Future headliners

[gigpusher]

The casual misogyny on here gets a bit much at times. Mums listen to all sorts of music. It seems like Mums is often shorthand for people who just aren't that into music and that is not all Mums. Some Mums really love their music. Lauren Laverne is a mum, as  is Annie Mac, Jo Whiley etc. You can bet your ass they are listening to all sorts of music!! 

[gfa]

1 hour ago, Jose Pose said:

My mum knew who Stormzy was when he was announced to headline and she’s in her seventies, she text me about it. He was even on a Louis theoroux doc.

I very much doubt my mum will ever know who Fred Again is. 

Stormzy then vs fred again now are different stages of their career. Good chance she wouldn't have known who stormzy was 2-3 years prior to that. Fred Again has plenty of time to grow, ruling him out on being a dance act grounds is ridiculous when dance acts are clearly capable of headlining your creamfields, tomorrowland etc.

Not to mention the fact dance acts have headlined in the past? Seems unfair to categorically rule out a genre that has done it before and will inevitably do it again

Mum argument is silly ^ will avoid in the future.

[Jose Pose]

36 minutes ago, gfa said:

Stormzy then vs fred again now are different stages of their career. Good chance she wouldn't have known who stormzy was 2-3 years prior to that. Fred Again has plenty of time to grow, ruling him out on being a dance act grounds is ridiculous when dance acts are clearly capable of headlining your creamfields, tomorrowland etc.

Not to mention the fact dance acts have headlined in the past? Seems unfair to categorically rule out a genre that has done it before and will inevitably do it again

Mum argument is silly ^ will avoid in the future.

Nobody is ruling them out, just saying it’s less likely due to the Genre.

Chemical Brothers headlined the Pyramid 20 years ago, but have only headlined the other several times since.

Do you think Fred Again is as big as the Chemical brothers, or will one day be bigger than the Chemical Brothers?

If you think Fred Again could headline Pyramid, why haven’t Chemical Brothers since, or indeed the prodigy?

[gfa]

5 minutes ago, Jose Pose said:

Nobody is ruling them out, just saying it’s less likely due to the Genre.

Chemical Brothers headlined the Pyramid 20 years ago, but have only headlined the other several times since.

Do you think Fred Again is as big as the Chemical brothers, or will one day be bigger than the Chemical Brothers?

If you think Fred Again could headline Pyramid, why haven’t Chemical Brothers since, or indeed the prodigy?

The Chemical Brothers turned it down around 2004/2005 i've definitely heard before, choosing to do Other instead. Someone can probably confirm

Acts and genres do come and go - big beat literally is a dead genre with no new artists coming through at this point. That doesn't mean new genres of dance can't rise up though

[Jose Pose]

Just now, gfa said:

The Chemical Brothers turned it down around 2004/2005 i've definitely heard before, choosing to do Other instead. Someone can probably confirm

Acts and genres do come and go - big beat literally is a dead genre with no new artists coming through at this point. That doesn't mean new genres of dance can't rise up though

Whether you like it or not, a huge amount of people see music as someone singing into a microphone (doesn’t matter if that’s a rapper or a rocker) or/and musical instruments. Dance is, and always will be a sub genre of music to many people and hence there will always be an extra barrier to it headlining the Pyramid, festivals like creamfields couldn’t be less comparable, they are literally dance music festivals. We’re talking specifically about the Pyramid stage at Glastonbury here.

2004/5 was nearly 20 years ago now, do you honestly think they’d turn down the Pyramid again now if asked? Do you think they have been asked since? Or the Prodigy? 

[gfa]

4 minutes ago, Jose Pose said:

Whether you like it or not, a huge amount of people see music as someone singing into a microphone (doesn’t matter if that’s a rapper or a rocker) or/and musical instruments. Dance is, and always will be a sub genre of music to many people and hence there will always be an extra barrier to it headlining the Pyramid, festivals like creamfields couldn’t be less comparable, they are literally dance music festivals. We’re talking specifically about the Pyramid stage at Glastonbury here.

2004/5 was nearly 20 years ago now, do you honestly think they’d turn down the Pyramid again now if asked? Do you think they have been asked since? Or the Prodigy? 

I've just noticed that I thought you were one of the two people on the last page who said it was flat out not possible.

I agree there is the extra barrier. Not sure the second point is all that relevant, they passed it at the time and thats the key thing

[BambooShanks]

1 hour ago, gfa said:

Fred Again has plenty of time to grow, ruling him out on being a dance act grounds is ridiculous when dance acts are clearly capable of headlining your creamfields, tomorrowland

The hype train off the back of his Boiler Room set (which I'll gladly admit I'm all aboard) has got him a bit  of mainstream attention and If he headlines West Holts or Other stage this year, smashes it and releases an album that has the success and ubiquity of Fat of the Land or Surrender then he'll be putting himself in contention for a pyramid spot in '25 I reckon.

