Download 2023

[gabrielomachado]

5 minutes ago, jump said:

Why are so many people talking about how Gojira, Bring Me, Queens, Ghost or Five Finger can’t headline when fucking Def Leppard have headliner 3 times in 10 years. The bar to headline Download isn’t very high despite people’s expectations that only mega bands can do it.

that's what i think, Ghost are playing O2 in london, so did Alter Bridge and BMTH multiple times. FFDP in 2017 pulled a crowd bigger than any headliner that year, i don't know what doesn't make those bands bigger than Def Leppard and KISS

[gabrielomachado]

if they really want to get BIG next year and put a 2 Mainstage setup (with Mainstages side by side)

Thursday

MS1 (Knotfest UK): SLIPKNOT / Gojira / Killswitch Engage

MS2: BRING ME THE HORIZON / Parkway Drive / Bury Tomorrow

___

Friday

MS1: METALLICA / Alter Bridge / Halestorm

MS2: GHOST / Trivium / Mudvayne

__

Saturday

MS1: RAGE AGAINST THE MACHINE / Run The Jewels / While She Sleeps

MS2: FIVE FINGER DEATH PUNCH / Limp Bizkit / Papa Roach

___

Sunday

MS1: SYSTEM OF A DOWN / Disturbed / The Offspring

MS2: JUDAS PRIEST / Lamb Of God / Amon Amarth

[Xeph1995]

6 minutes ago, gabrielomachado said:

if they really want to get BIG next year and put a 2 Mainstage setup (with Mainstages side by side)

Having been to a festival where the main stages are side by side it's an awful set up imo, Sonisphere had the the best set up, main stage with the second stage about 200/300 meters away from it directly infront facing each other, then stagger the bands. As soon as the band finishes you turn arround and walk the other way and the sound check should already be done. 

The double main stage is terrible for a good view. 

 

Edited June 13, 2022 by Xeph1995

[gabrielomachado]

4 minutes ago, Xeph1995 said:

Having been to a festival where the main stages are side by side it's an awful set up imo, Sonisphere had the the best set up Main stage with the second stage about 200/300 meters away from it directly infront with them facing each other, and stagger the banda.

The double main stage is terrible for a good view. 

 

went to a few festivals with main stages side by side and i think it works pretty well, Download itself already did it in 2010 with AC/DC

[justanothername]

1 hour ago, Andre91 said:

FFDP are ready for it, without question. Always tonnes of their merch on display and they pull headline sized crowds. I don’t think many would grumble if they were given the opportunity as they’re really popular with the DL audience. 

I won't deny that they're ready for it but if FFDP before BMTH it just doesn't feel right to me

1 hour ago, maddiet96 said:

Thoughts?

Looks like a  pretty standard download line up to me though Denzel Curry is a nice little curveball. I know people on here talk about getting hip hop acts at Download but apart from Die Antwoord it hasn't happened. I think Run the Jewels, Denzel, Death Grips, clipping. and maybe Danny Brown and Injury Reserve could go down well at Download.

[justanothername]

Also speaking of undercard can we get Knocked Loose on the main and finally book Full of Hell please?

[Andre91]

7 hours ago, justanothername said:

I won't deny that they're ready for it but if FFDP before BMTH it just doesn't feel right to me

 

I agree wholeheartedly. BMTH are the one who are most ready and should be first in line. 

[thewayiam]

9 hours ago, gabrielomachado said:

that's what i think, Ghost are playing O2 in london, so did Alter Bridge and BMTH multiple times. FFDP in 2017 pulled a crowd bigger than any headliner that year, i don't know what doesn't make those bands bigger than Def Leppard and KISS

It's not the fans fault that Download continue to book bands to headline that are constantly repeated. Just because a band gets a bigger crowd that a headliner that doesn't justify their size as bigger automatically. This has happened with many lower down bands. 

[Xeph1995]

24 minutes ago, thewayiam said:

It's not the fans fault that Download continue to book bands to headline that are constantly repeated. Just because a band gets a bigger crowd that a headliner that doesn't justify their size as bigger automatically. This has happened with many lower down bands. 

It's more to do with what's on at the same time and what time of day it is. Also I was at 2017 and I'm pretty sure they didn't have the biggest crowd, definitely not the most dense, I think if your on during the mainstage especially at download during the day it looks like you pull more people because loads of people just congregate near it waiting for people of other bands ect. 

Im pretty sure the System crowd was the biggest. 

Edited June 14, 2022 by Xeph1995

[BenG92]

22 minutes ago, thewayiam said:

It's not the fans fault that Download continue to book bands to headline that are constantly repeated. Just because a band gets a bigger crowd that a headliner that doesn't justify their size as bigger automatically. This has happened with many lower down bands. 

It really depends if those bands are pulling unique crowds, which is gonna be hard for us to tell on the outside.

