Brexit Schmexit

[eFestivals]

PS: Sturgeon had a list of unicorns too, published over year ago.

Still, we won't be short of meat after 29th March 2019, what with all those dying unicorns.

[zahidf]

TAKING BACK CONTROL

 

[feral chile]

I'd be interested to see what would happen if the EU was forced to reform itself under pressure of the threat of other members becoming disillusioned and threatening to leave.

Would a reformed EU validate and trigger a new referendum?

[feral chile]

On 28/02/2018 at 4:20 PM, russycarps said:

Good speech from Major today. Worth checking out. The tories are in disarray. Thank god we have some of the finest politicians in a generation on the opposition bench to slam home the advantage.

Oh wait.....

 

We got Boris ready to come to the rescue.

[eFestivals]

46 minutes ago, feral chile said:

I'd be interested to see what would happen if the EU was forced to reform itself under pressure of the threat of other members becoming disillusioned and threatening to leave.

Would a reformed EU validate and trigger a new referendum?

are you falling for Corbyn's guff - borrowed from Boris - about a brexit bonus for the NHS?

Cos that stuff about the evil EU that needs to reform is from the same place, and is as vacuous as 'neoliberal'.

[pink_triangle]

6 hours ago, feral chile said:

I'd be interested to see what would happen if the EU was forced to reform itself under pressure of the threat of other members becoming disillusioned and threatening to leave.

Would a reformed EU validate and trigger a new referendum?

It would if a party stood on that in their manifesto, although neither of the 2 main parties will.

[feral chile]

6 hours ago, eFestivals said:

are you falling for Corbyn's guff - borrowed from Boris - about a brexit bonus for the NHS?

Cos that stuff about the evil EU that needs to reform is from the same place, and is as vacuous as 'neoliberal'.

No just thinking that it's not just the UK that seems disillusioned with the EU. Nothing relating to Corbyn.

[eFestivals]

17 minutes ago, feral chile said:

No just thinking that it's not just the UK that seems disillusioned with the EU. Nothing relating to Corbyn.

there's a variety of opinions in all places, with some against the EU in all places. That's no surprise.

If you look around - in the UK, and around the rest of the EU (and with Trumpers, too) - you'll find that in most cases the disillusioned want to believe it's as simple as voting themselves more, rejecting the reality of the world and the need to compromise for others in the world.

[5co77ie]

EU are repeatedly banging on about how tariffs are really bad mmmmkay - in regards to Trump

 

So it doesnae look like we'll have any imposed on us then.

[zahidf]

25 minutes ago, 5co77ie said:

EU are repeatedly banging on about how tariffs are really bad mmmmkay - in regards to Trump

 

So it doesnae look like we'll have any imposed on us then.

Well i wouldnt trust crazy old mad man Trump. He may put them on when harry and megan dont invite him to their wedding

[feral chile]

17 hours ago, eFestivals said:

there's a variety of opinions in all places, with some against the EU in all places. That's no surprise.

If you look around - in the UK, and around the rest of the EU (and with Trumpers, too) - you'll find that in most cases the disillusioned want to believe it's as simple as voting themselves more, rejecting the reality of the world and the need to compromise for others in the world.

If the disillusioned of other countries are numerous enough to get their views represented in elections and other EU members threaten to leave, then the EU might compromise. And if we have a different EU to vote for, maybe another referendum. 

Can but dream 

 

[eFestivals]

1 hour ago, feral chile said:

If the disillusioned of other countries are numerous enough to get their views represented in elections and other EU members threaten to leave, then the EU might compromise. And if we have a different EU to vote for, maybe another referendum. 

the disillusioned of the UK were very well represented in the EU Parliament and they found themselves short of friends.

So nope, the disillusioned of other countries aren't particularly numerous.

Perhaps if the EU wasn't doling most of them out huge sums of money it might be different, but it is what it is.

[Comfy Bean]

Scottish fishermen all over the news raging, claiming that they have been lied to by May and Davidson. Colour me surprised.

Ruth admits she is “ frustrated “.

 

Edited March 19, 2018 by Comfy Bean

[eFestivals]

10 hours ago, Comfy Bean said:

Scottish fishermen all over the news raging, claiming that they have been lied to by May and Davidson. Colour me surprised.

Ruth admits she is “ frustrated “.

 

and yet Sturgeon demanded the UK stay in the single market, the customs union, and that there was an aligned transition deal.

And suddenly - because she sees the chance of advantageous political capital from non-thinkers like you - she's against aligned deals with the EU and demands special preferential treatment for (particularly) Scotland.

And you're licking her inconsistent duplicitous arse, screaming "I'm hard done by".

Maybe ... there's there's much bigger liars on this subject than May and Davidson?

PS: perhaps refresh yourself with what the Independence White Paper said about fishing rights, too, and what righteous indy-supporting Scots really think about fishing rights.

Edited March 20, 2018 by eFestivals

[LJS]

6 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

and yet Sturgeon demanded the UK stay in the single market, the customs union, and that there was an aligned transition deal.

And suddenly - because she sees the chance of advantageous political capital from non-thinkers like you - she's against aligned deals with the EU and demands special preferential treatment for (particularly) Scotland.

And you're licking her inconsistent duplicitous arse, screaming "I'm hard done by".

Maybe ... there's there's much bigger liars on this subject than May and Davidson?

PS: perhaps refresh yourself with what the Independence White Paper said about fishing rights, too, and what righteous indy-supporting Scots really think about fishing rights.

Yup, sensible folk want to stay in the single market and that would involve a trade off on control of our waters.

Given that we are told that staying in the single market is not an option & given that the government has told us we would have control of our waters from March 2019, it's perfectly reasonable to have a gripe about it.

