Football 17/18

[Hugh Jass]

18 minutes ago, jyoung said:

Everyone seems to be going mad about this one, you'd think it was Messi linking up with Accrington Stanley... What do you think @Hugh Jass?

Until I see an official announcement with him holding a shirt or scarf aloft I'm taking nothing for granted.

Would be a phenomenal signing though.

[CRW5252]

5 minutes ago, jyoung said:

SSN reporting that a fee is agreed with Liverpool and could go through tonight. Six year deal. Damn.

Yeah, looks like it's going to go through. He's not worth that kind of money (especially with 1 year left on his contact) but still ridiculous to leave it so late to sell him. As now any replacement we try to get will be very expensive.

[pink_triangle]

8 minutes ago, CRW5252 said:

Arsenal are such a mess. Not sure where all the people saying 'be careful what you wish for' to Arsenal fans regarding Wenger leaving have gone. It is impossible to defend him now.

Absolute shambles that we still have 3 of our best players (chambo maybe not quite 'best' but still good) with 1 year left on their contract. Looks like at least two of them will leave. We need an incredible end of the transfer window to even stand a chance of having a decent season. At the moment we are set for another top 4 battle (if we are lucky). 

Is it Wengers responsibility to ensure players don't go into the last year of their contract, or is it up to the board?

I actually think 40 million for the Other would be a good price even if he had 4 years to run.

[Hugh Jass]

11 minutes ago, jyoung said:

Renato Sanches to Swansea is the mad one imo. Heard Chelsea, United, Liverpool, Milan among others all linked with the lad but nope, he's gonna end up in Wales. Paul Clement pulling some absolute strings there!

I think being in a World Cup year helps. As with the Krychowiak deal with us players are realising that they need regular football if they're going to get to Russia. A season playing regularly at an average club is better than warming the bench at one of the big boys.

[pink_triangle]

7 minutes ago, Hugh Jass said:

I think being in a World Cup year helps. As with the Krychowiak deal with us players are realising that they need regular football if they're going to get to Russia. A season playing regularly at an average club is better than warming the bench at one of the big boys.

I think that may be the case if your from France, Germany, Brazil or Argentina. I'm not convinced it holds for Poland.

[Hugh Jass]

Just now, pink_triangle said:

I think that may be the case if your from France, Germany, Brazil or Argentina. I'm not convinced it holds for Poland.

You still don't want to go into a World Cup having only played ten matches the season before.

[Gucci Piggy]

I don't see who benefits from this Ox deal whatsoever. Liverpool have dropped £40m on Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain(!) who has 10 months left on his current contract, and have handed him a 6 year deal. Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain has left Arsenal to play at CM, and in doing so has gone to a team with Coutinho, Can, Henderson, Lallana, Wijnaldum, Milner and (from next Summer) Keita already fighting for 3 places. And Arsenal who are already shite have lost a first team player (with their best player seemingly about to follow him out the door).

Ornstein (the most reliable journalist for Arsenal news) has said that Arsenal are unlikely to sign a replacement, too. Hopefully he means a direct replacement (as in a new RB) because if they don't spent the money on anyone there'll be riots.

[DareToDibble]

£35mil for Ox is a lot, but then in todays market who really knows. If we get him to his full potential then in a few years it'll be viewed as a good deal... rather than letting him get to free agent status and maybe losing out on him to someone else. I totally agree about his position in the pecking order, though.

From a fans perspective it's not my money so I don't really care how much we are paying out and it's nice we are spending big to get players for a change. For far too long we've missed out on players to bigger bidders or because we faffed around over £2mil. Fir the first time in ages we actually had strong squad depth, rather than our youth team on the bench.

Well... everywhere other than defence that is...  

[Gucci Piggy]

3 minutes ago, DareToDibble said:

£35mil for Ox is a lot, but then in todays market who really knows. If we get him to his full potential then in a few years it'll be viewed as a good deal... rather than letting him get to free agent status and maybe losing out on him to someone else. I totally agree about his position in the pecking order, though.

From a fans perspective it's not my money so I don't really care how much we are paying out and it's nice we are spending big to get players for a change. For far too long we've missed out on players to bigger bidders or because we faffed around over £2mil. Fir the first time in ages we actually had strong squad depth, rather than our youth team on the bench.

Well... everywhere other than defence that is...  

To be fair this would have been the case again if Ox hadn't turned Chelsea down, wouldn't it?

[CRW5252]

31 minutes ago, pink_triangle said:

Is it Wengers responsibility to ensure players don't go into the last year of their contract, or is it up to the board?

I actually think 40 million for the Other would be a good price even if he had 4 years to run.

Yes, we do not have a DOF so it's his responsibility. 

Yeah, probably is. Doesn't matter to me though if we don't use the money

[Dan R]

10 minutes ago, Will-2609 said:

To be fair this would have been the case again if Ox hadn't turned Chelsea down, wouldn't it?

Thought it was cos arsenal thought Liverpool were their closest rival for top 4, rather than faffing about over fees.

