Football 17/18

[Gucci Piggy]

Huddersfield, Burnley and one other to go down. Currently thinking Brighton but I'll go with Swansea if Sigurdsson leaves.

[Comfy Bean]

On 24/07/2017 at 8:47 PM, didinowanttohearthat said:

Anyone got any betting tips for the current season?

Ayr Utd looking overpriced at 5/2 to win the 1st Division.

Im biased but don't normally back them. I have this year. Worth throwing into a league winners accumulator I reckon.

 

[Wooderson]

On 7/24/2017 at 10:56 PM, pink_triangle said:

Is that the real treble, or a charity shield, European super cup, league cup variety! I heard the sky news presenter talking about Klopps first trophy a couple of days ago using a friendly tournament, I'm not sure what counts these days!

You fawning over Sky Sports Mews presenters again? Jim White?

[jyoung]

Just noticed those back page reports of Mbappe going back on loan to Monaco. Modern football madness.

[LJS]

13 hours ago, Comfy Bean said:

Ayr Utd looking overpriced at 5/2 to win the 1st Division.

Im biased but don't normally back them. I have this year. Worth throwing into a league winners accumulator I reckon.

 

I wouldn't be too sure, comfy.

You may get caught in the spider's web.

[jyoung]

Koeman confirmed Barkley will leave but mentioned no concrete offers on the table. Wouldn't mind Chelsea making a move. We're massively short on players, especially homegrown. Probably a better fit for Arsenal or Spurs though.

[lost]

I'm pretty disappointed as Sigurdsson doesn't seem much of an upgrade and I can't see us getting as much for Barkley as we are paying. The speed at which Koeman has dismantled Martinez's team really is something.

[Hugh Jass]

Is Barkley actually that good? Genuine question, not a dig.

[lost]

14 minutes ago, Hugh Jass said:

Is Barkley actually that good? Genuine question, not a dig.

Inconsistent but his stats are good when compared to other English midfielders. Well ahead of Sigurdsson anyway.

 

[jyoung]

20 minutes ago, Hugh Jass said:

Is Barkley actually that good? Genuine question, not a dig.

I think so yeah, though I know where you're coming from. He has not consistently shown the quality he is capable of, that's for sure. That said, I've seen enough glimpses of brilliance to know that if he really kicks on he could become one of England’s best creative players for some time. He won't become that on the bench though so let’s hope whatever happens, he gets game time.

There's obviously still many years ahead of him but at 24 in a few months, that potential needs to start translating into solid performances. He's had four full Premier League seasons now and yeah okay, he hasn't set the world on fire but he also hasn't been surrounded by world class players and that's not a dig at Everton it's just the way it is. It's a shame I suppose because he'd probably perform better this season, with the strong signings they have made elevating the entire team to another level.

But yeah, long story short, I'll stop rambling on... I think he's good.

[pink_triangle]

1 hour ago, lost said:

Inconsistent but his stats are good when compared to other English midfielders. Well ahead of Sigurdsson anyway.

 

I'm a big stat sceptic, what counts as a chance?

[lost]

9 minutes ago, pink_triangle said:

I'm a big stat sceptic, what counts as a chance?

assists + key passes apparently

a key pass is defined as "The final pass or pass-cum-shot leading to the recipient of the ball having an attempt at goal without scoring."

Edited July 26, 2017 by lost

[pink_triangle]

2 hours ago, lost said:

assists + key passes apparently

a key pass is defined as "The final pass or pass-cum-shot leading to the recipient of the ball having an attempt at goal without scoring."

I would imagine though a stat like that could be inflated if you played alongside a player who regularly shot from distance straight at the keeper.

[kaosmark2]

I stand by my comments that Huddersfield are better equipped defensively to handle the Prem. They had more variation in style, between their pressing game, the ability to play out either wide or through the middle. Brighton had a great defensive record off sitting back and playing a counter-attacking game, except when teams sat off them. They've upgraded their keeper which is definitely necessary, but I think teams showed them just the right amount of respect for them to get a few more points than their quality deserved. Brighton made a lot of defensive mistakes that didn't get punished last season.

On Barkley, I think he's the most overrated English player in a decade. He's got a nice touch in him but no consistency whatsoever and often goes missing for long periods. Very long periods.

[jyoung]

Definitely agree to disagree on both fronts mate, we will see!

[TheGayTent]

Barkley is English - do we need to say anything else...?

[mjsell]

On 26/07/2017 at 6:00 PM, lost said:

assists + key passes apparently

a key pass is defined as "The final pass or pass-cum-shot leading to the recipient of the ball having an attempt at goal without scoring."

