Brexit Schmexit

[eFestivals]

11 hours ago, theevilfridge said:

And aren’t Momentum pushing for a second referendum policy to be adopted at the next Labour conference?

you mean they've realised they were absolute fucking idjuts last year when they said it was an anti-Corbyn plot to want to talk about brexit?

Me, I want Momentum to adopt a 'we'll kill ourselves' policy, and then perhaps we might get a bit of sense back and not go down the idiot route in the first place.

[eFestivals]

10 hours ago, Lad said:

It's the usual EU thing.The peasants got it wrong so they'll have to try again.Perhaps we'll find out what it'd mean voting to stay.Euro,Schengen,one government,one army etc,It wasn't on the ballot you know.☺

as you seem to have missed it, the UK has opt outs on the Euro, Schengen, and more. 

Meanwhile, the disaster called the Euro is still out performing the glorious pound. How odd. 

[ThomThomDrum]

16 hours ago, pink_triangle said:

I agree a referendum would be needed to reverse it, but my view is that pledge for a referendum would need to be campaigned for. 

I dont think you are even close to getting what you would like to see happen. Too many politicians are using Brexit as a political football, so you will most likely not see a major party row in behind "remain" in a manifesto if a GE was called. Didnt the vast majority of MPs support remain? But one would hardly think such the way things have panned out since. Where are all those remainers voices these days? Hiding behind the "will of the people", too scared to pipe up? Sure Brexit means Brexit and thats that, eh? You will be waiting a very long time for the politicians to be brave enough to call a GE and stand behind remain in their manifesto. Easier for them to assess opinion polls on Brexit and begin calling for some form of new "in/out" referendum if polls support such and if they feel it can be politically survivable to do so..........The lag between what public opinion (may) reflect and the time politicians are brave enough to commit to something in a manifesto is too long IMO and that is time this whole Brexit process may not have

Best thing for it at this stage IMO is that Brexit gets uglier and uglier, fueling public outrage and fear and the calls for some form of referendum from the public sphere becomes deafening. 

[feral chile]

4 minutes ago, ThomThomDrum said:

I dont think you are even close to getting what you would like to see happen. Too many politicians are using Brexit as a political football, so you will most likely not see a major party row in behind "remain" in a manifesto if a GE was called. Didnt the vast majority of MPs support remain? But one would hardly think such the way things have panned out since. Where are all those remainers voices these days? Hiding behind the "will of the people", too scared to pipe up? Sure Brexit means Brexit and thats that, eh? You will be waiting a very long time for the politicians to be brave enough to call a GE and stand behind remain in their manifesto. Easier for them to assess opinion polls on Brexit and begin calling for some form of new "in/out" referendum if polls support such and if they feel it can be politically survivable to do so..........The lag between what public opinion (may) reflect and the time politicians are brave enough to commit to something in a manifesto is too long IMO and that is time this whole Brexit process may not have

Best thing for it at this stage IMO is that Brexit gets uglier and uglier, fueling public outrage and fear and the calls for some form of referendum from the public sphere becomes deafening. 

That's supposing they believe.

I know a remainer who's moaning about all the 'scaremongering'.

 

[eFestivals]

8 minutes ago, feral chile said:

That's supposing they believe.

I know a remainer who's moaning about all the 'scaremongering'.

 

yeah, there's plenty of those, as well as remainers saying "the govt should just get on with it".

But opinion is still turning, and it's only turned opinions that can justify a further referendum - and if a 2nd ref was held and won by remain, that would be justification-enough for skeptical remainers to feel a 2nd ref happening was fair enough.

It's still all to play for, and as what will happen gets firmed up I reckon the desire to remain will grow further. as May might say, nothing is agreed until it's all agreed.

What i can't work out is where this would leave Labour, if it were the tories who submitted to that 2nd vote.

[Lad]

3 hours ago, eFestivals said:

as you seem to have missed it, the UK has opt outs on the Euro, Schengen, and more. 

Meanwhile, the disaster called the Euro is still out performing the glorious pound. How odd. 

So you want to have your cake and eat it.?It doesn't mean these measures will be the ones offered if this country rejoins does it?Currencies always fluctuate its one of the means of control  in the economic cycles.It's amazing that the pound has done so well with two years of deliberate mishandling and sabotage from this shit PM.

[eFestivals]

29 minutes ago, Lad said:

It doesn't mean these measures will be the ones offered if this country rejoins does it?

True.

But we haven't left yet, and if A50 is revoked we haven't left. A50 is notice to quit the treaties on a particular date and its *ONLY* the UK (and not the EU) that can quit the treaties. If we say we're not quitting after all before that date everything remains the same.

30 minutes ago, Lad said:

Currencies always fluctuate its one of the means of control  in the economic cycles.

True.

But the Euro has only fluctuated one way (as a medium and long term thing) for all of its existence.

Which is rather odd if its a failing currency. The failing currencies are the ones on the downward path.

32 minutes ago, Lad said:

It's amazing that the pound has done so well with two years of deliberate mishandling and sabotage from this shit PM.

that's a brexit-supporting PM dealing with the consequences of brexit and where £60Bn of QE has helped prop it up, along with an interest rate rise too.

Which is rather odd if brexit is the wonderful thing you say it is.

[Lad]

13 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

True.

But we haven't left yet, and if A50 is revoked we haven't left. A50 is notice to quit the treaties on a particular date and its *ONLY* the UK (and not the EU) that can quit the treaties. If we say we're not quitting after all before that date everything remains the same.

True.

But the Euro has only fluctuated one way (as a medium and long term thing) for all of its existence.