 

 

 

[dreams_burn_down]

24 minutes ago, BambooShanks said:

If he... releases an album that has the success and ubiquity of Fat of the Land or Surrender then he'll be putting himself in contention for a pyramid spot in '25 I reckon.

 

 

 

The word "if" is doing some very heavy lifting here

[CaledonianGonzo]

He needs a hit single first.

[listenstolotsofcrap]

As much fanfare and hype Fred has now, I see his ceiling as a Reading and Leeds headliner but not Pyramid. I could be wrong and only time will tell, but I'm just not sure that there's much potential in Fred being a household name to the majority of people who attend Glastonbury in the way in which Stormzy and Billie Eilish, other newer/young artists are. Don't really think he's got any big hits as others have said.

Dua Lipa/Dave/Sam Fender/Olivia Rodrigo/Harry Styles I can definitely see, 1975 I'd have thought would be there now

Little Simz/Fred Again../George Ezra would really depend on what their output and the national reception to that work is in the coming years but all certainly have strong fan bases / good reception currently

[BambooShanks]

17 minutes ago, dreams_burn_down said:

The word "if" is doing some very heavy lifting here

Very heavy lifting but that would be the route for him  to get a pyramid headline slot

20 minutes ago, listenstolotsofcrap said:

I could be wrong and only time will tell, but I'm just not sure that there's much potential in Fred being a household name

Depends on who appears with him on the next album.  Calvin Harris went from being relatively popular to every-fucking-where after "we found love" with Rihanna so it's not out the realms of possibility.

On the other hand, he could quite easily not go down the mainstream route and continue making his Actual Life albums which usually have a banger or two on them but not as likely to gather the mainstream appeal required to get a pyramid headline slot.

 

 

 

[gfa]

7 minutes ago, BambooShanks said:

Very heavy lifting but that would be the route for him  to get a pyramid headline slot

Depends on who appears with him on the next album.  Calvin Harris went from being relatively popular to every-fucking-where after "we found love" with Rihanna so it's not out the realms of possibility.

On the other hand, he could quite easily not go down the mainstream route and continue making his Actual Life albums which usually have a banger or two on them but not as likely to gather the mainstream appeal required to get a pyramid headline slot.

Calvin Harris had a few big songs before We Found Love but it was that 18 months album that really cemented him.

Collabs are a huge part of a dance act's success in reaching the mainstream and Fred is incredibly well positioned to take advantage of that.

[CaledonianGonzo]

Calvin Harris isn't a Pyramid Headliner....

[listenstolotsofcrap]

37 minutes ago, BambooShanks said:

On the other hand, he could quite easily not go down the mainstream route and continue making his Actual Life albums which usually have a banger or two on them but not as likely to gather the mainstream appeal required to get a pyramid headline slot.

Fred is certainly at a point where he's going to go one of two ways I think. The momentum is certainly there to attract a larger audience if that's what they wish to do though like you say.

A big live performance on the Pyramid with all those guests, I'm just not sure I see it though. Disclosure had a fair few collaborations that were great chart hits but their ceiling has remained below headlining as has Calvin Harris. I would like to add that I think the festival could see how newer, more 'contemporary' acts are received but they'd have to maintain a strong other 2 headliners to coincide with this.

Edited January 11, 2023 by listenstolotsofcrap

[The-Heartbreak-Kid]

1 hour ago, CaledonianGonzo said:

Calvin Harris isn't a Pyramid Headliner....

Not even his real name anyway.

[gfa]

1 hour ago, CaledonianGonzo said:

Calvin Harris isn't a Pyramid Headliner....

Never said he was, i meant cemented as like top of his game - big act thats stuck around with a decent back catalogue

Edited January 11, 2023 by gfa

[BenG92]

22 hours ago, gigpusher said:

The casual misogyny on here gets a bit much at times. Mums listen to all sorts of music. It seems like Mums is often shorthand for people who just aren't that into music and that is not all Mums. Some Mums really love their music. Lauren Laverne is a mum, as  is Annie Mac, Jo Whiley etc. You can bet your ass they are listening to all sorts of music!! 

"dad rock" to describe tripe like Status Quo is also a thing though. Equal opportunity bashing. Can't imagine anyone's doing it with any real malice. 

[Florian Saucer Attack]

2 hours ago, BenG92 said:

"dad rock" to describe tripe like Status Quo is also a thing though. Equal opportunity bashing. Can't imagine anyone's doing it with any real malice. 

