Brexit Schmexit

[eFestivals]

1 hour ago, mjsell said:

My manager who was idiotically staunch pro-brexit went suspiciously quiet afterwards

People are starting to wise up. This is a good thing.

It's the only hope to stop us throwing ourselves off a cliff.

[mjsell]

2 hours ago, eFestivals said:

People are starting to wise up. This is a good thing.

It's the only hope to stop us throwing ourselves off a cliff.

He was the sort of person that held the belief that no matter the result it was never going to impact him directly - which must have then allowed his non-economic political beliefs to really take hold of his thinking. 

Now that it is resulting in some of his colleagues being made redundant (one of them at a higher level than he is), that way of thinking must definitely be taking a massive hit. 

[zahidf]

 

 

 

[eFestivals]

22 hours ago, zahidf said:

 

To criticise May for having red lines only really makes sense if the alternative negotiators would have full flexibility to agree to anything and everything.

If Starmer were negotiating for a Labour govt, would he have red lines? Yup.

And funnily enough all those red lines would be for the same things, too. Free movement, ECJ, etc.

I'll take a guess and say this geezer is only speaking out because he personally disagrees with what the red lines are or where exactly one or more of those lines is set.

Don't forget, Jez is for a hard tory brexit no different to May - while his supporters are currently doing fantastic mental gymnastics in now backing brexit and saying we need it in order to implement the Jez manifesto, or (more laughably) claim that Jez doesn't really mean it, and it's merely his ploy for creating a fuss before he becomes PM and cancels brexit.

 

[zahidf]

36 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

To criticise May for having red lines only really makes sense if the alternative negotiators would have full flexibility to agree to anything and everything.

If Starmer were negotiating for a Labour govt, would he have red lines? Yup.

And funnily enough all those red lines would be for the same things, too. Free movement, ECJ, etc.

I'll take a guess and say this geezer is only speaking out because he personally disagrees with what the red lines are or where exactly one or more of those lines is set.

Don't forget, Jez is for a hard tory brexit no different to May - while his supporters are currently doing fantastic mental gymnastics in now backing brexit and saying we need it in order to implement the Jez manifesto, or (more laughably) claim that Jez doesn't really mean it, and it's merely his ploy for creating a fuss before he becomes PM and cancels brexit.

 

The ECJ is a bizzare red line, because we want the same sort of arbitration court anyway with a different name. so it just seems pointless

Having a red line on freedom of movement which means no access to the customs union or single market is stupid as well.

I dont think anyone is saying not to have red lines. Its just the UK side doesnt seem to be in unity over those, compared to the EU (Who have openly stated them)

Im not a fan of Labours current Brexit policy. The only major party whose Brexit policy i agree with is the Lib dem one

[eFestivals]

8 minutes ago, zahidf said:

The ECJ is a bizzare red line, because we want the same sort of arbitration court anyway with a different name. so it just seems pointless

Is CETA governed by the ECJ (alone)? Nope. Nor the South Korea deal.

It's a political choice, not a necessity.

 

8 minutes ago, zahidf said:

Having a red line on freedom of movement which means no access to the customs union or single market is stupid as well.

I don't disagree on a personal basis ... but that's the firm Labour Party position.

It's written in a way that says that in the manifesto (tho it doesn't say it as explicitly as it could have). It was stated by Starmer before the election (but passed most people by). It's been stated clearly by both of corbyn & McD since the election, too. And the Corbyn amendment the other day makes it clear, as does the sacking of those who think it stupid enough to propose their own amendment.

Labour is for a hard tory brexit, but with the same stupid Boris "have your cake and eat it" idea the tories, at least, has wised up to being a laughable crock of the impossible. 

Labour is for a hard tory brexit.

Get used to it.

 

8 minutes ago, zahidf said:

I dont think anyone is saying not to have red lines. Its just the UK side doesnt seem to be in unity over those, compared to the EU (Who have openly stated them)

the whole premise of that tweet is that any red line is stupid.

And the UK side is in unity, as far as May has instructed DD with red lines. The only deal the EU can do with anyone is with the person put forwards to them to deal with.

The EU has no interest in the internal UK position, aside from whether the position that might be agreed between them can be delivered by the UK.

 

8 minutes ago, zahidf said:

Im not a fan of Labours current Brexit policy. The only major party whose Brexit policy i agree with is the Lib dem one

Me, I don't even agree with that one. Brexit is fucking stupid. We should stop, now.

Tho it does (IMO) need a democratic mandate to stop it, and now is probably still a bit early to get that. I do think, tho, that there's a high likelihood that public opinion is going to swing and swing fairly big.

 

[eFestivals]

This is rather odd...

UK to 'take back control' of waters after exiting fishing convention

Put simply, this appears to be a revokeable-by-the-UK agreement that predates the UK's EU membership, that's with a handful of countries (that happen to be in the EU). So the UK has decided to revoke it.

So, why? And why now?

The only thing that seems to make sense is to remind the EU that there's stuff we can take away from them which gives them problems to deal with, just as the UK would have problems to deal with via a big brexit change.

-----

I happened to catch up on QT over the weekend, and saw Liam Fox boasting the trade talks start with the USA on (I think it was) the 24th July.

Which I suspect he wasn't supposed to mention - but couldn't help boasting when in a spot - because it's illegal under EU law for a member to partake in national trade talks, and with possible trade sanctions onto the country they talk with.

I really hope someone from the EU was watching.

