compromise, fairness, and protecting the rights of minorities.

 

[The Nal]

This isn't an overnight thing. Obama got destroyed in both midterms. The biggest Republican gains since before the recession. Years before Trump was in the picture. 

Relying on the usual embracing of sad sound bites from the Democrats. "They go low we go high", "No one wins unless everyone wins" etc. Fucks sake. 

Also

Trump played it after his acceptance speech for anyone who didn't see it.

Edited November 9, 2016 by The Nal

[eFestivals]

8 minutes ago, feral chile said:

Assuming that all 52% are racist - difference between institutional/cultural racism and a racist majority.

Say 52% supported the repeal of the Equality Act, for instance. At the moment, the UK has laws to regulate against the 52%. Is that antidemocratic?

I'd say democracy is more than the tyranny of the majority. democracy is about compromise, fairness, and protecting the rights of minorities.

 

well, if 52% are racist they've always been racist, and no laws have been passed by those racists on a racist basis. So where the fuck is the reason to worry right now?

THAT's what I'm getting  at, the likes of zahidf crying wolf before it's appropriate. All it will do is ensure that no one will listen *IF* those worst fears come true.

But the simple fact is, not all of that 52% is racist - so zahidf is talking bollocks from top to bottom, and being at least as nutty as Trump.

[zahidf]

Last time republicans held complete control of government was 1928. A year later the stock market crashed so we got that to look forward to

[russycarps]

8 minutes ago, The Nal said:

This isn't an overnight thing. Obama got destroyed in both midterms. The biggest Republican gains since before the recession. Years before Trump was in the picture. 

Relying on the usual embracing of sad sound bites from the Democrats. "They go low we go high", "No one wins unless everyone wins" etc. Fucks sake. 

Also

Trump played it after his acceptance speech for anyone who didn't see it.

Hillary wheeling out all her celebrity buddies on stage with her was the final straw. Trump countering that by standing on stage alone saying "it's just me up here, I dont need any help" was masterful I thought. I bet that won him a lot of votes.

Her whole campaign was atrocious. Arrogant and massively misjudged. 

 

[The Nal]

10 minutes ago, zahidf said:

Last time republicans held complete control of government was 1928. A year later the stock market crashed so we got that to look forward to

Ah come on. Totally different times. There was no government then in comparison to now. FDRs New Deal in the 30s was the first big step in more government. 

A lot of overly simplistic apocalyptic drama being thrown about everywhere today. 

Edited November 9, 2016 by The Nal