2019 Stage Predictions

[Quark]

8 minutes ago, Little Andy said:

In regards to female artists, I noticed all my examples were women, and I even went onto the Glastonbury Wiki to find a male example who had played. I just couldn't see one.

That wasn't a dig btw

[Little Andy]

1 minute ago, Quark said:

That wasn't a dig btw

Yeah I know

[incident]

26 minutes ago, Little Andy said:

In regards to female artists, I noticed all my examples were women, and I even went onto the Glastonbury Wiki to find a male example who had played. I just couldn't see one. 

It's a while back, but a very good example would be Robbie Williams in 1998.

Edited September 13, 2018 by incident

[CaledonianGonzo]

How does someone manufacture themselves?

[Quark]

8 minutes ago, CaledonianGonzo said:

How does someone manufacture themselves?

Again, my opinion...

Self manufacture would be an artist deliberately shifting and/or changing their image and/or output in response to a current or predicted decline in popularity, sales or public opinion in order to maintain or regain relevance, exposure and the associated moolah.

So that wouldn't be a change through an artistic desire to try something different or a reflection of the changing musical landscape, but more of a deliberate and conscious desire to be something removed from their previous incarnation in order to achieve a commercial end.

Example - Madonna's reaction post-Erotica to create a softer and less edgy image (which is arguably closer to her real person) in order to minimise and reverse the backlash in popularity and sales.

[CaledonianGonzo]

So....like U2 changing it up to Achtung Baby post Rattle & Hum, or Bowie going drum & bass?

[Little Andy]

19 minutes ago, CaledonianGonzo said:

How does someone manufacture themselves?

S'good question.

My understanding of 'manufactured', rightly or wrongly, is when they have little to no impact on the sound of the music. Often they are a pretty face or a dancer or a stereotypically good singer but with no creativity. They typically therefore are given music to sing which appeals to people who are new to music, or don't listen to much music. More credible artists would be writing their music with their own personal and often interesting touch.

How someone manufactures themselves, therefore, I'm not so sure. Obviously shows like X factor show us how it can be done by a Cowell-esque figure. How people otherwise do it, I dunno? Do they send tapes of them singing karaoke style to pop-record companies? Do they sometimes buy songs off generic song-writers? Dunno!

Edited September 13, 2018 by Little Andy

[CaledonianGonzo]

Most manufacturerd band to headline in recent years would be the Stones.  Andrew Loog Oldham plotting their every move and chasing every trend from psychedelia to disco.

[Quark]

Specifics are tricky.  Bowie for me managed to pull off the double whammy of doing it across his career while (largely) maintaining some kind of integrity.  But yeah, I think he can be be identified as a perfect example of a constantly self-manufactured series of image changes. There are bigger Bowie fans out there than I who can pick holes in it I'm sure, but I don't think he ever made any secret of his desire for fame?

U2 one I couldn't comment on, purely because I've never paid that much attention tbh

Like I said, just a thought process. In case you hadn't picked up on it, most of the posts I put out for some kind of sensible discussion are pretty much streams of consciousness and making it up as I go along!

[Little Andy]

Just now, CaledonianGonzo said:

Most manufacturerd band to headline in recent years would be the Stones.  Andrew Loog Oldham plotting their every move and chasing every trend from psychedelia to disco.

Are the band members the main driving force behind the music? If so, I don't see them as particularly manufactured to my ears, cos for me personally its 98% about the music. I would assume, wrongly or rightly, that Beyonce would be the most manufactured recent headliner by my definition.

[CaledonianGonzo]

I can't see any indication that Beyonce's been manufactured in the way that, say, Brian Epstein manufactured The Beatles.

[dentalplan]

Beyonce gave up her whole childhood to be in a girl group managed by her Dad, writing her own songs, practicing nightly and going to state singing contests and shit cos she wanted to be a pop singer. Might as well say Cristiano Ronaldo has been manufactured.

[Little Andy]

Fair enough, my assumptions about Beyonce may well be wrong. For me its all about how much of a say the artist has on the music, or if they're largely given something to sing.

Very often I get the impression that singers who never play an instrument are more likely to be pop puppets, but I accept that is not always the case.

Edited September 13, 2018 by Little Andy

[CaledonianGonzo]

Seems to me it's pretty clear that - in their early years at least - manufactured bands like The Sex Pistols or Oasis are capable of generating the sort of excitement that's far beyond the reach of more organic bands like Elbow.