 

[zahidf]

Oh dear god

 

[feral chile]

Some of the comments under this article:

http://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/brexit-uk-may-not-actually-exit-the-eu-warn-political-sources/ar-BBDPwXb?li=AAmiR2Z&ocid=spartanntp

 

Paco Jones

Gill you were stupid enough to read it . get a hobby ( or a toyboy ) love ...

Like · Reply · 7 · 6 hrs

 

Paul Hill ·

UNIVERSITY LIFE

Paco Jones, If your going to make a contribution, then make one. Gill hide is more than correct with her post. You are just a typo.

Like · Reply · 41 · 6 hrs

 

Jim Johnson

Paco Jones - are you offering your services then? Or do you prefer being your own right hand man !

Like · Reply · 24 · 6 hrs

 

 

 

 

[eFestivals]

10 hours ago, feral chile said:

Some of the comments under this article:

why was it only the comments about Corbyn that interested you, when the first talked of civil unrest?

And why was it only true comments about Corbyn offended you, where it was pointed out his has zero power to influence the process?

And why, under an article that's suggesting we won't Brexit - which is what you always said you supported - are you upset about comments about the hard-brexiteer that is Corbyn (just like Fox and Davis, while Boris has shown more brain than them all [which only shows how little brain is at work])?

Edited July 7, 2017 by eFestivals

[feral chile]

31 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

why was it only the comments about Corbyn that interested you, when the first talked of civil unrest?

And why was it only true comments about Corbyn offended you, where it was pointed out his has zero power to influence the process?

And why, under an article that's suggesting we won't Brexit - which is what you always said you supported - are you upset about comments about the hard-brexiteer that is Corbyn (just like Fox and Davis, while Boris has shown more brain than them all [which only shows how little brain is at work])?

Sorry should have added a smilie smile. Thought they were witty troll put downs. Never read such a witty way to call someone a w*nker before.

My new grandson was born yesterday so I might have read them with a great deal of good humour. I know this isn't 'general news' or 'feral news' but I was a little exuberant last night.

Edited July 7, 2017 by feral chile

[LJS]

1 hour ago, feral chile said:

Sorry should have added a smilie smile. Thought they were witty troll put downs. Never read such a witty way to call someone a w*nker before.

My new grandson was born yesterday so I might have read them with a great deal of good humour. I know this isn't 'general news' or 'feral news' but I was a little exuberant last night.

Congrats  feral granny

 

[feral chile]

8 hours ago, LJS said:

Congrats  feral granny

 

thanks LJS. c section yesterday and home today. Hope that's a sign of improved healthcare since 1980 when his mum was also born, though via emergency c section rather than planned. 10 bloody days. 

Anyway, I digress. I believe c sections are a European import

(keeping it relevant  )

Edited July 7, 2017 by feral chile

[eFestivals]

9 minutes ago, feral chile said:

I believe c sections are a European import

only on the basis that all of humanity to this island is.

But anyway, nowadays they're for the laydees who are too posh to push. Are you farming tories...?

[feral chile]

19 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

only on the basis that all of humanity to this island is.

But anyway, nowadays they're for the laydees who are too posh to push. Are you farming tories...?

Well it's her 4th. She had it on the NHS so they must have thought it necessary.

Mind, this was in England. I don't know whether they'd have agreed here. (it is a Tory seat where she lives.........)

They're still considering names - Corbyn didn't go down well

 

 

 

 

 

Edited July 7, 2017 by feral chile

[LJS]

19 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

only on the basis that all of humanity to this island is.

But anyway, nowadays they're for the laydees who are too posh to push. Are you farming tories...?

I believe some c sections are for medical reasons.

[feral chile]

1 minute ago, LJS said:

I believe some c sections are for medical reasons.

yes this one was, based on her previous deliveries.

[zahidf]

Its gone by LEAVE from 'We have to do Brexit, it will be great' to 'We have to do Brexit or poor stupid people will riot'.

Also Where? All the cities voted remain. Is it all gonna go off in Lincoln or Hartleppol? Fuck them. Get the water cannons out

[lost]

They've been rioting already about their poorly cladded tower blocks. Pain in the arse these poor stupid people they expect democracy and decent housing!!

Edited July 9, 2017 by lost

[zahidf]

First Rebellion it seems is in the works from the Tories

 

 

[eFestivals]

I can't remember who said it, but someone said something about how it would take 18 months for opinion to swing against brexit - and it looks like it's coming true.

I'm not sure torykip or labourkip are going to come out of this well.

[eFestivals]

On 7/7/2017 at 5:59 PM, LJS said:

I believe some c sections are for medical reasons.

really? I never knew.

 

[zahidf]

35 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

I can't remember who said it, but someone said something about how it would take 18 months for opinion to swing against brexit - and it looks like it's coming true.

I'm not sure torykip or labourkip are going to come out of this well.

Hope so! 

 

LabourUkip are keeping on the fence on the moment. See if they can stay on it!

[eFestivals]

1 hour ago, zahidf said:

LabourUkip are keeping on the fence on the moment. 

How do you get to that?

The manifesto makes no commitment to the single market or customs union, and neither did Labour's 'official' amendment last week - tho they can be read as the opposite (a fudge of words that say we're leaving).

And all of Corbyn, McD, and Starmer have said we're leaving the SM & CU.

Added to the official hostility to the 'chuka' amendment last week, and the number of Corbyn disciples who are going round saying "we can't have JC's economic programme if we're in the EU" I've got no doubts whatsoever that Labour are not sat on the fence.

[eFestivals]

boris has just done the "fuck you EU" thing again.