I'm guessing Sigurdsson had far fewer chances to create chances then. 

A better stat would be the percentage of touches to chances created. But then he would still need a striker that has the ability to use a pass to manafacture a shot. Swansea didn't have that at all last year. Unless it was stood up to the back post for Llorente they weren't getting a shot in. 

Long story short - I think Sigurdsson is good. 

But I also think Barkley is good (at times)

 

[jyoung]

In today's football news, Jermaine Pennant joins Jamie O'Hara and Paul Konchesky at Billericay Town FC. Apparently he's earning £3000 a week there. That's £3000 a week. Playing football for a seventh tier team who pay £30,000 a week in wages. Shocking. 

[CRW5252]

42 minutes ago, jyoung said:

In today's football news, Jermaine Pennant joins Jamie O'Hara and Paul Konchesky at Billericay Town FC. Apparently he's earning £3000 a week there. That's £3000 a week. Playing football for a seventh tier team who pay £30,000 a week in wages. Shocking. 

Why? He's marquee player for a team like that. 

[jyoung]

3 minutes ago, CRW5252 said:

Why? He's marquee player for a team like that. 

This type of investment is stupid. Plain and simple. We have seen it over and over again in football. If the investment was in the club, the facilities, the structure etc it would make sense. Offering players at that level money like that could really damage the club long term as we have seen various times in the past.

[CRW5252]

4 minutes ago, jyoung said:

This type of investment is stupid. Plain and simple. We have seen it over and over again in football. If the investment was in the club, the facilities, the structure etc it would make sense. Offering players at that level money like that could really damage the club long term as we have seen various times in the past.

Are you sure that they don't invest in other things? I think we have seen more success than failures from big spending clubs. £30,000 a week for club wages at a level like that is massive so it's not like Pennant is the only one on comparatively high wages. The increase in match attendence and shirt sales from signings like these should not be underestimated.

[jyoung]

8 minutes ago, CRW5252 said:

The increase in match attendence and shirt sales from signings like these should not be underestimated.

I've never met anyone who owns a non league football jersey and some short term higher attendances really won't help the club long term. If you look at the recent history of clubs going into administration and liquidation, it usually comes from two things...

1. Dodgy owner
2. Dodgy owner spending too much on players club can't afford

[The Nal]

2 hours ago, jyoung said:

I've never met anyone who owns a non league football jersey and some short term higher attendances really won't help the club long term. If you look at the recent history of clubs going into administration and liquidation, it usually comes from two things...

1. Dodgy owner
2. Dodgy owner spending too much on players club can't afford

His wiki entry is funny

Edited July 28, 2017 by The Nal

[pink_triangle]

3 hours ago, jyoung said:

This type of investment is stupid. Plain and simple. We have seen it over and over again in football. If the investment was in the club, the facilities, the structure etc it would make sense. Offering players at that level money like that could really damage the club long term as we have seen various times in the past.

It works in some cases and doesn't in others. It probably depends on whether the owner is happy to throw money away, or has another motive. It depends whether the money is invested as loans which need to be paid back one day or not.

 

3 hours ago, CRW5252 said:

 I think we have seen more success than failures from big spending clubs. £30,000 a week for club wages at a level like that is massive so it's not like Pennant is the only one on comparatively high wages. The increase in match attendence and shirt sales from signings like these should not be underestimated.

I would disagree (certainly in the lower leagues) that there have been more successes than failures. A lot of the failures don't make the news. Also I don't think any changes in match attendance or shirt sales will be significant. That club is going to be running at a huge loss and it depends whether the owner is happy to take that loss on.

 

3 hours ago, jyoung said:

I've never met anyone who owns a non league football jersey and some short term higher attendances really won't help the club long term. If you look at the recent history of clubs going into administration and liquidation, it usually comes from two things...

1. Dodgy owner
2. Dodgy owner spending too much on players club can't afford

As a Wrexham supporter I own one and know many other who do!

[jyoung]

7 minutes ago, pink_triangle said:

Wrexham supporter I own one and know many other who do!

Okay, non league was the wrong phrasing. There are some very established non league teams. Change my original statement to how many people own non professional football clubs jerseys? 

I know your club have had their problems and that is another example itself. Wrexham were a football league team ten years ago though and have reached the national league plays off several times. You owning a Wrexham jersey is quite a bit different to someone owning a Billericay Town FC jersey.

Of course, I could be completely wrong and just living in ignorance. I don't really follow non league football so just going off the small understanding I do have.

Edited July 28, 2017 by jyoung