Control of fishing in our own waters is one of the very few aspects of Brexit that might have a positive outcome for the UK & particularly Scotland.

[eFestivals]

5 minutes ago, LJS said:

Yup, sensible folk want to stay in the single market and that would involve a trade off on control of our waters.

And sensible folk know that we're staying in the single market until we get control of our waters.

When one ends the other begins.

Unsensible folk are demanding that we're in the single market but not abiding by its agreements and rules.

The list of unsensible people include: Jacob Rees Mogg; Sturgeon; YOU!!!!

 

Quote

Given that we are told that staying in the single market is not an option & given that the government has told us we would have control of our waters from March 2019, it's perfectly reasonable to have a gripe about it.

Only if you're one of the people saying "fuck off" about everything EU.

G'morning Jacob.

Quote

Control of fishing in our own waters is one of the very few aspects of Brexit that might have a positive outcome for the UK & particularly Scotland.

And funnily enough, that's exactly what the UK will get when it ends it's formal structured relationship with the EU.

Those who want their cake and eat it are not only card-carrying w*nkers like you, Jacob.

 

Edited March 20, 2018 by eFestivals

[LJS]

4 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

And sensible folk know that we're staying in the single market until we get control of our waters.

When one ends the other begins.

Unsensible folk are demanding that we're in the single market but not abiding by its agreements and rules.

The list of unsensible people include: Jacob Rees Mogg; Sturgeon; YOU!!!!

 

Only if you're one of the people saying "fuck off" about everything EU.

G'morning Jacob.

And funnily enough, that's exactly what the UK will get when it ends it's formal structured relationship with the EU.

Those who want their cake and eat it are not only card-carrying w*nkers like you, Jacob.

 

It's always clear you have no case when you resort to name calling.

Jacob?

It's a cracker.

[eFestivals]

1 minute ago, LJS said:

It's always clear you have no case when you resort to name calling.

Jacob?

It's a cracker.

I addressed all of your points, proving I have a point.

You accuse me of name calling, while shooting the messenger and offering no substance.

One of us is blind to ourselves.

[eFestivals]

Here's what the real Jacob had to say, 

He sounds very similar to you and Sturgeon.

It's certainly the case that complaint is 100% identical.

Oh dear.

 

 

[LJS]

6 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

Here's what the real Jacob had to say, 

He sounds very similar to you and Sturgeon.

It's certainly the case that complaint is 100% identical.

Oh dear.

 

 

Of course it is, Neil.

I know it's a complex position for you to get your tiny brain around, but there is no contradiction in seeking the best possible outcome from a Brexit you think is shit.

The likelihood is that control of our waters is just another Brexit myth as I'm quite sure the EU will want access to our waters as part of any post Brexit trade deal.

[eFestivals]

1 minute ago, LJS said:

Of course it is, Neil.

I know it's a complex position for you to get your tiny brain around, but there is no contradiction in seeking the best possible outcome from a Brexit you think is shit.

According to Sturgeon the best possible outcome is to stay in the single market.

What's difficult to understand about Sturgeons (and yours) fishing complaint being a complaint about staying in the single market?

 

1 minute ago, LJS said:

The likelihood is that control of our waters is just another Brexit myth as I'm quite sure the EU will want access to our waters as part of any post Brexit trade deal.

For any trade agreement, each country gives up an amount of their sovereignty in exchange for something else.

Now you're complaining about the whole basis of trade deals in *exactly* the same way as Mogg.

[LJS]

3 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

According to Sturgeon the best possible outcome is to stay in the single market.

What's difficult to understand about Sturgeons (and yours) fishing complaint being a complaint about staying in the single market?

I was right. It's too complicated for you. Sorry.

3 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

For any trade agreement, each country gives up an amount of their sovereignty in exchange for something else.

Now you're complaining about the whole basis of trade deals in *exactly* the same way as Mogg.

I'm complaining about being lied to.

[eFestivals]

2 minutes ago, LJS said:

I was right. It's too complicated for you. Sorry.

I'm not the one doing inconsistent, and brainless political opportunism, and mirroring what Mogg says.

 

2 minutes ago, LJS said:

I'm complaining about being lied to.

But you (and Sturgeon) have got the best outcome, the outcome you've said you've wanted. :lol:

Unless you now think that the UK should shun the SM asap?

Unless you think all Tory redlines should be delivered, no matter how unsensible they are?

Unless you're rejecting all of your previous criticisms of the tory positions, where you've pointed out the practical and political impossibilities of their demands from the EU?

[eFestivals]

PS: it's not exactly smart to spend years calling the tories liars, and then complain you've been lied to.

You can only feel lied to if you accepted what they said as straight and honest. Did you? 

 

 

[Comfy Bean]

12 hours ago, Comfy Bean said:

Scottish fishermen all over the news raging, claiming that they have been lied to by May and Davidson. Colour me surprised.

Ruth admits she is “ frustrated “.

 

Hi Neil,

Perhaps you didn`t read this properly earlier 

I am not a fisherman and I did not vote for Brexit on the strength of promises from May / Davidson.

Sturgeon ( insert fish joke ) was very pro-remain so your response in attacking her looks silly. She campaigned strongly AGAINST Brexit but the fisherman chose to believe the Leave campaign.

As I said, Ruth and the Tory MP`s are frustrated and talking about "betrayal" by May and the Tories. You seem keen to defend and deflect onto Sturgeon. 

Sadly I`m far from surprised. Deflecting on to Sturgeon is atleast a refreshing change from defending the Tories by blaming everything on Corbyn or those on the left etc 

It`s all very well having a blue passport if you have no fish to catch. They had a Tory boy on the radio earlier talking about "our fish " and " our seas ". I didn`t know whether to laugh or cry.