Rail Strikes announced

[mattiloy]

1 hour ago, DeanoL said:

Or nationalise. I'd love to see the unions just go "right, permanent strike until nationalisation is agreed". Actually fix the underlying problem. Then we don't have to look at it under the lens of supply and demand anymore.

I get people's arguments, but these sort of cuts have been happening it lots of places: city centre venues, restaurants, bars and cafes to name one big sector. And no-one gives a fuck. "Not my problem". 

And kudos to railway workers for effectively unionising and so being able to say "well, we're going to make it your problem". That means there's more attention, more eyes and more discussion about it. But that's the only reason. Someone's job on the railway is no more inherently valuable than someone's job in Costa. It's just as shit for both of them to lose those jobs. But while they both remain private enterprises, they will be measured on profit and so falling demand will mean cuts to jobs and prices increases to customers.

I've always found unions to be a little odd. I'm pro-union, in that I feel they should exist, they should represent the needs and wants of their members, there should be enough that everyone can be in one and employees should be protected from any comeback from joining one.

But beyond that, the do and *should* exist as selfish entities there purely for the benefit of their members and no-one else. Which means, if I'm not a member, that doesn't mean just because I consider myself left-wing, I should be in support of every union action by default. Doesn't mean I won't be, but I think any action has to be judged on its own merits.

Unionisation is simply about levelling the playing field in the allocation of the fruits of Labour and capital.

When it comes to deciding who gets what out of a company’s revenue, the shareholders and the administrators they appoint to run the company, will always tend to favour themselves. Maximising their dividends/capital gains requires maximising the pot from which they take their dividends. That means minimising costs, including staff costs. An individual worker is easy to replace, but an entire workforce with the credible threat of industrial action levels the playing field.

The results are plain to see - after Thatcher weakened the unions, real wage growth has been sluggish for most working people, whilst the real value of capital and related income has boomed.

Without demonstrating that the credible threat of industrial action is indeed credible (and there are so many regulatory hoops for them to jump through just to call a strike) the unions would be completely toothless and the gap between capitalist income and worker income would grow even further.

Join a union. Support the strikers!

[steviewevie]

[Pateen]

Do you realise how much these drivers actually get paid. 

Serious wads from day one, in comparison to graduates who come out with huge debts after studying or trades men who earn very little while training, all these guys are doing fine.

Just putting us all over a barrel

[zahidf]

32 minutes ago, Pateen said:

Am I very naive in thinking the festival organisers will help with more buses.

There are so many people affected by this

They havent even made a statement, so i wouldnt hold your breath. Theyll just say 'make alternative arrangements. GOOD LUCK'

[Rose-Colored Boy]

1 minute ago, Pateen said:

Do you realise how much these drivers actually get paid. 

Serious wads from day one, in comparison to graduates who come out with huge debts after studying or trades men who earn very little while training, all these guys are doing fine.

Just putting us all over a barrel

Do you realise that drivers are only a fairly small part of the rail industry? Very few people beyond drivers - and indeed not all drivers - are on even close to that kind of money. I’ve moved up the ladder now but when I started out six years ago I was on minimum wage. 

Also if your job carried a very real and direct threat of blowing suicidal people to smithereens at 100mph I think you’d want to be fairly compensated for that too. 

[bexj]

6 minutes ago, Pateen said:

Do you realise how much these drivers actually get paid. 

Serious wads from day one, in comparison to graduates who come out with huge debts after studying or trades men who earn very little while training, all these guys are doing fine.

Just putting us all over a barrel

With responsibility for several hundred passengers in a hurtling tin can and people that chose to end their lives infront of your cab.   How much would YOU want to do that job?

Edited June 8, 2022 by bexj

[glimmers_of_hope]

Just reorganised my travel arrangements from Thursday to Wednesday. I guess the upside is I will have longer on the farm. The downside is that I have to take another day holiday and my wife will be looking after the kids for an extra day on her own.

[Jay Pee]

My mate w*nks it off as a pretend accountant and earns 140k a year 

Train drivers are underpaid

[clarkete]

7 minutes ago, Jay Pee said:

My mate w*nks it off as a pretend accountant and earns 140k a year 

Train drivers are underpaid

And as with so many customer facing staff these days, treated like sh*te. 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-leeds-61710427

[DeanoL]

1 hour ago, mattiloy said:

Unionisation is simply about levelling the playing field in the allocation of the fruits of Labour and capital.

Yup. I guess my point is, I'm a socialist. Unions act for the benefit of their members, not society as a whole. It's why I don't personally seem them as closely aligned to the left as others do.

