Crowd control issues

[Miss_Boo]

I love Glastonbury but the queues/crowd issues were something else this year. 75% of the time I couldn’t get a drink, couldn’t get any food, couldn’t get to a toilet, couldn’t get to see the band I wanted to! It was a joke… it felt so much busier this year than other years. Like many pp have said, it felt dangerous at some points. Half the time I just couldn’t be arsed to keep fighting my way through everything and just sacked off my plans and went elsewhere. 
 

The crowd seemed much more edgy too, less people there with good intentions wanting to have a good time. So many people pushing in everywhere, no respect for anyone around them. I went to Lost Horizons (a really chill, clothing optional, hippy place!) and there were groups of youths in their little caps and man bags in there pushing in front of everyone for the showers. Total piss take. It’s definitely attracting the wrong type of festival-goer these days, sadly. 

[sisco]

So having just returned here are my thoughts from what I say:

* 100% felt much busier and it didn’t feel that it had extra space to deal with it efficiently

* Thursday is a huge problem and needs a rethink.  Everyone crammed into a couple of spaces just doesn’t work at all.  

* The legend spot also needs some sort of competition that takes people away to the Other main stages.  It was absolutely horrendous trying to get anywhere (same for Kylie)

That’s all… the rest was all fine to me, I expect to have to queue for Drinks/Toilets/Food at festivals and events.  That’s never going to be solved.  

[MrBarry465]

8 minutes ago, Miss_Boo said:

I love Glastonbury but the queues/crowd issues were something else this year. 75% of the time I couldn’t get a drink, couldn’t get any food, couldn’t get to a toilet, couldn’t get to see the band I wanted to! It was a joke… it felt so much busier this year than other years. Like many pp have said, it felt dangerous at some points. Half the time I just couldn’t be arsed to keep fighting my way through everything and just sacked off my plans and went elsewhere. 
 

The crowd seemed much more edgy too, less people there with good intentions wanting to have a good time. So many people pushing in everywhere, no respect for anyone around them. I went to Lost Horizons (a really chill, clothing optional, hippy place!) and there were groups of youths in their little caps and man bags in there pushing in front of everyone for the showers. Total piss take. It’s definitely attracting the wrong type of festival-goer these days, sadly. 

Is this a sign of the times? In my experience a lot of people are just acting much more like self centred pricks these days and seem to have forgotten tyhat their actions impact those around them as well.

[jparx]

Just to say on my above comment and talk of demographics, I didn’t think there was a particular issue with age or where people were from. The aggressive crowd issue wasn’t exclusive to certain groups.

And in my experience this weekend scousers were the most sound of the lot! And that’s from a City fan 😉😅

Edited June 27, 2022 by jparx

[foolee]

12 minutes ago, Miss_Boo said:

I love Glastonbury but the queues/crowd issues were something else this year. 75% of the time I couldn’t get a drink, couldn’t get any food, couldn’t get to a toilet, couldn’t get to see the band I wanted to! It was a joke… it felt so much busier this year than other years. Like many pp have said, it felt dangerous at some points. Half the time I just couldn’t be arsed to keep fighting my way through everything and just sacked off my plans and went elsewhere. 
 

The crowd seemed much more edgy too, less people there with good intentions wanting to have a good time. So many people pushing in everywhere, no respect for anyone around them. I went to Lost Horizons (a really chill, clothing optional, hippy place!) and there were groups of youths in their little caps and man bags in there pushing in front of everyone for the showers. Total piss take. It’s definitely attracting the wrong type of festival-goer these days, sadly. 

Didn’t go to Glastonbury this year but since covid I’ve been to a lot of gigs and festivals and I feel it’s more of a reflection of post covid and people forgetting/not knowing how to act around people as I swear there seems to be more rude and generally disrespectful people around atm. Not sure what anyone else’s thoughts on this are? 