Anyone who uses the term dad rock is a music snob and an ageist

Go back to my comments on Saturday for a thorough explanation 

[gigpusher]

7 hours ago, BenG92 said:

"dad rock" to describe tripe like Status Quo is also a thing though. Equal opportunity bashing. Can't imagine anyone's doing it with any real malice. 

Dad rock is also not great (no stereotyping is) but it is at least describing a type of person that does exist in that there are lots of older men who like white men with guitars solely as their type of music. The Mum comments effectively equate Mums as the sort of people who don't actually know much. It is an awful lot more derogatory. 

[giantkatestacks]

Yeah the equivalent would be like 'mum dance' or 'mum rock' in reality there isnt any of those just the fact that mums only like Westlife or some such. Which is a bit odd as you are basically just saying women. 

 

[BenG92]

4 hours ago, Florian Saucer Attack said:

Anyone who uses the term dad rock is a music snob and an ageist

Go back to my comments on Saturday for a thorough explanation 

1 minute ago, gigpusher said:

Dad rock is also not great (no stereotyping is) but it is at least describing a type of person that does exist in that there are lots of older men who like white men with guitars solely as their type of music. The Mum comments effectively equate Mums as the sort of people who don't actually know much. It is an awful lot more derogatory. 

I agree that they're both snobbish, and to be honest the term dad rock today is kinda silly anyway when the actual dad rock now is Nirvana and Oasis, actually maybe even newer. Doesn't mean kids don't listen to either - they do. But for me "mum music" doesn't mean they're clueless, it's always been inoffensive, light, radio-friendly pop rock i.e. Lewis Capaldi, George Ezra. See also: "Tesco music". But again, plenty of kids listening to Lewis Capaldi. 

I really don't think it's misogynistic at all personally when a counterpart exists in dads listening exclusively to very old guitar bands. I still use both so I apologise to any mums and dads I'm offending in advance, no harm meant, to me it's literally no worse than "kids these days". Only ever a light-hearted jab when I use it. Same with camping chair crew, picnic blanket gang, fossils at Download, the yoof, Tiktok kids, etc.

And hey, my own ma listens mostly to Dolly, Shania and Celine, thus doesn't even fit my bill, so what do I know? 

[Florian Saucer Attack]

3 minutes ago, gigpusher said:

Dad rock is also not great (no stereotyping is) but it is at least describing a type of person that does exist in that there are lots of older men who like white men with guitars solely as their type of music. The Mum comments effectively equate Mums as the sort of people who don't actually know much. It is an awful lot more derogatory. 

the definition of dad rock is all rock music that is over twenty years old and all rock music from the last 20 years that has traits of rock music that is over 20 years old.

The gender or race of the artist does not matter; Jimi Hendrix and the Runaways are dad rock.

While it is true that some older men like rock music it is also true that humans of every age and gender category like rock music. This is such a painfully obvious point but it needs to be explained regularly 

[CaledonianGonzo]

Mansplained, in fact.

[BenG92]

7 minutes ago, Florian Saucer Attack said:

the definition of dad rock is all rock music that is over twenty years old and all rock music from the last 20 years that has traits of rock music that is over 20 years old.

The gender or race of the artist does not matter; Jimi Hendrix and the Runaways are dad rock.

While it is true that some older men like rock music it is also true that humans of every age and gender category like rock music. This is such a painfully obvious point but it needs to be explained regularly 

To add to this, you could tell me Pink Floyd are dad rock, I wouldn't disagree, and I'm off to see Roger Waters in June because I love Pink Floyd. I'm a few years off being a dad yet. Again, it's all in good fun from most people. You can usually tell when the snotty types are actually being snotty about it.

Edited January 12, 2023 by BenG92

[Jose Pose]

On 1/11/2023 at 11:06 AM, gigpusher said:

The casual misogyny on here gets a bit much at times. Mums listen to all sorts of music. It seems like Mums is often shorthand for people who just aren't that into music and that is not all Mums. Some Mums really love their music. Lauren Laverne is a mum, as  is Annie Mac, Jo Whiley etc. You can bet your ass they are listening to all sorts of music!! 

A but pointlessly pedantic really, I used my mum specifically as an example based on me knowing her and her music taste, and the fact that she knows who Stormzy is, but will probably never know who who Fred Again is.

Of course there are always exceptions to anything, but Lauren Laverne Annie Mac and Jo Whiley are radio DJs, how many mums in the world are radio djs? How much of the population are radio djs? 0.00000001%? Most people’s mums aren’t Djs or radio Djs, using such extreme examples to disprove something only serves to actually undermine the point you’re tying to make.

Edited January 12, 2023 by Jose Pose