[squirrelarmy]

1 hour ago, Madyaker said:

I had no idea the UKs rail service was privately owned. That’s nuts. Public transport is one of the things that should always be state owned

It’s worse than that. A large part of the services are owned by Germanys DB, Frances SNCF and the Dutch NS

Their parent countries subsidise the rail networks and we contribute towards the profits. 

[Rose-Colored Boy]

11 minutes ago, squirrelarmy said:

It’s worse than that. A large part of the services are owned by Germanys DB, Frances SNCF and the Dutch NS

Their parent countries subsidise the rail networks and we contribute towards the profits. 

If our trains themselves were anywhere near as nice as the continental ICE services we’d be on to a winner 

Edited June 8, 2022 by Rose-Colored Boy

[mattiloy]

14 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

Yup. I guess my point is, I'm a socialist. Unions act for the benefit of their members, not society as a whole. It's why I don't personally seem them as closely aligned to the left as others do.

I think I understand what you mean, that the unions should be superceded by something that represents all workers. And thats exactly why the unions, being the first mass movement of organised solidarity acting on behalf of workers in the respective sectors, set up the Labour Party.

Unfortunately the latest iteration of that party doesn’t do a very good job of that anymore so unions are more necessary than ever.

[steviewevie]

38 minutes ago, mattiloy said:

I think I understand what you mean, that the unions should be superceded by something that represents all workers. And thats exactly why the unions, being the first mass movement of organised solidarity acting on behalf of workers in the respective sectors, set up the Labour Party.

Unfortunately the latest iteration of that party doesn’t do a very good job of that anymore so unions are more necessary than ever.

I mean, we don't live in a socialist country so unions are all there is for many workers. 

[Rose-Colored Boy]

Times have been changed slightly - https://www.rmt.org.uk/news/members-updates/defend-jobs-pay-and-conditions--network-rail080622/?preview=true

Should mean services run later into the evening on Wednesday 22nd, for anyone travelling to Glastonbury after work that day.

Edited June 8, 2022 by Rose-Colored Boy

[clarkete]

If you ever worked in a place where the company attempted to stitch you up and your comparatively small union subs enabled you to have someone come and support you or provide legal representation, then you'd soon see the value of being in a union. 

Even purely on a monetary level, there can be times that unions help you if your needs extend beyond what the company entitles you to. 

[Euphoricape]

I'm hoping there will be trains running from taunton to castle cary on the Wednesday, as that's gonna be the main station people are changing trains. Surely they aren't gonna have thousands of people just stranded in Taunton Station.

[GT3]

2 hours ago, Pateen said:

Do you realise how much these drivers actually get paid. 

Serious wads from day one, in comparison to graduates who come out with huge debts after studying or trades men who earn very little while training, all these guys are doing fine.

Just putting us all over a barrel

Drivers aren’t in the RMT nor have they been balloted for strike action so not sure of the relevance of this post?

[TheDayman]

2 hours ago, bexj said:

With responsibility for several hundred passengers in a hurtling tin can and people that chose to end their lives infront of your cab.   How much would YOU want to do that job?

I don't want to get into the debate on this but felt I needed to point out that a paramedics starting and average wage is lower than a train driver.

[TaylorT]

Is there any word on talks or negotiations happenin yet?? 
 

 

[Euphoricape]

3 minutes ago, TaylorT said:

Is there any word on talks or negotiations happenin yet?? 
 

 

Talks planned in the next few days apparently. No idea how likely a deal is though, but fingers crossed 🤞🤞🤞

[TaylorT]

2 minutes ago, Euphoricape said:

Talks planned in the next few days apparently. No idea how likely a deal is though, but fingers crossed 🤞🤞🤞

We can only hope then and that they can get the deal they want and deserve and everyone can crack on with life. 

[clarkete]

24 minutes ago, TheDayman said:

I don't want to get into the debate on this but felt I needed to point out that a paramedics starting and average wage is lower than a train driver.

They're not mutually exclusive, so many of us want to see them both given adequate recompense - along with many other workers. 

[a6l6e6x]

Do we think this will disrupt trains at all on the Wednesday 

[Euphoricape]

1 minute ago, a6l6e6x said:

Do we think this will disrupt trains at all on the Wednesday 

I'm really hoping not too much. I'm catching a 7.05 train from cornwall which is on the main line to Paddington so I'm confident that train will be running okay, but it's changing at taunton I'm concerned about as it's not a main line from Taunton to castle cary. Surely they will have to put something in place or else thousands of us Glastonbury goers will be stranded there..