[jparx]

9 minutes ago, sisco said:

So having just returned here are my thoughts from what I say:

* 100% felt much busier and it didn’t feel that it had extra space to deal with it efficiently

* Thursday is a huge problem and needs a rethink.  Everyone crammed into a couple of spaces just doesn’t work at all.  

* The legend spot also needs some sort of competition that takes people away to the Other main stages.  It was absolutely horrendous trying to get anywhere (same for Kylie)

That’s all… the rest was all fine to me, I expect to have to queue for Drinks/Toilets/Food at festivals and events.  That’s never going to be solved.  

Totally agree with all this. Don’t really care about queues, and I take my own booze so it’s only the loo that affects me (and really, if you don’t join the queue at the first bank of long drops and move further in, it’s normally much quicker anyway…)

But yes, Thursday needs going back to the drawing board (sack off Williams Green that night, or open up some more main stages), I’d vote to scrap secret sets and the legend needs better counter programming. Unfortunately re: legend though, I think they get off a bit of having those massive crowd shots in the afternoon! Which is fine for the tele but not necessarily if you’re there

Edited June 27, 2022 by jparx

[Glastonlocal]

A few counterpoints, as i think this thread needs a bit of balance:

On Thursday, I had a wonderful evening at strummerville, the stone circle, glasto latino and the circus tent. No major crowds. The stone circle had a load of drummers, fires, and no kids doing NOS - it was like being there 20 years ago. 

Around the pyramid i found access to be comparatively easy and had no problems getting in or out. I noticed a lack of long chains of 16 year old girls pushing past (what happened to them?). 

I went to Arcadia on Friday when it was very busy getting there. Seeing the crowds, went through the other stage and round the back to enter. Easy access and not too full in the field. 

There are lots of people on the farm and there are moments where lots of people are trying to get from a to b at the same time. But if you wait a bit when its busy, think about alternative routes, and avoid the major over-demand (ie Williams Green on a Thursday), then it was completely fine in my view. 

[Mich1268]

This was my six festival. This time the crowds made me change my plans dramatically and there was lots I missed out on. Staying at Sticklinch was such a pain, having to get through the crowds at Park/Arcadia crossroads every night made the journey back terrible. We normally drive home after Sunday headliner but drove back early to watch Kendrick at home as we could not bare the over an hour walk back before getting in the car. 285 quid is a lot of money. If I get tickets next year and end up seeing and doing so little of what I want, not sure I will try for 2024. 

[Rose-Colored Boy]

18 minutes ago, foolee said:

Didn’t go to Glastonbury this year but since covid I’ve been to a lot of gigs and festivals and I feel it’s more of a reflection of post covid and people forgetting/not knowing how to act around people as I swear there seems to be more rude and generally disrespectful people around atm. Not sure what anyone else’s thoughts on this are? 

I work in a public facing role in a different industry and it’s exactly the same. Very noticeable uptick in anti-social behaviour and general rudeness since the pandemic. 

Edited June 27, 2022 by Rose-Colored Boy

[jontykint]

41 minutes ago, prog seller said:

 

The issue is the size of the venue + people attending. It was ridiculous, I wrote this on Sat after having a think about my first ever Glasto: 

Not being a massive band geek, there were a few names on the lineup I was interested in, unfortunatley, those DJ slots were missed due to the nightmare that was Arcadia. I lost friends/ couldn't meet (or move) at the Glade Thursday night, fought slow moving crowds trying to get out of TLC/ West Holts before they started, and spent the rest of the festival avoiding such things. 

Whilst I have had a cracking festival, feeling forced into other areas due to not wanting to shove my way through a ridiculous amount of people, I don't feel that I'll be going again. 

 

I thought the park/sign was going to be empty, then i found these two pics online..Theres no acts on here  

That could have been the wet leg crowd I think 

[jump]

So for the first time ever there were drugs like cocaine at the festival, there weren't enough smiles particularly from the women and all the scousers must have jumped the fence?