As in, everyone's been talking about Biffy's small crowd this year, but if those people came FOR Biffy then it was worth booking them. Same thing that happened with Tool although that was still a much bigger crowd for their first UK show in 13 years. But half the people at that festival didn't even know who they were. 

Also no thank you to the double stage setup. It might work better for metal fans because they're generally less dickish, but it absolutely sucked at Primavera the other week because of the amount of people who just talked through entire sets waiting for the next band. 

[jump]

3 minutes ago, thewayiam said:

It's not the fans fault that Download continue to book bands to headline that are constantly repeated. Just because a band gets a bigger crowd that a headliner that doesn't justify their size as bigger automatically. This has happened with many lower down bands. 

I don't know about that. There are lots boring people who shout down the suggestion of any sort of upcoming band becoming a headliner and would rather count the number of songs they know or look at ticket prices and just settle for that as "they are headliners already" or "I want my money's worth" rather than watching a band hitting their peak form to become a headliner at that very moment.

In any case if a band is getting a bigger crowd than their spot suggests than bump them up a slot up next time so if a band is playing at the top end of the card and the only place to move upto is headline then perhaps they should just headline...

[Xeph1995]

I think people forget about a big factor of wether a band headlines or not is how big a part of the cultural zeitgeist they are, most download headliners are know by large numbers of people who aren't even necessarily big into rock/metal. 

Bands like FFDP have almost no crossover so aren't pulling people who wouldn't usually go anyway. 

Someone who doesn't normally go to download might buy a ticket to see a band like Tool, RATM ect.

Leeds/Reading will have sold loads of tickets just because people want to see Rage and that festival is for more pop than alt now. 

Edited June 14, 2022 by Xeph1995

[BenG92]

I think we need to see some co-headline splits to bump more people up. Korn/Deftones, Architects/Parkway, Bullet/ADTR, that kinda thing. There just aren't enough acts going that can move up on their own, we're all repeating the same handful. 

[jump]

10 minutes ago, Xeph1995 said:

I think people forget about a big factor of wether a band headlines or not is how big a part of the cultural zeitgeist they are, most download headliners are know by large numbers of people who aren't even necessarily big into rock/metal. 

Bands like FFDP have almost no crossover so aren't pulling people who wouldn't usually go anyway. 

Someone who doesn't normally go to download might buy a ticket to see a band like Tool, RATM ect.

Leeds/Reading will have sold loads of tickets just because people want to see Rage and that festival is for more pop than alt now. 

So Download needs to book more pop acts in the hope Karen from HR and your Aunt Betty will want to go to Download too? 😜 

The Rage day was the last to sell out at R&L and it's gonna be a load of shit to see them there. 

[Xeph1995]

5 minutes ago, jump said:

So Download needs to book more pop acts in the hope Karen from HR and your Aunt Betty will want to go to Download too? 😜 

The Rage day was the last to sell out at R&L and it's gonna be a load of shit to see them there. 

I'm not saying I agree but that's clearly how Copping runs the business.

Bands like Korn,Deftones and Qotsa all could have headlined and been given the bump awhile ago but it's not happened. 

Edited June 14, 2022 by Xeph1995

[jump]

6 minutes ago, BenG92 said:

I think we need to see some co-headline splits to bump more people up. Korn/Deftones, Architects/Parkway, Bullet/ADTR, that kinda thing. There just aren't enough acts going that can move up on their own, we're all repeating the same handful. 

I like the idea but more so to stop twats from moaning this band isn't big enough to headline if they have already "headlined" before. So have Slipknot "headline" but with Ghost or whoever "co-headline" under them and then just have them straight up headline next time.

[BenG92]

3 minutes ago, jump said:

I like the idea but more so to stop twats from moaning this band isn't big enough to headline if they have already "headlined" before. So have Slipknot "headline" but with Ghost or whoever "co-headline" under them and then just have them straight up headline next time.

Frees up so much space on the bill to bump everyone else up as well. Imagine a Download with, say, AC/DC and 4 splits, it'll get the regulars in for a big AC/DC show, and then there's a ton of room to move bands like Mastodon and The Darkness to main stage subs where they belong.

[jump]

14 minutes ago, Xeph1995 said:

I'm not saying I agree but that's clearly how Copping runs the business.

Bands like Korn,Deftones and Qotsa all could have headlined and been given the bump awhile ago but it's not happened. 

It has worked with Slipknot and A7X already though. People seem to forget that there were gatekeeping moans of they aren't headliners when they first headlined and that perception has only changed exactly because they did get the chance to headline and fucking smashed it. 

Queens is a different kettle of fish to Deftones. They played once and rather begrudgingly as part of a package deal to sub Download and then (co-)headline R&L the next year in Live Nation's attempt to kill off Sonisphere. Since then they have been booked to headline R&L again, played big gigs like Finsbury Park and The O2 which keep in mind is a big venue that Slipknot didn't play till 10ish years after first headlining Download.