[pink_triangle]

21 minutes ago, Hugh Jass said:

You still don't want to go into a World Cup having only played ten matches the season before.

I think there are pros and cons. Premiership based regular starters have a pretty poor record in international tournaments recently. Greece 2004 and South Korea 2002 were full of players who hadn't had much recent game time.

As a Wales fan we can't be fussy about playing club reserves. Poland have more depth, but not enough they will be that fussy.

[pink_triangle]

3 minutes ago, CRW5252 said:

Yes, we do not have a DOF so it's his responsibility. 

Yeah, probably is. Doesn't matter to me though if we don't use the money

Wenger can be sacked, so ultimately he doesn't have full control. If I own a football club I'm not going to let my assets (the players) be devalued by any manager.

[CRW5252]

4 minutes ago, pink_triangle said:

I think there are pros and cons. Premiership based regular starters have a pretty poor record in international tournaments recently. Greece 2004 and South Korea 2002 were full of players who hadn't had much recent game time.

As a Wales fan we can't be fussy about playing club reserves. Poland have more depth, but not enough they will be that fussy.

I wouldn't call 2004 and 2002 recent :L

[CRW5252]

Just now, pink_triangle said:

Wenger can be sacked, so ultimately he doesn't have full control. If I own a football club I'm not going to let my assets (the players) be devalued by any manager.

Of course but Kroenke is barely ever around and has many other business interests. No way he is involved in the day to day decisions of the club.

Regardless, all these players wanting out from Arsenal are a symptom of Wenger's failings.

[pink_triangle]

4 minutes ago, CRW5252 said:

I wouldn't call 2004 and 2002 recent :L

When I said recent I meant underperforming. Those 2 I listed were examples how little game time has benefited sides in the past. However if talking recent you could look at Wales and Iceland in the last Euros. I maintain a full season of premiership football is about the worst preparation you can have for a tournament, particularly for the attacking players.

[pink_triangle]

3 minutes ago, CRW5252 said:

Of course but Kroenke is barely ever around and has many other business interests. No way he is involved in the day to day decisions of the club.

Regardless, all these players wanting out from Arsenal are a symptom of Wenger's failings.

Then surely the ultimate problem is that he isn't involved. To me Wenger ends up absorbing a lot of blame from the fans that should go to Kroenke who while not popular, I think gets a fairly easy ride from both supporters and the media.

[CRW5252]

3 minutes ago, pink_triangle said:

When I said recent I meant underperforming. Those 2 I listed were examples how little game time has benefited sides in the past. However if talking recent you could look at Wales and Iceland in the last Euros. I maintain a full season of premiership football is about the worst preparation you can have for a tournament, particularly for the attacking players.

Fair enough, only skim read it. I agree with you to some extent. It would be interesting if someone did some research into it 

[pink_triangle]

1 minute ago, CRW5252 said:

Fair enough, only skim read it. I agree with you to some extent. It would be interesting if someone did some research into it 

The best research will be the World Cup in Qatar which is why I am one of the few that support the Winter World Cup.

[CRW5252]

3 minutes ago, pink_triangle said:

Then surely the ultimate problem is that he isn't involved. To me Wenger ends up absorbing a lot of blame from the fans that should go to Kroenke who while not popular, I think gets a fairly easy ride from both supporters and the media.

Kroenke gets plenty of blame. Wenger is just as much to blame at this point though. Tactics, man-management, transfers all a shambles. If we had a competent manager it could make up for Kroenke being useless. 

[Gnomicide]

Libpool are gonna score 150 goals this season and still finish up with a goal difference of +5.

[Wooderson]

6 minutes ago, Gnomicide said:

Libpool are gonna score 150 goals this season and still finish up with a goal difference of +5.

You said it gaffer. We could teleport Franco B and Ruud Krol into our back 4 and still ship 60 a season.

[pink_triangle]

43 minutes ago, CRW5252 said:

Kroenke gets plenty of blame. Wenger is just as much to blame at this point though. Tactics, man-management, transfers all a shambles. If we had a competent manager it could make up for Kroenke being useless. 

Kronke gets some blame. However when you compare it with the amount of blame Wenger gets and the amount of grief other owners get. I think he is getting a fairly easy ride while he is sat at home counting his money.

[kaosmark2]

Compare Arsenal's bad transfer window to Newcastle's. Benitez has been given a free pass for signing a load of players last summer who didn't even play in the Championship and us now selling them, while every time a player doesn't join, our fans blame Ashley's penny pinching. While I've no doubt Ashley is far more culpable than Benitez for our transfer failings, the idea that Rafa isn't to blame for bad performances of players he's brought in is laughable.

I think Benitez is a better manager than we could've hoped to get, and Ashley is one of the worst owners in the Prem, but I'm pretty sure a number of the players that we were after going elsewhere this summer isn't down to transfer fees and wages, but location, playing time, and where players think the club will be competing.

[Wooderson]

Rafa signs some awful shoite. Ain't his forte.