[foolee]

14 minutes ago, Glastonlocal said:

A few counterpoints, as i think this thread needs a bit of balance:

On Thursday, I had a wonderful evening at strummerville, the stone circle, glasto latino and the circus tent. No major crowds. The stone circle had a load of drummers, fires, and no kids doing NOS - it was like being there 20 years ago. 

Around the pyramid i found access to be comparatively easy and had no problems getting in or out. I noticed a lack of long chains of 16 year old girls pushing past (what happened to them?). 

I went to Arcadia on Friday when it was very busy getting there. Seeing the crowds, went through the other stage and round the back to enter. Easy access and not too full in the field. 

There are lots of people on the farm and there are moments where lots of people are trying to get from a to b at the same time. But if you wait a bit when its busy, think about alternative routes, and avoid the major over-demand (ie Williams Green on a Thursday), then it was completely fine in my view. 

Think this sums it up. Obviously I didn’t go this year so I can’t comment too much but it’s above avoiding the bottlenecks as much as possible. In 2019 we went down to Williams Green on the Thursday and up to the park for the sunset on the Wednesday and both were far too busy so we left and checked other parts of the site out and really enjoyed our time/festival. 

[DeanoL]

19 hours ago, BBC7BBCHEAVEN said:

Very glad I left before the end of sports team

Feels like there's a giant mob just moving between the big names this year. Convinced the Tories sent tickets out to voters

That feels like a programming issue. The mob should be able to stay at the pyramid and see all the big names.

17 hours ago, Rose-Colored Boy said:

Don’t know why people bother standing behind the sound stages, surely just go to see someone else 😆 

You can see the screens. Being able to get a glimpse of a tiny head occasionally between the flags if you're that far back anyway doesn't really appeal!

[Billy Corgans hair]

45 minutes ago, jparx said:

 More aggressive people, more people disinterested in the music and more interested in just getting wasted (the amount of people taking coke and then just standing there lifeless talking to their mates and not even barely dancing was bizarre..) and less consideration for others.

 

This is exactly it. It felt like have the crowd weren't there to see any music, all they wanted was to sniff some gear and have a chat.

And those who are complaining about the use of the word Tory I apologise. Our group use it to describe the narcissistic, baghead, w*nkers who would throw you under a poo tractor to get a yard closer to the stage. I mean if the boot fits....

[Alex DeLarge]

51 minutes ago, Dave_c said:

It's a very left wing attitude to hate people with different views

Thanks for the irony there mate, I needed a laugh 

[REDLA]

21 minutes ago, jump said:

So for the first time ever there were drugs like cocaine at the festival, there weren't enough smiles particularly from the women and all the scousers must have jumped the fence?

We had scousers turn up on Friday at pennard hill. Sunday morning they got taken away by security for stealing personal belongings and not having a ticket (they had black wristbands on)

 

No idea how they got in, but I think some of the crowd issues might have been because of people sneaking in somehow.

[SouthbanKen]

2 hours ago, Barry Fish said:

Reading the comments though thah wouldn't of worked as you had waves pushing in and out so if you stayed you would be stuck.  All a bit impossible and dangerous.  Clearly too many people on site 

It’s not though. You have to be a little bit thoughtful and sometimes selective about who you see as others have said. 

Wet Leg on Park with no competition was always gonna be busy - so we gave it a miss. 

williams green on the Thursday or McFlu on Avalon - no chance we were gonna be there - predictable crush 

We were in between the Park and Arcadia on Friday night as that crush formed, I noticed it was getting busier, looked at my watch - realised the headliners were finishing and that this was gonna be a shit show pronto - so we looked around and took the nearest exit to the quietest location and got out before it got bad. 
 

Arcadia for Calvin. Left Macca early - positioned top right and wandered through silver Hayes and up the short cut. No crowd - no crush - just a shame Arcadia sound system is shit but that’s a different thread. 

DiRo was always gonna be busy - we go there late so we went up the hill to watch. 
 

