news & politics:discussion

[steviewevie]

Or...get a hydrogen boiler, fly in a hydrogen powered plane, drive an electric car, and eat your children.

[mattiloy]

33 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

love the way you're using liberals derogatively, but you're pinning you're hope on the CCP authortarian, non democratic, state allowed free market way of running things because that seems to be the only alternative.

Anyway, pointless saying which ideology is the best, all sides are doing a pretty good job of fucking the planet. Socialism alone isn't going to save the planet, it is going to be have to be a mixure of state intervention, new technologies, and a whole bunch of massive lifestyle changes for a lot of people.

I’m just pointing out that a system that is based on self interest in the immediate term can’t solve a ’tragedy of the commons’ type problem.

The problem as its described now appears to be so serious that it really is only saved by radical govt intervention and probably a big reimagining of what daily life looks like in the future from where folk live to what they eat to how they get around.

I just don’t think that those politicians who have grown up through politics in the 20th century when it was all growth and bombs have it in them.

Biden a mixed bag so far, something at least but not far enough, not fast enough. But Starmer’s comments about rehabilitating Blairism are so pointless and tone deaf. New Labour are trying to fight a war they lost a decade ago. Third way politics didn’t work. The Corbyn era was forward looking, engaged with modern solutions to modern problems.

[reflekting]

Exam results about to become the next crisis, the media will only be talking about the climate crisis for 24 hours you can bet. 

Regarding exams, I can't see how Williamson survives this one. 49% of grades awarded as A or A*, 100% increase. 

[steviewevie]

..maybe this will get a bit of coverage too...

 

[steviewevie]

8 hours ago, mattiloy said:

Biden a mixed bag so far, something at least but not far enough, not fast enough. But Starmer’s comments about rehabilitating Blairism are so pointless and tone deaf. New Labour are trying to fight a war they lost a decade ago. Third way politics didn’t work. The Corbyn era was forward looking, engaged with modern solutions to modern problems.

yeah, agreed...but at same time these people need to get elected. Republicans could win the senate in the mid terms, and then a lot of Biden's plan will be screwed, and then could get a republican president, maybe even Trump, next time around, and then we're all screwed. And for labour, they need to win. People may be all for progressive politics, but if means sacrifices  rather than Johnson's boosterism then labour aren't winning. Maybe it's democracy that's the problem!

[mattiloy]

1 hour ago, steviewevie said:

yeah, agreed...but at same time these people need to get elected. Republicans could win the senate in the mid terms, and then a lot of Biden's plan will be screwed, and then could get a republican president, maybe even Trump, next time around, and then we're all screwed. And for labour, they need to win. People may be all for progressive politics, but if means sacrifices  rather than Johnson's boosterism then labour aren't winning. Maybe it's democracy that's the problem!

 

The left don’t say it’ll mean sacrifices. Only for those at the very top. 

Unfortunately the left says that you get something for nothing its defamed as fantasy politics by the media when it is in fact true. When the right says you get something for nothing its lauded in the media despite being bollocks.

And sadly the centre are all to happy to join in on the defamation dogpile on the left.

If even those supposedly on your own side are calling moderate left wing policies ’looney left’ what hope do you have?

Its a massive stitch up. The centre needs to open their eyes that they are being played hard by rich and powerful people who don’t have their interests at heart.

I would appeal to all centrists to stop reading the news, quit the cynical world weary, nothing can ever get better theatre that they indulge in and just believe for one election cycle.

If they’d have done that in 2017, things would be a damn sight better than they are now.

Even if Starmer gets into power, he’s driven out many left members, he’s handpicking new candidates from the right of the party and promoting the right to all the decision making posts. The leader sets the tone of the government but the advisors, ministers and Labour conference would all be variously responsible for the bones of the policy it implements. Theres very little hope that a Starmer administration would suddenly, against the beliefs of everybody involved, become this radical reforming government.

[squirrelarmy]

4 hours ago, reflekting said:

Exam results about to become the next crisis, the media will only be talking about the climate crisis for 24 hours you can bet. 

Regarding exams, I can't see how Williamson survives this one. 49% of grades awarded as A or A*, 100% increase. 

Is educating students a bad thing? Or don’t the Tories want educated voters?

Should politics be taught in schools? The biggest problems we’ve had over the last 5 years are because of people not understanding what they are voting for. 

[reflekting]

2 hours ago, steviewevie said:

..maybe this will get a bit of coverage too...

 

This will be brushed under the carpet. 

[steviewevie]

1 hour ago, mattiloy said:

 

The left don’t say it’ll mean sacrifices. Only for those at the very top. 

Unfortunately the left says that you get something for nothing its defamed as fantasy politics by the media when it is in fact true. When the right says you get something for nothing its lauded in the media despite being bollocks.

And sadly the centre are all to happy to join in on the defamation dogpile on the left.

If even those supposedly on your own side are calling moderate left wing policies ’looney left’ what hope do you have?

Its a massive stitch up. The centre needs to open their eyes that they are being played hard by rich and powerful people who don’t have their interests at heart.