[Little Andy]

Manufacturing is always about making them popular, and thus making money. Its often counter-productive to interesting music.

[Hugh Jass]

I wouldn't say that just changing one's look or style is necessarily "manufacturing", most artists need to change and evolve to survive. Nobody wants to hear a band fart out five identical sounding records (this is where I applaud the Arctic Monkeys, they may not have always done it successfully, but at least they appear keen to try different things with each release these days). 

[jparx]

2 hours ago, Little Andy said:

One Direction never even appeared at the festival though. Surely thats cos they were manufactured, I can't think what else it would be? (Just to clarify, I would not want them appear either, I'm just trying to discuss why some pop artists are fair game and some are not)

I don’t think them not appearing has anything to do with being manufactured. It’s probably more to do with Glastonbury selling out every year, and the typical person that attends not being in their target demo. They’re huge, sure, but in a different sphere to the usual Glastonbury goer. Beyoncé headlined because her appeal is much broader and she’s a magnificent performer.

If ticket sales were more driven by a lineup revealed in advance of tickets going on sale then maybe they would have factored in to appeal to a younger crowd.

[Quark]

Just now, Hugh Jass said:

I wouldn't say that just changing one's look or style is necessarily "manufacturing", most artists need to change and evolve to survive. Nobody wants to hear a band fart out five identical sounding records (this is where I applaud the Arctic Monkeys, they may not have always done it successfully, but at least they appear keen to try different things with each release these days). 

Oh yeah, certainly not every change is manufacturing.  That's why I used the Madonna example - it was a clear reactive change to a specific decline in fortunes. 

Also, see my earlier post that effectively puts anything I say in the bucket of "could well be utter bollocks"

[Little Andy]

Just now, Quark said:

Also, see my earlier post that effectively puts anything I say in the bucket of "could well be utter bollocks"

I'm pretty sure we're all doing that!

[Rose-Colored Boy]

30 minutes ago, jparx said:

I don’t think them not appearing has anything to do with being manufactured. It’s probably more to do with Glastonbury selling out every year, and the typical person that attends not being in their target demo. They’re huge, sure, but in a different sphere to the usual Glastonbury goer. Beyoncé headlined because her appeal is much broader and she’s a magnificent performer.

If ticket sales were more driven by a lineup revealed in advance of tickets going on sale then maybe they would have factored in to appeal to a younger crowd.

They’re also absolutely terrible live, by all accounts. They were never booked for festivals where ticket sales were based on the line-up, eg V or IOW, either. And nor have any of the members been in their respective solo ‘careers’, as far as I can remember off the top of my head.

[jparx]

5 minutes ago, Rose-Colored Boy said:

They’re also absolutely terrible live, by all accounts. They were never booked for festivals where ticket sales were based on the line-up, eg V or IOW, either. And nor have any of the members been in their respective solo ‘careers’, as far as I can remember off the top of my head.

T4 on the beach? ?

[Rose-Colored Boy]

2 minutes ago, jparx said:

T4 on the beach? ?

Is it bad that I actually googled whether they’d played that or not ? They didn’t, although efest favourites Little Mix played a one song set in 2012.

[Hugh Jass]

9 minutes ago, Rose-Colored Boy said:

They’re also absolutely terrible live, by all accounts. They were never booked for festivals where ticket sales were based on the line-up, eg V or IOW, either. And nor have any of the members been in their respective solo ‘careers’, as far as I can remember off the top of my head.

They've never played V?? I admit I haven't been following theirs or that festival's fortunes too closely but that genuinely surprises me. You'd have thought they be a stick on one night when the Killers or KOL weren't playing.

[Rose-Colored Boy]

9 minutes ago, Hugh Jass said:

They've never played V?? I admit I haven't been following theirs or that festival's fortunes too closely but that genuinely surprises me. You'd have thought they be a stick on one night when the Killers or KOL weren't playing.

Nope. As I say, they had a reputation for being appallingly bad live. And they broke up before V started getting desperate enough to lower themselves to the likes of Bieber, probably 1D’s solo equivalent.

Edited September 13, 2018 by Rose-Colored Boy

[thewayiam]

51 minutes ago, Rose-Colored Boy said:

They’re also absolutely terrible live, by all accounts. They were never booked for festivals where ticket sales were based on the line-up, eg V or IOW, either. And nor have any of the members been in their respective solo ‘careers’, as far as I can remember off the top of my head.

Let's be honest though, how quick they sold tickets and how many dates they did, they didn't need festival dates but they did big weekend one year.