I get that this might not be what everyone wants to do, but you take the rough with the smooth - just a little bit of planning, thought and flexibility means you can avoid most of the really bad crushes. 

[Rose-Colored Boy]

1 minute ago, SouthbanKen said:

It’s not though. You have to be a little bit thoughtful and sometimes selective about who you see as others have said. 

Wet Leg on Park with no competition was always gonna be busy - so we gave it a miss. 

williams green on the Thursday or McFlu on Avalon - no chance we were gonna be there - predictable crush 

We were in between the Park and Arcadia on Friday night as that crush formed, I noticed it was getting busier, looked at my watch - realised the headliners were finishing and that this was gonna be a shit show pronto - so we looked around and took the nearest exit to the quietest location and got out before it got bad. 
 

Arcadia for Calvin. Left Macca early - positioned top right and wandered through silver Hayes and up the short cut. No crowd - no crush - just a shame Arcadia sound system is shit but that’s a different thread. 

DiRo was always gonna be busy - we go there late so we went up the hill to watch. 
 

I get that this might not be what everyone wants to do, but you take the rough with the smooth - just a little bit of planning, thought and flexibility means you can avoid most of the really bad crushes. 

But it shouldn’t be the case that people have to miss out on half of what they want to do for fear of crushes. That’s the whole point. If we followed your logic to its natural conclusion then the safest thing to do is just not attend at all. 

[Yokel Again]

Felt similar to recent years to me. The top of the Pyramid on Sunday gets very uncomfortable.

 

[SouthbanKen]

7 minutes ago, Rose-Colored Boy said:

But it shouldn’t be the case that people have to miss out on half of what they want to do for fear of crushes. That’s the whole point. If we followed your logic to its natural conclusion then the safest thing to do is just not attend at all. 

Everyone at Glasto has to miss out on something they want to do for one reason or another. It’s why the biggest recurring tip pre fest is to choose one or two must sees per day and then go with the flow.
 

The other option / tactic I didn’t talk about above is for your “must sees” and that id to get there early (the busier you expect it to be - the earlier you wanna get there) - We really wanted to get a decent spot for Macca - so we got there for before Noel with a few mates - as Noel started a couple of us wandered off for beers and a piss and food - missing all his HFB tracks - got back for a lovely Oasis sing along and in a good spot for Macca. Most of the group stayed to the end of Macca and as is standard for us after a headliner - chill there for 30 minutes or so and wait for the crowd to dissipate a bit before heading on somewhere else. Others myself included left early to head up to Arcadia. 

 

So if you really want to see Wet Leg or McFly or whoever - you get there an hour early and then wait for the crowd to smooth out at the end before you leave.

It’s an event with 200,000 people - you have to make compromises - your options for the massive crowd pullers are:

1. get there early and leave late

2. Get there at a normal time but fight through crushes 

3. Do something else entirely 

Sure none of the above are perfect but, shit son, life ain’t perfect. 

 

[Zoo Music Girl]

49 minutes ago, Rose-Colored Boy said:

I work in a public facing role in a different industry and it’s exactly the same. Very noticeable uptick in anti-social behaviour and general rudeness since the pandemic. 

It's really sad that this has been the outcome. Remember the early days of the pandemic when everyone was saying this would bring people together? Utter bollocks.

Sad to see all the problems with crowding. I've been accepting over the past few Glastonburys that I might need to modify my time there a bit more to see less music and do more other stuff in the less busy areas and this makes me think that all the more. But the music is great and seeing so much of it on TV this year has given me massive FOMO. Still it's a different story being to flick easily between channels instead of hiking through crowds.

I'm super eager to try for tickets still. Will see how I feel about it this time next year (if all goes to plan!).

[kalifire]

By Saturday, I had changed how I do the festival to cope with the crowd issues. Abandoned even trying to see the big sets (Macca, D-Ro) to go and enjoy something on smaller stages. It was actually quite fun to do it this way, but doesn’t solve the problem.