I would appeal to all centrists to stop reading the news, quit the cynical world weary, nothing can ever get better theatre that they indulge in and just believe for one election cycle.

If they’d have done that in 2017, things would be a damn sight better than they are now.

Even if Starmer gets into power, he’s driven out many left members, he’s handpicking new candidates from the right of the party and promoting the right to all the decision making posts. The leader sets the tone of the government but the advisors, ministers and Labour conference would all be variously responsible for the bones of the policy it implements. Theres very little hope that a Starmer administration would suddenly, against the beliefs of everybody involved, become this radical reforming government.

yeah, well the left and centre keep fighting each other and the tories keep winning.

[steviewevie]

Maybe this climate thing will be similar to covid...in that much of the public will be on board, but there will also be many who are sceptical of what scientist forecasts and criticize any who are being doom and gloom on the media a lot accusing them of doing it for self publicity alone, and Steve Baker and his libertarian chums will set up a climate research group.

[steviewevie]

1 hour ago, squirrelarmy said:

Is educating students a bad thing? Or don’t the Tories want educated voters?

Should politics be taught in schools? The biggest problems we’ve had over the last 5 years are because of people not understanding what they are voting for. 

they need to be taught tories=bad, labour=good. Over and over again, until they get it right.

[steviewevie]

 

[Guest]

2 hours ago, steviewevie said:

yeah, well the left and centre keep fighting each other and the tories keep winning.

I’m not so sure, there’s increasing talk of opposition parties working together to ensure we boot the Tories out of power. Starmer is key in all of this though, he needs to support it. 

[steviewevie]

1 minute ago, Ozanne said:

I’m not so sure, there’s increasing talk of opposition parties working together to ensure we boot the Tories out of power. Starmer is key in all of this though, he needs to support it. 

I'll believe it when I see it.

[steviewevie]

 

[Gilgamesh69]

Heheh

[fred quimby]

6 hours ago, squirrelarmy said:

Is educating students a bad thing? Or don’t the Tories want educated voters?

Should politics be taught in schools? The biggest problems we’ve had over the last 5 years are because of people not understanding what they are voting for. 

Well it is easier to keep down and manipulate the uneducated 

[mattiloy]

[mattiloy]

On 8/10/2021 at 10:53 AM, squirrelarmy said:

Is educating students a bad thing? Or don’t the Tories want educated voters?

Should politics be taught in schools? The biggest problems we’ve had over the last 5 years are because of people not understanding what they are voting for. 

Lol have you ever met a politics student? They are the thickest of all.

An education system based on developing critical thinking, mental and physical wellbeing, and the pursuit of intellectual curiosity would produce better outcomes IMO.

Instead they are going to teach them latin… in fact I wouldn’t be shocked if they brought back the cane at the point.

[Crazyfool01]

Labour voters posting when the tories make gains in the polls is truly bizarre to me .... its like me posting the premier league table when my team  are bottom,  if im not keen on the manager I still  wouldn't be posting it .... and id still be backing my team whoever leads it ..... maybe hoping that the incumbent might change 

[mattiloy]

13 minutes ago, crazyfool1 said:

Labour voters posting when the tories make gains in the polls is truly bizarre to me .... its like me posting the premier league table when my team  are bottom,  if im not keen on the manager I still  wouldn't be posting it .... and id still be backing my team whoever leads it ..... maybe hoping that the incumbent might change 

What about non labour voters posting it?

[Crazyfool01]

17 minutes ago, mattiloy said:

What about non labour voters posting it?

fair enough 🙂 not a Labour voter then ? 

Edited August 11, 2021 by crazyfool1

[mattiloy]

1 hour ago, crazyfool1 said:

fair enough 🙂 not a Labour voter then ? 

No sir. I’ll be voting Green at the next GE and hoping for a hung parliament in which Starmer has to offer PR and indyref2 in order to build a coalition.

After that I’ll probably vote for the momentum party that emerges from the post-two-party-system dust. Or maybe Green to be fair. Depending on the policies. But usually I feel my tolerance for the extreme fringes of the left (communists) is greater than my tolerance for the extreme fringes of the greens (homeopaths/hari krishnas), so my natural home is probs with the left.

[steviewevie]

5 minutes ago, mattiloy said:

No sir. I’ll be voting Green at the next GE and hoping for a hung parliament in which Starmer has to offer PR and indyref2 in order to build a coalition.

After that I’ll probably vote for the momentum party that emerges from the post-two-party-system dust. Or maybe Green to be fair. Depending on the policies. But usually I feel my tolerance for the extreme fringes of the left (communists) is greater than my tolerance for the extreme fringes of the greens (homeopaths/hari krishnas), so my natural home is probs with the left.

Doesn't voting green make a hung parliament less likely? I guess depends where voting.

[mattiloy]

5 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

Doesn't voting green make a hung parliament less likely? I guess depends where voting.

In a 15% Labour majority seat. But thats by the by. No chance Keir Stalin goes for an electoral pact, It’ll be upto the voters to figure it out. And none of that horrible lib dem favouring (probably funded) fake tactical vote website bollocks. But i have faith!

Edited August 11, 2021 by mattiloy