Which is rather odd if its a failing currency. The failing currencies are the ones on the downward path.

that's a brexit-supporting PM dealing with the consequences of brexit and where £60Bn of QE has helped prop it up, along with an interest rate rise too.

Which is rather odd if brexit is the wonderful thing you say it is.

The original theme I replied to was a poster saying it'd be great if we adopted the Euro,Schengen etc.I said I hope that you all campaign on these.After all its what Clarke,Soubry,chukka,Kinnockio et al believe but don't feel confident enough to be truthful.

May has consistently sabotaged the negotiations.She a globalist remainer. Varoufakis told her exactly how the EU negotiates years ago.She purposely ignored what she knew to be true.And here we are now oh now Its all terrible.Well yeah that was always the idea to fuck it up.

[eFestivals]

12 minutes ago, Lad said:

May has consistently sabotaged the negotiations.

Only true if you're happy with a hard brexit or realistic enough to know that the EU will never agree to a deal which undermines the EU.

You're a hard brexit guy. Go on, please tell us all the advantages of that. :lol: 

[Lad]

18 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

Only true if you're happy with a hard brexit or realistic enough to know that the EU will never agree to a deal which undermines the EU.

You're a hard brexit guy. Go on, please tell us all the advantages of that. :lol: 

You get a country not ruled by someone else.Everything follows from that.

[eFestivals]

23 minutes ago, Lad said:

You get a country not ruled by someone else.

except you do.

The UK merely gets to swap one set of someone-else's rules for another set of someone-else's rules.

At least within the EU we had big influence. There'll be fuck all of that with WTO rules.

Edited July 31, 2018 by eFestivals

[zahidf]

Of course this country is going to turn against Brexit when the prospect of food shortages becomes clear. This country lost its shit when a Toblerone got smaller and called the police when KFC shut for a day.

[eFestivals]

13 minutes ago, zahidf said:

Of course this country is going to turn against Brexit when the prospect of food shortages becomes clear. 

won't happen.

Who is going to stop the food coming?

Jesuz, wise up. Over-talking it won't help.

[sjseabass]

2 hours ago, eFestivals said:

won't happen.

Who is going to stop the food coming?

Jesuz, wise up. Over-talking it won't help.

Yeah, the magical unicorns can perform the legally required phytosanitary checks at the border, just like they can fix every other problem, right Neil?

[zahidf]

Massive shift in Wales

 

[eFestivals]

2 hours ago, theevilfridge said:

Yeah, the magical unicorns can perform the legally required phytosanitary checks at the border, just like they can fix every other problem, right Neil?

they may or may not be required.

They don't happen on the EU side of things.

The UK is not going to starve itself to keep to WTO rules (and anyway, WTO rules don't count for vital food supply).

As long as the UK keeps on sending the money, the EU will keep shipping us food.

They'll be shit loads of other problems, but incoming food won't be one of them.

Edited July 31, 2018 by eFestivals

[Lad]

But starving wasn't on the ballot.If only I'd known.

[feral chile]

2 hours ago, zahidf said:

Massive shift in Wales

 

I hope so. I've never understood the Welsh vote.

[eFestivals]

4 minutes ago, feral chile said:

I hope so. I've never understood the Welsh vote.

Welsh sample size in that poll is too small to be statistically relevant. 

in other words, the result they've got for Wales is as good as worthless.

[zahidf]

1 hour ago, Lad said:

But starving wasn't on the ballot.If only I'd known.

Well Leave voters were warned 

[eFestivals]

2 minutes ago, zahidf said:

Well Leave voters were warned 

yeah, you keep on saying they'll be food shortages, while being unable to think of any reason why they'd happen.

And you like to think the brexiters are thick.

[zahidf]

3 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

yeah, you keep on saying they'll be food shortages, while being unable to think of any reason why they'd happen.

And you like to think the brexiters are thick.

The govt said they were going to put measures in place for food shortages. I assume they wouldn't do that for no reason!

Here's an interesting poll looking at the views of LEAVE voters

 

[eFestivals]

6 minutes ago, zahidf said:

The govt said they were going to put measures in place for food shortages. I assume they wouldn't do that for no reason!

Where do you think enough food for the UK for a month - or even a day - is going to be stored by the govt?

Do you think, maybe, that Tesco will magically expand their warehouses by ten times?

Do you believe everything else the govt says with no thought applied?

 

Quote

Here's an interesting poll looking at the views of LEAVE voters

To be fair, if people on a different island decide to start shooting each other because they have a world-normal border between the different states they are, i'm not too sure why you expect people on this island to care too much.

Most people on this island don't even give a shit about their own street. The dafter people think over 50% are motivated by only evil.

I know someone who thinks so little about people about of the UK he thinks half are deliberate racists. Why bother to alter your thinking about people you think are that shit?

Edited July 31, 2018 by eFestivals

[zahidf]

20 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

Where do you think enough food for the UK for a month - or even a day - is going to be stored by the govt?

Do you think, maybe, that Tesco will magically expand their warehouses by ten times?

Do you believe everything else the govt says with no thought applied?

 

To be fair, if people on a different island decide to start shooting each other because they have a world-normal border between the different states they are, i'm not too sure why you expect people on this island to care too much.

Most people on this island don't even give a shit about their own street. The dafter people think over 50% are motivated by only evil.

I know someone who thinks so little about people about of the UK he thinks half are deliberate racists. Why bother to alter your thinking about people you think are that shit?

I have yet to hear a convincing reason for leave. Lads opinions seem the most prevalent. Any wonder I think the way I' do?

And leave voters are old enough to remember the IRA and the mainland surely  

[feral chile]

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-latest-dover-trade-operation-stack-department-for-transport-no-deal-a8471276.html