[BenG92]

The more I think about it the more I like it. Quickly cobbled together without much thought but it really bulks out the poster in a satisfying way. That's a moneysworth festival in my eyes. Rather this than Def Leppard for the 4th time. 

[Xeph1995]

19 minutes ago, jump said:

It has worked with Slipknot and A7X already though. People seem to forget that there were gatekeeping moans of they aren't headliners when they first headlined and that perception has only changed exactly because they did get the chance to headline and fucking smashed it. 

Queens is a different kettle of fish to Deftones. They played once and rather begrudgingly as part of a package deal to sub Download and then (co-)headline R&L the next year in Live Nation's attempt to kill off Sonisphere. Since then they have been booked to headline R&L again, played big gigs like Finsbury Park and The O2 which keep in mind is a big venue that Slipknot didn't play till 10ish years after first headlining Download.

Slipknot's rise was quite monumental though, I don't think another band had such an impact in the metal scene in the 2000s as they did, they blew up everywhere, to me it was a no brainer that they got bumped and tbf to them they put on a hell of a show. 

All Hope is Gone was HUGE. 

I don't remember that far back in detail to remember the moans tbh so maybe are right people should just be given the chance. 

On a side note I miss Sonisphere it was great. 

Edited June 14, 2022 by Xeph1995

[thewayiam]

1 hour ago, jump said:

I don't know about that. There are lots boring people who shout down the suggestion of any sort of upcoming band becoming a headliner and would rather count the number of songs they know or look at ticket prices and just settle for that as "they are headliners already" or "I want my money's worth" rather than watching a band hitting their peak form to become a headliner at that very moment.

In any case if a band is getting a bigger crowd than their spot suggests than bump them up a slot up next time so if a band is playing at the top end of the card and the only place to move upto is headline then perhaps they should just headline...

Yeah there is an element to that top bit in fairness.  

18 minutes ago, BenG92 said:

The more I think about it the more I like it. Quickly cobbled together without much thought but it really bulks out the poster in a satisfying way. That's a moneysworth festival in my eyes. Rather this than Def Leppard for the 4th time. 

Unfortunately I think Korn and Deftones still looks weak for the top line here. I've heard people saying Deftones were rubbish too. It certainly wouldn't get my money but that's fine. 

[jump]

28 minutes ago, Xeph1995 said:

Slipknot's rise was quite monumental though, I don't think another band had such an impact in the metal scene in the 2000s as they did, they blew up everywhere, to me it was a no brainer that they got bumped and tbf to them they put on a hell of a show. 

All Hope is Gone was HUGE. 

I don't remember that far back to remember to moans tbh so manybe are right. 

Thats revisionists, the year before Slipknot headlined Download they were booked third down at R&L and on the same album. They didn't just suddenly become a bigger name during that time as they were a big name from the impact of their first album and a big crowd favourite.

Edited June 14, 2022 by jump

[BenG92]

9 minutes ago, thewayiam said:

Unfortunately I think Korn and Deftones still looks weak for the top line here. I've heard people saying Deftones were rubbish too. It certainly wouldn't get my money but that's fine. 

That's the thing, it'll always look weak until they pull the trigger and just do it, same with new full headliners. 

Even as a Deftones fan I can admit that their open air shows aren't as good as indoor and even then they're a better studio band - but Korn seem to consistently knock it out and a back2back of the two given 1:30 each would be great. 

[Andre91]

1. A Day To Remember did not have a small crowd this year. I know what my eyes saw. 

 

2. Slipknot headlining in 2009 was ridiculed when it was announced because people said they weren’t a headline band. This isn’t opinion, it is objective fact. It happened. 
 

3. Saying a band didn’t actually have a big crowd because it could have just been people stood about or milling around is genuinely mental. If people are stood there watching, they’re part of the crowd. It is objective fact that FFDP pulled a headliner sized crowd in 2017. Again, I know what my eyes saw. 

 

[Andre91]

1 minute ago, BenG92 said:

That's the thing, it'll always look weak until they pull the trigger and just do it, same with new full headliners. 

Even as a Deftones fan I can admit that their open air shows aren't as good as indoor and even then they're a better studio band - but Korn seem to consistently knock it out and a back2back of the two given 1:30 each would be great. 

The sound for Deftones this past weekend was dire. It really diminished their set. 
 

KoRn on the other hand were absolutely phenomenal. They have a back catalogue full of songs that are so, so widely well known at DL and pull a headliner sized crowd ever single time. They should have been given the bump up a couple of years ago. I think they still have a chance to once the dinosaurs start dropping off more but then KoRn themselves will become one of those repeated headliner bookings that become stale fast. 
 

Once your KISS, Maiden and Def Leps clear off, DL will just rely on Slipknot, SOAD and A7X even more than they already do.