Thursday was an absolute train wreck and every day felt like the Sunday in usual years when thousands locals get in. It was uncomfortable and pretty dodgy sometimes. 

Totally agree that if they let this many people in, they’re going to need to figure out a Pyramid exit strategy because it’s only a matter of time until something serious happens. 

As for the type of crowd, I didn’t get the impression it had changed much. Lots of pushing through to the front sections but that’s always been the case. I kept back fro the majority of the time anyway - still find dense crowds quite confronting. 

[dan05delaney]

I work in live events and crowd management and there are a few noticeable things over the past 9 months since large-scale events have started again which will help manage expectations. 

There has been a large scale loss of knowledge and experience within the industry, and whilst there might be documentation to tell people how to implement the operational plan on the ground experience will have gone. This can then be combined with a lot of new people to the industry and companies being stretched and sub-contracting beyond all belief, I had messages on Friday asking could I work / supply staff to do the Saturday and Sunday and I was being offered £11ph wanting me to then pay £9.50ph (making £18 profit per person for a 12 hour shift), thats for staff working as SIA's, no one in their right mind will accept that at the moment with large events at most cities where SIA staff are then working for the highest bidder. 

People have forgotten what it's like being in a large crowd (People have generally forgotten how to act at events in general, people have just become D!cks over the past few years we had a brawl at a Diana Ross gig during her normal arena shows recently... like people need to chill out and just be more considerate, studying how people flow around a venue and stand watching a show there are subtle changes, people are wanting more space than in years gone by, on average a you'd be looking at around 4 - 5 people per square meter Max for a crowd being stood watching with about 4 people per meter being the accepted number for people moving in a crowd, most people now just don't want to be that close to each other which means crowds just take up more space than before. 

Another aspect is recency bias within the fact its been 3 years since the last festival, most of the issues people felt this weekend would've been there last festival but we choose not to remember those parts, I've seen fights around Arcadia before, Cocaine being snorted for fun at the Pyramid and horrendous crowds, 2019 Pale Waves had a crazy crowd and I remember years back 1975 having a crazy crowd and the set being stopped because of a fight. 

A lot of large festivals this year will have both a lot of remembering of how to do things for experience staff and then a whole new world for any staff working, there will be learnings for everyone and hopefully next year the improvements will be noticeable 

 

Edited June 27, 2022 by dan05delaney

[Chip Batch]

The park / Arcadia crush sounds scary and anyone caught up in anything bad has my sympathy. 
 

Some of this is pretty predictable though and this was my first since 2016. Whatever they put on WG is always rammed every Thursday evening. So I didn’t bother going. There’s no enjoyment to being packed in crowds like that just to see or hear a glimpse of something you might like. I can’t be arsed. 
 

I wanted to see Wet Leg, but couldn’t get near it. So just went up to the Crow’s Nest instead. Sometimes you have to accept that you can’t see everything you want to if it’s massively popular. Same goes for TLC, McFly and anything else that had these issues. I wasn’t interested in those. I reluctantly went to Diana Ross and that wasn’t as bad to get in and out as I thought it would be. If it was I’d already said to my group I’d give it a miss and go to Fontaines. 

It’s not always easy for them to get to the stage and acts matched up. Sugababes and McFly in Avalon seemed a bit predictably too big though. 
 

Are there more numbers on site now? I didn’t notice myself. 

Edited June 27, 2022 by Chip Batch

[willgooneday]

The COVID effect is probably the biggest one. There's been reports at some other big tours this year of issues with regards to it.

People have forgotten how to act in crowds, or any public spaces where there's others around. Decades of understanding of having to wait, crowd etiquette and gig culture seem to have evaporated.

A lot of young people's first gigs are now festivals and outdoor stadium concerts because their only bothered about the biggest bands or just tagging along with mates to get fucked, whereas in years gone by they'd have gone to local gigs much more.