news & politics:discussion

[steviewevie]

1 minute ago, Nobody Interesting said:

In 12 months time one of 2 things will happen.

Somehow the UK economy has managed to become closely alinged to the other main countries and the Tories give us all a tax cut cos they are so great and the fools fall for it again.

or

It is blindingly obvious that the UK is wrecked and it will take 10 years or more to even begin to mend it but Labour fail to do so as they have no new ideas.

 

If only there were other parties with other ideas and not just a two party system.

there is the chinese way

[steviewevie]

 

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, Nobody Interesting said:

Profits are what makes GDP/Growth so the government is quite happy to accept all these huge profits. As I wrote earlier, without the huge profits of oil, energy, banks and supermarkets GDP would have dropped by 0.6% and we would have been in recession ages ago.

However you might look at a system and the tools to mend it you must, UI would hope, accept that if you have a leak and turn a tap you want to know fast if it has stopped the leak - not 6-12 months later like interest rate rises.

Interest rate rises along side other policies including tax rises that effect those without loans/mortgages will turn the tap of spending far fast than the single tool you have to wait for results from.

Those excess profits haven't been helping our growth so lets windfall tax them properly and put that money back into public services or helping people with the cost of living.

Yes it does seem pretty odd for the BoE to persist with this strategy that isn't working. In your analogy it would be like that a hammer to a leaky tap and wonder why the situation isn't fixed. A hammer might be better suited with a different sort of issue but not this one.

[Nobody Interesting]

4 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

there is the chinese way

There is the Costa Rican way

[steviewevie]

4 minutes ago, Nobody Interesting said:

I think my previous comment about systems should tell you that I will say there is no such thing as a socialist utopia as greed trumps all.

ok, well has to be robots then. Let the computers sort everything out and we'll just kick back and take mdma or melange or soma or whatever.

[Nobody Interesting]

3 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

Those excess profits haven't been helping our growth so lets windfall tax them properly and put that money back into public services or helping people with the cost of living.

Yes it does seem pretty odd for the BoE to persist with this strategy that isn't working. In your analogy it would be like that a hammer to a leaky tap and wonder why the situation isn't fixed. A hammer might be better suited with a different sort of issue but not this one.

The figures I quote about 0.6% for the profits comes from the ONS, so the profits have helped us to have zero growth rather than recession.

[Nobody Interesting]

1 minute ago, steviewevie said:

ok, well has to be robots then. Let the computers sort everything out and we'll just kick back and take mdma or melange or soma or whatever.

Well that is what John Noakes, in the late 1970's, suggested we would all be doing when we got to his age.

Shame he was wrong.

[steviewevie]

4 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

Those excess profits haven't been helping our growth so lets windfall tax them properly and put that money back into public services or helping people with the cost of living.

Yes it does seem pretty odd for the BoE to persist with this strategy that isn't working. In your analogy it would be like that a hammer to a leaky tap and wonder why the situation isn't fixed. A hammer might be better suited with a different sort of issue but not this one.

The bank just do the interest rates bit. If we tax more and that keeps inflation down than the bank wouldn't do the interest rates thing.

Maybe we should bin it all and go back to bartering.

[Guest]

15 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

The bank just do the interest rates bit. If we tax more and that keeps inflation down than the bank wouldn't do the interest rates thing.

Maybe we should bin it all and go back to bartering.

I'm not saying put windfall taxes in place to help with inflation. Those taxes would be used to help people/pay for certain services. Price controls etc would help with inflation.

[fraybentos1]

37 minutes ago, Nobody Interesting said:

Who do you think gave the BOE their remit and powers?

The government? That's my point . It would be on the gov to increase their remit and powers

[steviewevie]

12 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

I'm not saying put windfall taxes in place to help with inflation. Those taxes would be used to help people/pay for certain services. Price controls etc would help with inflation.

ok, but that is still a government decision and nothing to do with the bank's decision on interest rates. Basically we live in a monetarist system and it's been like that since the Thatcher govt and no govt since has diverted from that, including Labour.

(think I have that right)

[lost]

1 minute ago, steviewevie said:

ok, but that is still a government decision and nothing to do with the bank's decision on interest rates. Basically we live in a monetarist system and it's been like that since the Thatcher govt and no govt since has diverted from that, including Labour.

(think I have that right)

We'd of never of got QE if we lived in a monetarist system as a monetarist would of believed it would cause run away inflation (which it did) 

I'd say we live in a neo-Keynesian system. Keynes said run a deficit during the bad times and a surplus during the good. The Tories and Labour appear to run a small deficit during the good and a massive one during the bad.

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

ok, but that is still a government decision and nothing to do with the bank's decision on interest rates. Basically we live in a monetarist system and it's been like that since the Thatcher govt and no govt since has diverted from that, including Labour.

(think I have that right)

Yeah I know, I'm saying these measures should be done instead of raising interest rates. The government could've stepped in and said they would deal with inflation via fiscal measures instead.

[steviewevie]

17 minutes ago, lost said:

We'd of never of got QE if we lived in a monetarist system as a monetarist would of believed it would cause run away inflation (which it did) 

I'd say we live in a neo-Keynesian system. Keynes said run a deficit during the bad times and a surplus during the good. The Tories and Labour appear to run a small deficit during the good and a massive one during the bad.

Neo-Keynsian! It has a name.

NeoKeyn.

[steviewevie]

22 minutes ago, lost said:

We'd of never of got QE if we lived in a monetarist system as a monetarist would of believed it would cause run away inflation (which it did) 

I'd say we live in a neo-Keynesian system. Keynes said run a deficit during the bad times and a surplus during the good. The Tories and Labour appear to run a small deficit during the good and a massive one during the bad.

..and did QE cause runaway inflation? Or is it one of many factors ?

[fraybentos1]

9 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

..and did QE cause runaway inflation? Or is it one of many factors ?

it defo doesn't help

[fraybentos1]

36 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

Yeah I know, I'm saying these measures should be done instead of raising interest rates. The government could've stepped in and said they would deal with inflation via fiscal measures instead.

but the gov didn't do that and the BoE are the ones with the inflation remit and the tool they have is IRs, so they'll raise them

[steviewevie]

All that money making people go out and buy way too much food and energy.

[Guest]

People in this country have had it too good for too long and Superhero Andrew Bailey had to save the day.

[fraybentos1]

I think QE to the tune of like half a trillion pounds since covid might have played a part.

The thing is there actually is still a lot of money floating about- how many people do you know that are properly tightening their belts as if a recession is incoming? Restaurants and pubs are mobbed and people are still going on foreign holidays a lot as far as i can see.

[Neil]

4 hours ago, Ozanne said:

Who on earth would want unemployment over inflation?

thatcher sis who thought it was what the uk needed.

[steviewevie]

Everyone is loaded. The whole food bank thing is fake news.

[steviewevie]

Too many wage increases. Cut wages now!

[Guest]

1 minute ago, steviewevie said:

Too many wage increases. Cut wages now!

Everyone apart from the BoE bosses, they've earned that extra dosh.

[lost]

5 minutes ago, Neil said:

thatcher sis who thought it was what the uk needed.

Happened late 90's under labour too:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/talking_point/198830.stm